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TJs, FJ40s, JGCs, G500
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Discussion Starter #1
Finally got the 295's mounted and had a chance to test drive them.
In the debling process I removed the running boards. What a relief - no more dirty pants.

265/60R18 = 2367 mm circumference = 29.66" diameter @ 34 psi
295/75R16 = 2570 mm circumference = 32.21" diameter @ 32 psi

calculated power loss 8.5%
calculated brake force loss 8.5%
calculated speedo offset = 9%

seat of pants power feel = no difference
seat of pants brake force feel = significant difference (less aggressive)
measured 70 mph with GPS when speedo shows 63 mph

Comfort:
on pavement no noticeable difference (a hint of more low Hz rumble)
on bad roads it feels much more cushy and comfortable (less jolts, less steering impact)

Optics:
In my eyes a major improvement

Rubbing:
Yes, as expected
left side on leading arm and on pitman arm
right side none
intended counter measure: adding 30 mm spacers
I also expect the rears to contact the inner lining on full compression.
Intended measure: trim pack or taller springs

ESP:
As expected (kinda)
fast sharp turns(faster than I would normally drive) = no ESP action
fast sharp turns downhill = hectic ESP action, engine torque reduction
fast (faster than downhill) sharp turns uphill = no ESP action
fast long tight freeway offramps = ESP blinks intitially but calms down and stays off when you stay on the gas (seems like it learns that the vehicle stays stable in the process)
intended counter measure: adding 300 mm spacers (creates a bigger rpm difference between left and right - similar to stock tires). It also stabilizes the vehicle and creates less input of the gyro (less lean). This conclusion also means that the US ET 43 mm wheels, aside from making the vehicle more stable, trigger less ESP action than ET 63 mm wheels.

Here are the pics:
 

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Mercedes "M32"
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They look great! Very thorough rundown as well ... but arent they 16 inch rims and not 18 inchers. [:p]
 

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111.010 121.942 202.033
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Harald,

This might be handy to watch the validate the speed also -

To find your true speed via GPS in the COMAND unit:

Hit the SVC button and select AUX. While on the Auxillary Input screen - press and hold 1, 3, and Mute for several seconds. You'll get a list of different menus. Select 'Versions' and page down to the 2nd page of menu items. Select 'Infos' and you will have your true speed via GPS.

Looks good. Is the DoKa pictured yours as well? What are the details?
 

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2004 G500 (gone)
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1,100 Posts
Harald,

I really like that "It's NOT a Jeep...you wouldn't understand" sticker on the rear window. [:D]

Very cool pics! I think the car looks FANTASTIC (especially without the rear tire cover)!! [:p] What a difference removing the running boards makes.

Maybe I should get rid of mine. Hmmm... [:D] Thanks for sharing!!

Who makes the 30 mm spacers?
 

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4x4abc - 5/18/2005 12:31 AM
intended counter measure: adding 300 mm spacers (creates a bigger rpm difference between left and right - similar to stock tires). It also stabilizes the vehicle and creates less input of the gyro (less lean). This conclusion also means that the US ET 43 mm wheels, aside from making the vehicle more stable, trigger less ESP action than ET 63 mm wheels.
I really doubt that adding spacers makes the body lean less when cornering, -at least when all wheels are touching ground, as leaning is mostly caused by suspension and the goemetry of center of gravity versus suspension stays the same with or without spacers.

Some of that leaning comes from tires and is best cured by using a wider rim. Tires mounted on to narrow rims are never nice in fast turns and as you are using rims that are 10 cm narrover than the tires, -you most likely get similar cornering deformation of tires as you were riding higher profile tire on ideal rim.

I see often on this forum that 35" high (315mm/12,5" wide and 75% profile at 16" format) tires are mounted on 7" wide rims. This might be ok for offroading but when those cars are driven on highways it feels a lot worse than 75% profile tires in fast turns.
 

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TJs, FJ40s, JGCs, G500
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Discussion Starter #7
doka is not mine - my landlord owns it. Very rare. Rear axles are leaf sprung and the frame is separated in two independent units connected by a swivel plate, allowing both parts to seek individual horizontal levels.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Brent,

couple of different companies make spacers for the G - usually around $250 for the set. Plenty of offers on ebay. Used ones for a handful of $

http://cgi.ebay.de/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=14771&item=7975067205&rd=1

Harald
 

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2016 G550 & 2016 350 GLE
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RE: About the width...among other things

Harald, I have 275x70xR16 Michelin road tread on my 02 Gwagen. I had in mind replacing them with BF Goodrich ATs but narrower. I don't like the bulging look I get with the 275's. Give your opinion on that, then....
I have some nick and scratches in the wheels that I was thinking of having fixed during the change over.
Why did you choose the black look? I had in mind powder coating the inset area in black and then going some other color. Haven't given this too much though up until I saw your set of wheels. I heard someone say chroming the wheels was a "no-no" but there is a local plating shop handy that I think would only nickel plate the areas I ask them to. For instance the outer surface. I could get a finish that was similar to the original color, yet durable. Of course I'm just rolling this over at present.
On another note, I really like the running boards off of your truck. It looks more like a Gwagen now....You got me going again, probably will not sleep until I can take mine off. Of course the wife is going to raise Zell![:D]
 

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Is that a Unimog on steroids, it is cool.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
RE: About the width...among other things

wide - narrow, bulging, chromed, nickeled, painted, powder coated, polished, beat up, etc etc
There is something for each of us. My intention was to de-bling the G.

