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Discussion Starter #1
First post - currently own an ML-320.

Looking to buy an older W123 but I'm confused that the 'S' cars of the seventies upto 1980 were W116 models. [:0]
Now, what category is a 1980 - 300 SD ???
....and why are most 300D's made from 1980 on classified as W123 models ?

I'm confused because I'm lacking the 'history' of Benz and their model changes. Also, why do some vehicles have 'round' air vent and some 'square' - is that a Euro / US distinction ?

Hope to learn a lot on this forum....[^]
 

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90 300 SE ,85 300 GD
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123 VERSUS 116 DESIGNATION

There were 123 models as early as 1975 in the Model 200 and 200D. Not sold in the USA. The model 220 D in 1976 through 1979 was sold here and was a 123 chassis design. It has as much to do with the engine as it does the outward styling. The 240 D model was next in line and then the 300 D in 1975. Production of the 300 D Turbo began in 1981. To answer your question, there is some overlap. The thing that was improved most importantly was the climate control system. The 116 series was a vastly more complicated system of flaps and vacuum hoses and bellows----not cheap to fix. The best bargains are in the 300 SD Turbo Diesels at this point. The early 300 SD 1977-1980 had the older type climate control. I would try to find the later model 300 SD, 1985-1987, with under 150,000 miles. A good one for $7,000 would last another 150,000 easily. At least 26 miles per gallon city and 30 miles per gallon highway, not bad! This sedan weighs 3780 lbs.
[:D][:D][:D]
 

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First post - currently own an ML-320.

Looking to buy an older W123 but I'm confused that the 'S' cars of the seventies upto 1980 were W116 models. [:0]
Now, what category is a 1980 - 300 SD ???
....and why are most 300D's made from 1980 on classified as W123 models ?

I'm confused because I'm lacking the 'history' of Benz and their model changes. Also, why do some vehicles have 'round' air vent and some 'square' - is that a Euro / US distinction ?

Hope to learn a lot on this forum....[^]
It's very simple really.
The W123 series (build from 1976 to 1985) is one predecessor of the todays E-class.
The W116 series (built from 1972 to 1980) is one predecessor of the todays S-class (but this one was called S-class back then, the W123 wasn't called E-class).

maybe some 'modell-timeline' will help (new to old):

-W211 E-class (2003-...)
W210 E-class (1996-2003)
W124 E-class (1992-1996)
W124 (1986-1992)
W123 (1976-1985)
W115 (196?-1976)(don't know exactly from here on)

-W220 S-class (1998-...)
W140 S-class (1991-1998)
W126 S-class (1979-1982)
W116 S-class (1972-1980)
(don't know exactly anymore from here on[:)])

A 1980 300SD can be a W116 aswell as a W126 series S-class. They have basically the same engines (both 3.0L I5 turbocharched (111-121BHP).

The round and square air vents:
The W115 has square airvents if I'm not mistaking, the W123 has round ones, the W124 has square ones, the W210 has square ones, the W211 has square ones.
The W116 has square airvents, the W126 has square ones, the W140 has square ones, the W220 has 'square' ones.

I've never know about this being a Euro/US spec thing.
Think all the cars are the same inside in the US as in Europe.

hope I've helped you out a bit.

greetzzz

matteus.
 

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The 116's are harder to find then 123's. 116 diesels have turbos and give good economy and...

The 116's are harder to find then 123's. 116 diesels have turbos and give good economy and power. Many 116's also have DOHC gas sixes, 4.5 gas v-8s, and the legendary 6.9 V-8. But the diesels are the most practical.

I called awhile back on a 6.9 for $3500, probobly lucky they did not return phone calls...

Nice examples of the 116 diesel are tough to find or even see. 116 diesel owner always get a hearty wave when I see one.
John Gregg
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Re: 123 VERSUS 116 DESIGNATION

....I would try to find the later model 300 SD, 1985-1987, with under 150,000 miles. A good one for $7,000 would last another 150,000 easily. At least 26 miles per gallon city and 30 miles per gallon highway, not bad! This sedan weighs 3780 lbs.
[:D][:D][:D]

[:D]Thanks guys for the vast amount of information - I'm narrowing my scope to a mid-80's W123 Diesel but won't rule out an older W116 if it's very, very clean and well kept. [^]
 

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I am thinning out the heard in Dallas. Have 11 Mercedes mostly diesels. Wife was not as pl...

