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1995 E320 wagon
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Discussion Starter #1
Coudnt stand the archaic 4 speed 722.3 that was in my E320 wagon, and when it came to the C36 motor upgrade it made its short comings more obvious. So in went a 722.6 with the OF Gear controller. Well, it was ok. Im personally not a fan of the controller. Menu is clunky, the PC interface was ok but reflash for minor changes or any changes was time consuming. I was never happy with the shift quality and in the end it just wasnt for me. And with the 3.6, a 5 speed was really the only choice. Its what I should have done before. So

Flywheel for a 190e 2.6, this has the 3 timing windows, a 9" clutch and no trigger magnet. Ordered from Mercedes, came from Germany. Easy to get. Yes, the M104 needs a trigger magnet, so it will be harvested from the auto flexplate and put in the manual flywheel. Should be pretty straight forward.

Clutch is sourced from the 16v 190e. 9" sachs clutch kit complete, also easy to get, but it was the last one at rock auto haha. I found the M103 9" Valeo version for the same price, but the sachs came with an alignment tool and the pilot bearing. The pilot bearing spacer and flywheel bolts were also ordered from the dealer.

The trans shifter and rods are form a 190D 2.2. They need to be extended 1" for a W124, so Im doing that with some creative hardware to avoid cutting and welding. The trans is the 717.410 Yeah its the weakest of the boxes, theoretically. There really is no torque rating on any of these. But I got everything from the guy selling it including the matching shifter, shift rods, crossmember, an 8" flywheel and clutch (which is for sale haha) and all the bolts and bits, with the driveshaft. I wont be using the small coupler on the driveshaft however. My logic is I dont know the condition of this transmission. If its trashed I want to be able to use the 411 or worst case a dog leg box. (dont wanna pay the $$ for that box, I dont beat on my cars, it shouldnt need it) So i want the driveshaft to be a 1 time modification as I have to get mine lengthened and rebuilt. I saw a guy put the larger flange and guibo on a 717.410 so with some careful filing to clear bolts and what not it shouldnt be an issue. Mercedes drive flange fun fact, they seem to be all interchangeable from the auto to the manual and vice versa. The flange from my 722.3 auto slips right on the 717.410 5 speed. Go figure haha. And the shifter boot retainer, the plastic retainer I have intact! This is a NLA part from benz so Im happy about that. I have a shift knob I think will work well before I shell out 60$ for a new one, and the boot was cheep from overseas.

And the speedo. Only bummer bout the old trans is someone must have pulled the cable really hard and snapped the little part of the housing that clamps around the cable where it goes into the trans. No biggie, it can be remedied with some creativeness, as the threads are all still intact. But since I already converted to the electronic speedo and matched the mileage for the 722.6, and I know the gear in the 5 speed will be off as far as calibration, and I dont have a cable anyway Im gonna keep it electronic and use a dakota digital SGI5e. This will take any signal in and give you a signal out for an electronic speedo. Ive already tapped into the rear abs sensor for VSS for the trans controller, now that will just feed the SGI5 and then the speedo.

Thats the plan. Benz 5 speed info and parts availability is out there, but what a cluster EFF of info and what not. So what I know to be true....
the 3.0 M103 had a 9.5" clutch, the 2.6L and some of the 16v M102s had 9" clutch. These were all single mass flywheels. The M104 so far as I can mostly all had a dual mass flywheel. The transmission are all interchangeable but you have to mind the input shaft. Long shaft = Single mass flywheel. Short shaft = Dual mass flywheel. As long as you have the clutch size the same 9", 9.5, 8.5 what ever the application they should all interchange if its a SMF or a DMF respectively. The input shaft splines are all the same on the SMF long shaft. And you can use a small diameter guibo, if you get a Lemforder and only a Lemforder.

I am still waiting for flywheel bolts, pilot bearing spacer, the clutch, shifter bushings and what not. New clutch master and slave I already have. Gonna yank the trans, install the manual temporarily, check the shifter and linkages, measure the drive shaft and get that cut. Then while the shaft is being lengthened put in the clutch flywheel and what not, and fingers crossed it dosnt have marbles in the trans and all 5 gears are there haha.








