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1998 W210 E250 Turbodiesel
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Discussion Starter #61
Do you know the part number for your climate controller ?

item 43 = 72 is not really a valid number for W210. Is it pulled from a W140 ? It seems to be programmed to work in a W140.
Well noticed! My stock controller is "210 830 22 85" and I bought a used part "210 830 23 85" (although the auction said it was "210 830 22 85"...).
However, it works well! (I mean, just like the stock one).
 

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1998 E320 base sedan @ 160kmiles
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It will behave like the stock one as the settings for the version coding P1 is 72 in both cases.

The only difference between them is P2, which is 152 for the old one (refrigerant fill level check is switched off) and 136 (refrigerant fill level check is switched on) for the new one. If your refrigerant level is fine this should not matter.

The valid values for P1 is 8, if your car has aux fans in front of the radiator and k1 + K2 signaling with the Instrument Cluster, and 40, if has an electric radiator fan with K1+K2 signaling.

Both P1 and P2 are basically bit patterns, telling the controller how it should behave.

For P1:

0000 1000 = 8
0010 1000 = 40
0100 1000 = 72

So the setting of the second bit from the left seems to tell the controller it is for W140.

So if your car is a W210, and has aux fans, I would suggest that you try setting of 8 for the P1 and see what happens. If you have electric fan set the P1 to 40. If this does not work, you can always set it back to 72 if you want.

Here are the instructions on how to change the version coding for the W210.

STAR TekInfo

If you had a W140, the version coding values would be:

STAR TekInfo

Notice 72 is used, instead of 8 for K1 + K2 signaling.

Note: My USA W210 is a 1998 E320, and

my P1 and P2 settings are 8 and 152.
 

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1998 W210 E250 Turbodiesel
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Discussion Starter #63
Thanks mboca, I'll investigate more on that!
I couldn't follow this issue for a long time due to family problems...now the winter is close, so I'd want to try again to give it a fix!
My indy mechanic, who owned one of this models, suggested that it must be one or more broken flap actuators of the ventilation system; he didn't remember their locations by heart, but he told me to look for a diagram and if I am lucky I can replace the faulty ones without removing the dashboard, as some of them can be reached from behind the glove compartment, the ac+radio panel or the footwells.
I played a bit with the controller and I saw that all directional flaps work correctly: whatever vent configuration I select, it is actually deployed!
Further reading on the topic made me discover that one (or two?) of these actuators is used to blend hot+cold air, and it should be part 0132801108. Maybe mine gets stuck easily, so I was thinking that replacing it can be worth the try: does anybody know where is it located?
 

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1998 E320 base sedan @ 160kmiles
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Where did you read that ?

As far as I know, the blend flaps are vacuum operated, not electrical for automatic version of the climate control. Maybe some versions of Tempmatic (the ones with the temp control knobs) have electrical blend flaps. But in the USA, the automatic climate control flaps are all vacuum controlled. The only exception is the smog filter in/out flap which is controlled by a motor.
 

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1998 W210 E250 Turbodiesel
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Discussion Starter #65
Where did you read that ?
Kinda hard to remember!

For what I've personally seen, in my car the actuators are indeed vacuum operated: I saw bundles of those plastic tubes... do you know if there's just one or two blend flaps? In case, where are they located? Are they supplied by the engine's vacuum pump, the PSE pump or a combination of the two? there's a wonderful thread in this forum called "Relationship between intake manifold, PSE pump, and air vents" but unfortunately all photos' links are broken...
 

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1998 E320 base sedan @ 160kmiles
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1998 W210 E250 Turbodiesel
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Discussion Starter #67
thank you for the links, those are gold to me!
So the tempering flap unit is a pneumo-mechanical actuator: if it works like "vacuum applied"="flap opens the WARM passage", I'm getting closer to nail it down!
In case, I'm afraid it can't be created enough vacuum to pull both flaps: it can be due to a crack in a tube, a broken diaphragm in an element...not easy to find out!
What is puzzling is that the other flaps appear to work fine....
I should also check the switchover valve block Y11, which looks like an electro-pneumatic element: do you know where it is located? This is not depicted in the diagrams...
 

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1998 E320 base sedan @ 160kmiles
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The Y11 switchover valve is located behind the glove box.

Over time, I am not sure what has changed in your climate control problem. Could you just explain briefly what the latest status is ?

If you did the flap test and all seem to be fine, I do not think the blend flap is your problem.

Which functional modes your climate control is not working now (based on the link below) ?

https://manual.startekinfo.com/manual/JSP/cc/3_5/m11.jsp

In regulating mode (you set the target temperature, say 25 degrees C), the blending flaps are open so that the heated air through the heater cores can be blended with cold air from the evap core to maintain the target temperature. The cabin air temperature modulation is done by opening and closing of the duo valves, and monitoring the heater core temp sensor values. The blending flaps are either open or closed. This is different from other (newer) models with electrical servo-motor controlled blending flaps to control air volume from the heater cores which have no modulating duo valves.
 

