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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
I was looking at these two cars and was wondering what would be the better deal. The s430 has 38,987 miles on it and the s500 has 42,321 miles on it, they are both right at $30,000. So I was just wondering what one you guys would go for and if there is a huge difference between the two of them? Has anyone had any problems with either of these two cars? Also would you really be able to feel the difference in the power because I plan on getting whatever one I pick chipped, so would you really be able to tell a difference?
 

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Welcome to the forum!

However, there is not enough info in your question. What years are the two cars, and are both 4-Matics, or only the S430? If both are 4-Matics, for the prices to be about the same at around $30K I'm guessing the S500 4-Matic is an '03, because that's the first year the S500 had it, with the S430 following in '04; and $30K is far too low for an '05 or an '06 of either type in good conditon. But, I don't want to write a book while guessing. Because of differences in the fiber optic busses between '03 and '04, there could be many differences other than power and drive train to address.

A little use of the search tool will get you some recent strings on differences between 4-matic and RWD in the S-class. Try my screen name as user name in advanced search.

I like the 4-Matic no matter the engine size; however, there are trim differences and options/standard equipment differences between the cars that could be important to you. You can check the differences between models in the model overview section of MBUSA. The site map is the easiest way to find it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Yeah, just the s430 is the 4matic, and sometimes we get a lot of snow and sometimes not. The weather here is really messed up like it will be 65 one day then the next we will get some snow. I'm not looking to push as much power out of it as I can just get a little gain, and what is a good performance chip and any other ways to get some power out of it? Thanks for all the help.
 

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Check the links here for some observations on 4-Matic, and on the S-Class generally - http://www.benzworld.org/forums/w220-s-class/1265199-new-member.html

Again, I strongly endorse the 4-Matic, having driven various AWD cars including my '05 4-Matic in bad weather conditions for years - and I include snow, sleet, and torrential downpours in the driving conditions.

The '03 is equipped with a D2B fiber optic bus. The Bluetooth options for it are slightly more limited than for the MOST bus cars ('04 and later S-Cllass). See http://www.benzworld.org/forums/aud...guide-cell-phone-upgrades-plug-bluetooth.html for cell phone upgrade paths.

The S430 has different interior trim. Most of the standard equipment on the S500 was available as an option on the S430 (except, of course, the engine) - and most but not all of the options on the S500 were also available on the S430. I suggest you compare the equipment lists of the two cars carefully. The dealer should have them or be able to get you printouts for each car.

Both cars will have the wide-screen COMAND with CD-based nav systems. They cannot be upgraded to DVD-based nav used in MOST-bus equipped cars. They already have the taillights that many seem to want - but one difference is often the headlights (both will have clear lenses, but there may be differences in the bulbs - both will have Xenon low beams, but check whether either is Bi-Xenon, meaning Xenon high beams as well; otherwise, high beams are halogen). You cannot upgrade to Bi-Xenon from simple HID (Xenon) without changing out the entire headlight unit, and it can be problematic.

Very few people complain that the S430 is underpowered. I have no experience chipping a Benz, so can't really discuss the power boost - but then, you don't buy an S-Class for street racing.

You might consider getting the maintenance records on both cars, and pulling a CarFax report on them. It seems a bit odd that with similar mileage they are so closely priced - though the 4-Matic could be in very high demand where you are, which would drive its price up, vice the RWD.

Also keep in mind that you need to keep all four rims the same size in a 4-Matic - no staggered wheels. You can change the rim sizes from the OE 17's, but all the diameters must be the same.
 

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demonicdonkey said:
Im not trying to turn it into a street racing car or anything like that, Id just like to get a little more power for the fun factor. Thanks for all the help you guys are putting on here :thumbsup:
I don't know much about modding cars for performance with chips, but I do know you shouldn't expect much from chipping a naturally aspirated engine.
 

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demonicdonkey said:
Im not trying to turn it into a street racing car or anything like that, Id just like to get a little more power for the fun factor. Thanks for all the help you guys are putting on here :thumbsup:
You're welcome - and thanks for not making me write a bunch more on '04s and MOST bus.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Haha, yeah. I just wanna make sure that I get a good deal and don't end up over paying for something. I think it's always good to ask around and see what other people say about them because half the time you don't get the whole story from the people selling you the car. So Id rather find out the truth about a car and see what other people say about them before it's to late. But yeah I like the 4matic for the reason that we do get snow and ice, but what about when it's dry out, does it really have any affect on anything then?
 

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demonicdonkey said:
I was looking at these two cars and was wondering what would be the better deal. The s430 has 38,987 miles on it and the s500 has 42,321 miles on it, they are both right at $30,000. So I was just wondering what one you guys would go for and if there is a huge difference between the two of them? Has anyone had any problems with either of these two cars? Also would you really be able to feel the difference in the power because I plan on getting whatever one I pick chipped, so would you really be able to tell a difference?
Welcome a-board!