 

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Hopefully I'm wrong, but that appears to be, and according to the part# stamp and your tape measure is, a 300E flywheel that requires 240mm/9.5" clutch. Part# for the flywheel compatible with the 228mm/9" clutch kit you have on order is 103 030 12 05.

If the above is correct, the clutch kit you'll need is Sachs 3000 113 002. None were in US when I needed one a year ago.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
It's 9.5" exactly. If the disc is 9.5" it would be a precision fit with no room to move, a 9 inch clutch in this flywheel would leave 1/4" around the edges which would be correct. I had the same thoughts and saw people say the part number is 12 05, and the other way around as well, this is where a lot of confusion came from. The Benz site I ordered from showed this flywheel was for a 2.6, and the clutch part numbers that matched should be a 9" clutch. The flywheel I have from the 190d has an 8.5" surface area, but it has an 8" clutch. I'm pretty confident I'm ok with this part number, and yeah this was a lot of the confusion. But with a perfect 9.5" surface area, I'm confident this is for a 9" clutch. As long as the disc is not hanging over at all it should be fine. We shall see when I get the clutch next week.

Mark
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Progress. Auto trans out. Back of the manual trans resealed. Also there is no way I can grind enough of the back of that trans for the larger flange and driveshaft coupler. So the small one it will be, Gotta order a lemforder. I did get the trans bolted up temporarily so I could measure for the drive shaft. And I got the flywheel setup for the magnet. Removed it from the flex plate and got it all lined up. Modified the bracket to hold it in, just gotta get a bottoming tap and a small screw to hold it. Also cut the timing windows to match. Im not sure how much it matters, being long on the one end, I think it was the trailing end, but I dont wanna have any issues.

The W124 auto trans cross member and the manual W201 cross member dont work, not even close. So im gonna modify the auto box cross member to work. Should be pretty straight forward. Just gonna make a tongue to stick out an hold the mount. Funny thing, the trans is so much lighter than the auto that came out, even with it bolted on the back of the motor it doesn't droop much. It probably will when I get the flywheel and clutch on. Driveshaft shop Monday, new flywheel bolts Friday, fingers crossed Saturday she will run again.











 

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Discussion Starter #5
And who has info on the clutch switch? I can tie it into the brake switch for the cruise control, but Im pretty sure it should feed the ECU as well, any idea on what pin or how that should connect?? Anyone have a euro wiring diagram for the HFM or CC/ISC?
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Made a quick piece for the trans mount. 1/4" flat bar. Need to weld a little tab on it so it wont twist, and I may widen it under the trans, but easy peazy. It looks cheezy but no way is that thing gonna bend. Also checked the shifter and rod lengths since everything I read said they would be short by an inch. Well not so much. 2 of em only needed a few turns and the other needed 4 or 5 turns. Still plenty of adjustment on all of them, so that was nice. Also I have a shifter knob im gonna use. Since I had an older stock shift knob all torn up I can use its insides for different thread on knob. What does suck though is the shifter boot plastic. The W201 console wood has a smaller hole than the W124, so it doesnt fit right. Gotta make something custom there.

Pedal bucket is prepped too. New master cylinder and modified the brake switch hole to accept the E320 brake switch because its a 2 circuit switch. I could have picked up a GM switch that would have worked without issue, but this was just a few minutes with a file to make it fit. The copper washer is there to take up some space so it fits more snug. Its not going anywhere though. A difference to note about actuating the brake switch on the W201 pedal bucket vs the W124 pedal bucket. There is a tab welded to the brake pedal on the W124, and the tab is part of the pin that is for the brake pedal. Either way easy to make it work. Bolted in no issue. I totally forgot about getting the hose to feed the stupid master cylinder. I dont have any, I need to see if local chain stores have it (prolly not)













 

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If you get a later W124 console wood with the small hole for auto shifter you can use a W202 shift boot. I got a cheap Chinese W202 shift boot and harvested the retainer ring to use with an aftermarket leather shift boot because the ring itself is NLA separately.

