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The rapid collapse of neo-conism and so-called "movement" conservatism is taking even me by surprise, it is starting to come down like the Berlin Wall. Huge Democratic turnouts, of the voters who gave up voting. Limbaugh and Coulter, repudiated by their own party and now national laughingstocks. Hannity's ratings falling, Fox ratings falling, Limbaugh down some six million listeners. All uber-right candidates failing in the GOP primaries. An irrelevent president everyone ignores. WTF happened? This article is excellent:

Zakaria: The End of Conservatism | Newsweek Voices - Fareed Zakaria | Newsweek.com
 

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Like liberalism died in the 1980's, right?

Which, curiously, is the last time there was a conservative elected to the presidency.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Next to "neo-con" in the dictionary is a picture of you dressed up like a dolled-up whore.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Picture of "Botsy" at last neo-con convention:



 

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I don't want to ruffle any feathers, but when did our current Federal policy of spending money like a drunken sailor, cutting taxes on the "uber rich" and bankrupting the country while spending untold billions on a war with no identifiable enemy become "conservative policy?" Just because some politicians call it "conservative" does not make it so. And when did alowing our country's infrastructure to go to pot along with our health care system and our border security become "conservative?"

Let's try to see matters in a much more complex and correct way than the conservative/liberal titles, and try to see them in light of common sense and what works and what is broken. Eisenhower was a conservative, but he tried to keep spending in check, and keep it prioritized in accord with the needs of our people. For one thing, he was the "Father" of our current interstate highway system -- I can't imaginel life now without it. We'd be a third world country! I'm sure Eisenhower is turning over in his grave over what is being done in the name of conservatism, and the statements of well-known "conservative" pundants.
 

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I don't want to ruffle any feathers, but when did our current Federal policy of spending money like a drunken sailor, cutting taxes on the "uber rich" and bankrupting the country while spending untold billions on a war with no identifiable enemy become "conservative policy?" Just because some politicians call it "conservative" does not make it so. And when did alowing our country's infrastructure to go to pot along with our health care system and our border security become "conservative?"

Let's try to see matters in a much more complex and correct way than the conservative/liberal titles, and try to see them in light of common sense and what works and what is broken. Eisenhower was a conservative, but he tried to keep spending in check, and keep it prioritized in accord with the needs of our people. For one thing, he was the "Father" of our current interstate highway system -- I can't imaginel life now without it. W'd be a third world country! I'm sure Eisenhower is turning over in his grave over what is being done in the name of conservatism, and the statements of well-known liberal pundants.
I believe the answer to your question would be when the NeoConservative movement under Kristol, Dobson, Cheney, Bush and Rove hijacked the Republican Party.
 

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Best paragraph of the article. It summarizes the Shrinking28 quite well. It also supports the "Light at the end of the Tunnel" response from the "Americans Feel Better about the Future" thread.


FTFA said:
Most crucially, Americans' views of the state are shifting. They don't want bigger government—a poll last year found that a majority (57 percent) still believe that government makes it harder for people to get ahead in life—but they do want a smarter government, one that can help them be safe, secure and well prepared for political and economic challenges. In this context, conservative slogans sound weirdly anachronistic, like watching an old TV show from ... well, from the 1970s.
 

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You know, seeing this stuff makes me even sadder about Bill Clinton's misbehavior. Because if it weren't for that, the whole current nightmare might have been averted. Remember how "close" the 2000 election was.
 

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You know, seeing this stuff makes me even sadder about Bill Clinton's misbehavior. Because if it weren't for that, the whole current nightmare might have been averted. Remember how "close" the 2000 election was.
Strange you mention that. We had this very conversation in town less than a week ago. We got Bush due to a guy with a sex addiction.

I suppose the true cynic would say that if Hillary...nevermind.
 

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Next to "neo-con" in the dictionary is a picture of you dressed up like a dolled-up whore.
I might've known your dictionary would have pictures.
 

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BenzWorld Elitist
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Strange you mention that. We had this very conversation in town less than a week ago. We got Bush due to a guy with a sex addiction.

I suppose the true cynic would say that if Hillary...nevermind.
Oh yeah, and we have said it :)

Meanwhile, do you think she's going to bring the Party down with her now? She doesn't appear to have the grace to back down in the face of something as trivial as public preference. Yes, March 4 will make all the difference, but still.
 

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Oh yeah, and we have said it :)

Meanwhile, do you think she's going to bring the Party down with her now? She doesn't appear to have the grace to back down in the face of something as trivial as public preference. Yes, March 4 will make all the difference, but still.
That group hates to lose. I saw something today that said that unless she runs the table with Texas, Ohio AND Penn she would have no legitimate claim on the Superdelegates.

So it really comes down to how much trash she is willing to throw between now and March 4. I would hope that their campaign would keep the discourse professional but I really doubt that will be the case. The dirty work will be done by agents provocateur from whom she can quickly distance herself.

I would think that if March 4 goes bad for her, she will have no choice but to back off but again, I DO NOT believe they consider loss an option.
 

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BenzWorld Elitist
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That group hates to lose.
That's kind of the crux of the matter. The Klintons worship power for its own sake, and have proven capable of just about anything to achieve & maintain it.

Somewhat paradoxically, it's the very same thing which has compromised their public support.
 

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That's kind of the crux of the matter. The Klintons worship power for its own sake, and have proven capable of just about anything to achieve & maintain it.

Somewhat paradoxically, it's the very same thing which has compromised their public support.
Back in 2000 there was a contingent of Democrats that didn't really support Gore simply because he acted as though he was "supposed" to be next in line, that he was heir apparent to the Clinton White House.

It looks like there is a group of Democrats that are reacting that very same way now. There is a big difference between the two, however. At least Gore was running on HIS record, not THEIR record. I think that is causing a rift that will be problematic.

All that said, if she gets the nomination, the Party will rally around her as there does seem to be a very strong movement to insure that there is not "more of the same".
 

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Maybe the Party will rally around her, but so far as getting indies & repubs to join in, not so much. There are all too many people (like myself) that will have immense difficulty voting for someone we know to be completely unprincipled.
 

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Pendulumatic swings don't end so much as give way for the time being. Their usurpers movements having, like a torrent, little control over the nature of the change they usher in.
 

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Maybe the Party will rally around her, but so far as getting indies & repubs to join in, not so much. There are all too many people (like myself) that will have immense difficulty voting for someone we know to be completely unprincipled.
And that brings up the Bloomberg question.
 

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Pendulumatic swings don't end so much as give way for the time being. Their usurpers movements having, like a torrent, little control over the nature of the change they usher in.
Exactly right.

B
 

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Pendulumatic swings don't end so much as give way for the time being. Their usurpers movements having, like a torrent, little control over the nature of the change they usher in.
There are still people who are pissed at Theodore Roosevelt for his part in what is considered the breakup of the original Republican Party. So the pendulum CAN come crashing to a halt. The NeoCons seem to be in a similar self destruct mode right now [time will tell if that is accurate]. And interestingly, a post NeoCon Republican Party might just be a reflection of the original Republican Party that ol' Teddy ripped asunder back in Decade1 of the last century.
 
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