I am thinning out the heard in Dallas. Have 11 Mercedes mostly diesels. Wife was not as pleased as myself and daughter were when bringing home 78 280CE gas number #2 condition. Also a rare 1990 300D 2.5 turbo as most recent additions. But mostly have 123 series diesels. If interested let me know at [email protected] or daughter
[email protected] Can also do initial PPI's on 85 and older diesels.
Hardcore MBCA fanatics,
John Gregg
 

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From 76'to 85' 240S and 300s were on the W123 chassis SD or SDL Sedan or long wheel base...

From 76'to 85' 240S and 300s were on the W123 chassis SD or SDL Sedan or long wheel base diesel SE or SEL same as the SD/SDL info but gasoline SL 2seater convertable from Sports Light SLC 4seater coupe C=coupe D=diesel E= gas fuel injection G=Gelandewagen,off road T=station wagon from touring as in 280TE TD=turbo diesel W123 is a chassis, not model 300TDT is a model I don't know what you mean by catagory There is that I know of Model, year, chassis prefix, and description identifing for example sedan diesel, roadster,gasoline, etc. I have an 82'TDT and love it. 220 miles and clean and beautiful. Adios amigo
 

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TD doesn't mean TurboDiesel.
If you look at a 280TE, tis means its a 280E in T-modell. ...


TD doesn't mean TurboDiesel.
If you look at a 280TE, tis means its a 280E in T-modell. A 300TD is a 300Diesel, T-modell. A 300TDT is a 300DieselTurbo, T-modell.
 

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Let me help out a bit with this....

Model Letters:

"T" means "Transport" - It design...


Let me help out a bit with this....

Model Letters:

"T" means "Transport" - It designates a Wagon model
"S" means "Super" - It designates a Large Body vehicle
"E" means "Einspritzung" - It designates a Fuel Injected model
"C" means "Coupe" - It designates a Coupe model
"D" means "Diesel" - It designates a Diesel model
"L" means "Lang" - It desginates a Streched version

Chassis letters:

"W" means "Wagen" - It means a sedan/saloon model (example: W123)
"R" means "Roadster" - It designates a Roadster - 2 seater convertible (example R129 chassis: SL500)



As far as the confusion with chassis goes - here are some pictures with the chassis numbers on them to help you out. Matteus' time line was very good but the pictures will help also....

Below is the W108/109 Chassis - This was the first of the late model S-Class chassis' (it was the first of the S-Class cars to become very popular). Some models in this chassis family include:

250S / 250SE
280S / 280SE / 280SEL / 280SEL 3.5 / 280SEL 4.5
300SE / 300SEL / 300SEL 6.3
 

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Next in the time line is the W116 chassis (pictured below). This chassis series included:...

Next in the time line is the W116 chassis (pictured below). This chassis series included:

280SE / 280SEL
450SE / 450SEL / 450SEL 6.9
300SD
 

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Next up for the S-Class is the W126 (pictured below). This chassis overlapped the W116 ch...

Next up for the S-Class is the W126 (pictured below). This chassis overlapped the W116 chassis for 2 years and like others have said it is possible to have a 300SD in a W116 and a W126 chassis for the same year. Here are the models of the W126 chassis:

300SD / 300SDL
380SEL
420SEL
500SEL
560SEL
 

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And now For the

And now For the "middle-class" sedans. As stated on the pictures, there was no specific designation for a class back then (example: today there is a C,E,S,M,CLK,SL,SLK,G class, etc.) So they were just the middle of the road, medium sized sedans with many different trim levels and engines.

First of which to become popular was the W114/115 chassis (pictured below). Some models include:

200 / 200D
220 / 220D
230 / 230.6
240D / 240D 3.0 (300D)
250 / 250C
280 / 280C
 

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Finaly, the successor to the W114/115 chassis - the ever popular W123 (pictured below). S...

Finaly, the successor to the W114/115 chassis - the ever popular W123 (pictured below). Some models in this chassis include:

240D
250 / 250E
280 / 280E / 280TE / 280CE
300D / 300CD / 300TD
 

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