Brave move to modify the timing windows. Personally I'd be concerned with throwing the balance off when you consider how little has been drilled out of the inertia ring to balance it. Maybe not an issue, I dunno.

I'm pretty sure the manual W124 trans x-member is available and not very expensive. But that is an interesting solution, though. Will probably have to do something similar on the C36 manual swap because the 202 trans mount is different than the W201/124 style that is on the trans and will not mate without some ingenuity.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
I woul bet the clutch throws it out of balance more than the little bit i removed. But if its an issue ill deal with it, didnt really take much off. And I didnt have much of an option with the flywheel as far as the timing windows go. I made sure the bolt holes were lined up so im not too worried about it. Ive read about guys cutting the timing windows off the flex plate to weld them to a flywheel, that seems a lot more of a PITA haha. Im pretty confident it will be fine like this. Not much as far as junk yards around here with W124 in em that dont have wood thats totally trashed. I have a cheep chinese boot coming, hopefully there is enough stretch in it, Ive got a few idea for a retainer ring.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Fail on my part. I ordered an M102 16v 9" clutch kit for my m103 2.6 flywheel. And we'll that won't work. So now I have the correct (hopefully) m103 2.6 clutch coming. All as separate parts, that's so annoying. Espically when they are all Sachs parts to start with. Why can't I just buy a Sachs kit? Out. Hopefully this will keep me moving. Pedals Installed. And FYI, put the hose on the clutch master before putting it all in, cause you can't get to the hole once the pedals are in.

Flywheel done. Blind threaded a hole for the screw. Loctite and it should stay in there.


Driveshaft dropped off today, waiting on a clutch and flywheel bolts and the pilot bearing spacer. Such a gamble on weather any of this stuff will work together. It should, but untill the car runs it feels like a crap shoot
 

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89 190E2.6- 5-speed Manual, 95 E320 Sportsline-sold, 2001 E320 4matic Wagon-sold
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I'm wondering for future use, if it is best/easiest for manual swappers who know the exact model of the donor vehicle to just go to the Dealer and buy all these parts (or at least get the proper part numbers).

I have a manual original W201 2.6 and just went to the dealer to purchase all the parts needed for a clutch job for future use. That way all the parts are 100% correct for sure.
BTW my pressure plate and friction plate from the dealer are just Sachs for 20% more money but you do not have to buy them there, they will gladly give you a parts list for free.

I bit late now but I could have given you my VIN number for this. Maybe it will help the next person who is doing a swap to go this path.

Good luck with the build, I much prefer the manuals to automatics in the W201/W124, and I have owned both variety.

- Cheers!
 

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Discussion Starter #11
I took a chance ordering the clutch I did. Which I did cause of cost and the fact it was a complete kit. So that's all on me. Normally I would have sourced the correct matching parts off the bat. Either way that's the path I'm on now. It's hard to just order the right parts for some of these cats in the us cause they were never sold here as anything but an autobox. And some guys don't wanna run the dual mass flywheel, I'm one of those guys. So that means sourcing alternative parts. And some of this stuff is unavailable too now so it just makes things harder. Haha it's all good, just frustrating and a stupid mistake
 

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AFAIK 16V and single mass 2.6L W201 share clutches, such that when a friend recently ordered a dual mass clutch for his factory 5-spd 2.6 with single mass flywheel I gave him part no for 16V clutch kit and it went in no prob. 16V I think had an all metal throwout bearing and perhaps uprated springs on press plate, but dimensionally they are the same.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
The kit I got didn't work, pressure plate bolt holes didn't line up. And the dish in a flywheel was too deep. There was no pressure on the disc at all there's no way it would work. That doesn't mean I didn't get the wrong one. But now I have all the correct parts ordered at least according to Mercedes
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Fail, and it's of my own doing. Though I'm surprised and not surprised the dealers websites I've been using sent always accurate. The second clutch, part numbers match an m103 2.6 don't fit. And they don't fit in the se way the 16v clutch doesn't fit. So partnuber187, your right. I do have a 9.5 inch flywheel. Working on another source for the clutch. Hopefully I'll have more I do Thursday, as with the new years everyone's hours are short
 