Harald
 

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1981 240 GD
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my same old doubt.....

Harald, looking at what you did..basically going from 29 to 32 brings me back to my same old doubt.
I put 235x70R16 in my 240GD...this is basically the stock size. I wonder if I should have gone bigger, let's say 31-32. Obviously the 240GD power is non-existent when compared to your 500 V8, but torque is very good....
I know Karl runs 35'' with the 30D engine which gives around 10-15% more HP than the 240D...so...

I should probably make a test with sime used 33 and see what happens....

Fernando
 

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1980 LWB 280GE
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Thanks for the detailed evaluation Harald!

I forgot, does the truck already have some lift from springs or something? Or is the suspension fully stock at this point? It just looks a little higher to my eye than just the tires would do, so I thought I'd ask.

It'll be interesting to see how your track-width experiments come through with the ESP. I have no idea what all the inputs are that the ESP is considering when it makes a decision to intrude under certain circumstances and not under others. It'd really intriguing.

If you get a chance, another nice comparison number to have before and after the wheel spacers would be the turning radius. I'd evaluate it as a practical number - ie- evaluate the current setup WITHOUT forcing the tires into the hard parts - set steering stops correctly - and then do the same for the setup with spacers and see what the difference in turning radius is. Just a thought.

Thanks again!

-Dave G.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
RE: my same old doubt.....

Fernando,

trust me - you will NOT be happy with larger tires on your 240GD.
Your current tire size is exactly 28.1" - if you go to 32" tires you will lose 12.7% of your available torque at the tires

right now you have about 115 Nm @ 1000 = 1211 Nm per powered wheel in 2WD (2422 Nm total)
the 32" tires will bring you down to 100 Nm @ 1000 = 1057 Nm per powered wheel in 2WD(2115 Nm total)
calculated with engine torque, first gear ratio, axle ratio (25:1)

Fact is, that the 240 GD has less torque @ 1000 rpm (115 Nm) than the 230G (140 Nm).

Like in my above example, going from stock (29.5") to 32" on a G500 is not really noticeable. I lost 8% of torque. Nominal engine torque @ 1000 is 340 Nm
stock tires = 1970 Nm per powered wheel in full time 4WD (7880 Nm total)
32" tires = 1812 Nm per powered wheel in full time 4WD (7250 Nm total)
calculated with engine torque, torque converter ratio, first gear ratio, axle ratio (28:1)

With less numbers:
You start off with 2422 Nm to get 2000 kg moving - you don't want to lose a single Newtonmeter of that by putting on larger tires.
The G500 starts off with 7880 Nm to get 2300 kg moving - that's plenty, and to lose a few does not make a big difference.

img.1 = 240GD img.2 = 230G

Harald
 

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I always try to avoid "cross-threading"...but.....

Harald, could you post the torque/power curves for the 270CDI, 400CDI, G500, and G55, maybe over in the other thread to illustrate why the diesels are handicapped (vs large displacement petrol) in low-rev, off-boost situations?

See, you went on that nice fun trip, now you're paying the price by having to type a lot to share it all!

We're all really grateful that you take the time to share your expeiences this way. We all learn a lot.

Thanks!

-Dave G.
 

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RE: Best Look for the G

That is one of the best looks for the G's in my opinion. Black, Black Rims and real tires. Very nice. What about blacking out the emblems in flat black paint? The V8 and G500 emblems.

Thanks for the great pictures.

Andrew
 

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harald, you might wanna get the body lift spacers on order while your at it because based on other peoples experience, with the 1 inch spacers you might move off the panhard, but you should be rubbing quite a bit of fender liner.

One other questions... why not go with some of the wheels on your site that have et25 for the g-wagen? then you don't need the spacers? are they 16" rims that just don't fit the G500 calipers? or did you get a smokin' deal on the Atik's?
 

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RE: Best Look for the G

roane10 - 5/18/2005 1:46 PM

What about blacking out the emblems in flat black paint? The V8 and G500 emblems.

Thanks for the great pictures.

Andrew
A little dental floss and mineral spirits will remove them completely. They're stuck on with adhesive.
 

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02 G500
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Harald, Great looking truck! I know what you mean by "de blinging" the G. I put 16" wheels on mine, removed the running boards and mud flaps front and rear. Question; does installing spacers stress the wheel bearings?
 
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