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1998 W210 E250 Turbodiesel
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Discussion Starter #69
I can have heat output only at one side. If I try to have it on both, I have a barely lukewarm air.
If I let the compressor spin, the conditioned air overcomes the lukewarm air and I have a freezing cabin, so I have to hit EC.

In the tests you link, it says that the pass criteria for the defroster are


Blower runs with increased speed.
Air venting from defroster outlets.
A/C compressor engaged.
Maximum heat output, 100% fresh air


I don't know how could one have maximum heat output and 100% fresh air...heat and fresh at the same time?
What I know is that when everything was fine, I had a full blast of hot air to the windscreen.
Now, I have a full blast of super-cold air to the windscreen!
So: the first three checks are passed, the fourth not.
 

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1998 E320 base sedan @ 160kmiles
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I can have heat output only at one side. If I try to have it on both, I have a barely lukewarm air.
Any particular side ? I mean if you apply heat to driver's side only OR passenger side only, the respective side provides heat as required, or only one side provides heat but the other does not ?

Regarding the defrost mode... I guess the algorithm is that the fresh COLD air has less humidity, and it is heated maximally to provide heated dry air. The evaporator takes the humidity out of the incoming fresh air further, and then the air goes through the heater cores to prevent / remove fogging.

Have you replaced the controller unit since last time ?
 

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1998 W210 E250 Turbodiesel
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Discussion Starter #71
no particular side: if I set HI-LO I get heat at the driver side, if I set LO-HI I get heat on the passenger side...if I set HI-HI I get no heat!

I didn't swap the controllers again, it's still the one I bought off ebay. The stock one behaves exactly the same!
 

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Was the one off eBay stated "tested and good"? Same part number? I went thru three from Pick and Pull before I found a good one for my W124. They're all old and going bad.
 

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1998 E320 base sedan @ 160kmiles
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If the auto mode is working (item 3) then, I do not believe blending flaps are the problem.

Did you ever check the voltages on the duovalves when HI - HI ? I know we went through this before but I still think it is something related to coolant circulation issue within the heater cores.

With HI- HI setting, both duovalves must be fully open which means that the solenoids are not energized (you read approx. 12-12-12 on the duovalve interface pins). And also check that the aux coolant pump is energized and running. Did you ever replace the aux pump ? Did you check the hose that goes into it, and out for temperature when set to HI- HI ?

The aux pump receives 12V from the same supply as the duovalves. I believe there is red-black wire that goes to it from the middle pin of the duovalve connector. It is turned on by the controller, but I wonder if the aux pump wiring is fine (low resistance).
 

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Discussion Starter #74
@260e crusier yes it is, and I agree with you that a used part can be faulty: but having the same exact issue of mine is really unlikely!

@mrboca while doing test #3 it outputs very cold air no matter what's the setpoint temperature!
I created this thing to check the voltages at each valve via the mammut clamps:

2610797


and I read 12V when LO is set (energized, hence preventing coolant from flowing) and 0V when HI is set (not energized, hence allowing water flow); unfortunately I don't have an oscilloscope to check the behavior when a temperature is set.

The auxiliary pump is new and works well; the rest function is fine, with a HI-LO setting.

I had a look again behind the glove box and here's what I found:

2610798


I can see an actuator next to the filter box, which doesn't appear in the diagram of startekinfo ; the vacuum lines are there, but the colors don't seem match those in the diagram too (I have pink, purple...)
That actuator indeed looks like part 0132801108: it has a yellow/blue connector, as you can see in the green square of the next picture.
Unfortunately I don't think I can remove it without removing the whole dashboard: only two ouf of three torx screw are easily reachable!

2610799
 

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1998 E320 base sedan @ 160kmiles
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Have you checked the hose temp from the duovalves to the aux coolant pump when it is set HI HI ? First check when it is LO HI, then HI LO then HI HI to see if anything is different.

No idea why the coloring for the vacuum hoses are different but sometimes the colors come out different in the pic than actual. There is magenta/light blue and magenta/white hoses that go to the defroster actuator.

The yellow/ blue wiring goes to an actuator, but I still feel it is the actuator for the charcoal filter air diversion. You can try to listen to any noise as you manually activate the smog filter diversion through the button on the controller next to the recircle button (if your climate control has one)..

In test 3, does the cold air come out of center or side vents ?
 

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Discussion Starter #76
thanks for the extra picture, it is more clear now!
During test 3 the cold air comes out of the side vents.
I'll try to check the temperature of the hose between duovalve and aux pump
 

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1998 E320 base sedan @ 160kmiles
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After you do the temperature check at the duovalve output as above, with the engine is fully warmed up, Turn the engine off with the settings HI HI or some high temperature. Activate the REST function. Will the hot air come from both sides ? I just want to make sure that it is not insufficient vacuum issue (from the air pump, and connecting vacuum lines), when the car is running. When the engine is off, the vacuum comes from the PSE.
 
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