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Discussion Starter #15
At least I got a few things done. Trans all cleaned up, throw out bearing, slave and lines installed. Shifter rebuilt. Got a PTFE (derelin) bushing kit. The rubber bushings in the shifter were trashed, and the grease was like glue. A full tear down, cleaning and reassembly with new bushings it seems pretty happy. Id love to make this a short shifter but I dont wanna do anything just yet beyond just making it work. Also got a shifter knob I've had lying around setup for the shifter. Cut the stock knob off the sleeve, and cut off the top of the sleeve. Put a piece of all thread in and tach welded it to the sleeve, screwed the knob to the top. Easy peezy. And yeah, it lights up, I dont care how ricey someone might think it is, OEMs light up everything now. And this is simple and classy. I wish it was a more natural white instead of blue, and it snot as super bight as it looks in the pic, its just bright enough. The driveshaft I got back today, fits perfectly.

I am curios too how different the internals are for a dog leg shifter, cant be much different.

And the clutch. I have a local performance clutch place that didnt have one on the shelf, and his suppliers were closed when I called. So ill know Thursday where I stand with a clutch. I have a few other places I can call too. Im committed to the 9.5" clutch now. And Ill be using an organic disc with a slighty uprated pressure plate. Prolly just a bit stiffer diaphragm spring. No way can I return the flywheel, I couldn't to begin with as it was special ordered from germany. And since I modified it, well im defiantly stuck with it.

Once the clutch is in, and the flywheel bolts in a few days Ill be good to button this up.



























 

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Well at least now you know. It was your measurement that made me verify the part no in EPC that it was a 300E flywheel. I have the same one in my W201 along with 300E .430 trans. The Sachs part no posted previously is the correct clutch kit you will need. LuK part no is 11-025. Amazon showed that one available, but when I placed the order delivery date changed from under a week to something like anywhere between two to three months. I called a few shops that showed it online and none were in stock anywhere in the US. So I cancelled that bullshit and ordered the Sachs from Autodoc. FYI, pilot bearing and alignment tool weren't included if you do buy the Sachs kit.

Happy new year, everyone.
 

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Discussion Starter #17
I should have listened. Thanks for the Info dude. Looks like I found a place uk I can snag one reasonably. I have a throwout and pilot bearing. I'll prolly order it up tomorrow.
 

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I think all those online UK parts houses are online store fronts for Autodoc. IIRC it was bestparts.co.uk or some such I placed the order for the clutch kit through. Contact was made with me by Autodoc and I had to call them a few times because they wanted VIN and car info to verify parts compatibility and an explanation for why my shipping address was different than billing. If the shipping policy is still the same it's about $100 flat rate, so look through their catalog for anything you might also want to throw on the order. I got a few sets of cheap Euro amber corner lenses to give to friends for Xmas gifts.

Another thing that may be helpful is that you can get a clutch alignment tool from any local parts store for a few bucks because the input shaft is same spline count and diameter as Chevy.
 

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Discussion Starter #19
Found it on eBay shipping out of the UK. Price is reasonable so I pushed go. Ok protected with eBay and PayPal so should be good. I double checked the part number as best as I could and it looks right. I've eyeballed clutched without the alignment tool and been on installing em. But good info on the Chevy tool, I may just grab one
 

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Discussion Starter #20
I get stuff faster from the UK that I do 1 state over haha. Genuine Sachs clutch for a 300e, fits the flywheel perfectly. And a super sweet Lemforder driveshaft coupler, hard solid disk. I hope it holds up. This weekend she will be back on the ground, finally!



 
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