You might want to do a search because this topic has been discussed many times. But this thread might be of some assistance: http://www.benzworld.org/forums/w220-s-class/1313320-03-vs-04-s430.html

I'd ALWAYS go w/ the S500 over the S430!!!
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Yeah I do like how the S500 has a little more power but I can find a lot more S430's with the 4matic then the S500's. Sorry Skylaw but I had to bring up an 2004 but I did happen to find a s500 4matic but it up's the price by around $8,000. But I'm not really sure if one year newer is worth it. :confused:
 

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demonicdonkey said:
Yeah I do like how the S500 has a little more power but I can find a lot more S430's with the 4matic then the S500's. Sorry Skylaw but I had to bring up an 2004 but I did happen to find a s500 4matic but it up's the price by around $8,000. But I'm not really sure if one year newer is worth it. :confused:
I think '04 is when they put in DVD navigation. I'm not sure what else they changed/added/took away, but I'm not sure they'd make the $8,000 worth it. But, then of course, there's the bigger V8 with more power that you're looking for.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Yeah it seems like there is a pretty big jump in price from the 2003 to the 2004, and the 4matic makes the price go up even more. I do like the idea of the 4matic I just don't know much Id really need it, I mean we do get snow, just not sure if I would really need it. I mean what's everyones opinion about the 03's and 04's, anyone have any real problems with them?
 

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Of course, I drive an '05 S500 4-Matic and love it - it's the best combination if you can swing it. asianml is correct that the '04s went to the DVD nav system. Unfortunately, there is no AUX input on COMAND, if that's important to you (makes iPod integration or playback difficult and expensive, but the COMAND can play mp3 DVDs, which helps).

4-Matic gives a feel of a very firm grip on dry roads - a feel that I like - but its best utility is on wet, snowy, or icy roads.
 

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Curious Skylaw, how does the 4 Matic compare to the Audi system where 100% of the torque may be directed to the wheel with grip if three tires are slipping. As I understand the 4 Matic, it does not work the same way. Audi sends 50% of the torque to each axle under normal traction ( BMW is 35F/65R), I have always wondered about MB and will consider it when I upgrade.
 

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II kings 920 said:
Curious Skylaw, how does the 4 Matic compare to the Audi system where 100% of the torque may be directed to the wheel with grip if three tires are slipping. As I understand the 4 Matic, it does not work the same way. Audi sends 50% of the torque to each axle under normal traction ( BMW is 35F/65R), I have always wondered about MB and will consider it when I upgrade.
I thought that's how it works in 4Matic too. :confused: I think MB sedans have 40/60 split.
 

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Under normal driving conditions, the 4-Matic on sedans is slightly biased toward the rear wheels, which helps performance driving.

Mercedes provides the following in a late 2006 article on MBUSA:

"Under normal conditions, Mercedes sport utility vehicles distribute torque equally between the front and rear wheels. However, 4MATIC-equipped passenger cars come with a planetary gear set within the center differential that begins with 40:60 percent front:rear torque distribution (45:55 on the new S550 4MATIC). Mercedes-Benz 4MATIC SUVs (M-, R-, GL- and G-Class) employ a 50:50 torque split front:rear. To skilled drivers, this rear-bias all-wheel-drive system feels much like rear-wheel-drive Mercedes-Benz cars, in which subtle throttle-steering effects at the rear wheels can enhance handling, especially in spirited driving."

In another article dated 2005 (the 2007 S-Class 4-Matic system has been redesigned), Mercedes says "4ETS applies controlled amounts of braking pressure to spinning wheels and simultaneously increases the amount of power sent to the wheels with good traction. In this way the electronic traction control system achieves the same effect as three differential locks."

A Mercedes press release from 2000 says:

"Whenever one wheel begins to rotate faster than the other three, the traction control system momentarily applies the brake on that one wheel. Since applying the brake increases resistance on that wheel, the differentials naturally shift more power to another wheel. The Mercedes-Benz four-wheel drive system is one of the very few which will keep the vehicle mobile even when three wheels have lost traction. The 4MATIC system coupled with a standard driver-sensing Electronic Stability Program (ESP) enhances handling control in turns. If the car fishtails, ESP brakes the outside front wheel to help restore order. If the car plows, ESP brakes the inside rear wheel to help keep you on course."

I can't answer the question directly as to the amount of power shifted in each circumstance - what I can say is that after driving three models of Audi with its Quattro system (5000S Quattro, A4 1.8t Quattro, and A6 2.7t), in all kinds of weather, I don't think the Mercedes 4-Matic in my '05 gives anything away to them. I owned the Audis, driving the Quattros for about 3 years each, in Colorado, Baltimore, and Washington (DC), so had a lot of experience with them.

Mercedes has continued to refine the 4-Matic system; the way it worked in 1987 at its U.S. introduction is not the way it functions now. As the Audis did, if three wheels are without traction, the Benz will drive the one with traction while braking those without, so as to re-establish traction on them. My '05 S-500 tracks as straight as my Audis did in snow, icy patches, and in pooled water.

Because we were not permitted to use studded tires in Maryland, Virginia or DC, I cannot compare to my Colorado driving experience - where studs were permitted - on extensive ice. Neither the A4, the A6, nor the Benz was great on extensive ice in those states without studded tires. By contrast, the Audi 5000S Quattro with studs did superbly on extensive ice (I drove 55 miles each way every weekday to law school over long hills and in treacherous weather on I-25 in Colorado and never turned back with that car; but my Jeep Cherokee couldn't cut it there even with studs; it was very unstable on ice, while being good in snow).

As I said in one of my links above - while I loved my '00 S500 RWD, I truly missed the feel of AWD - I drove an '04 S430 4-Matic on a test drive one year, and it reminded me of what I was missing. Wet, dry, snowy, slushy, or icy - they're just great, and have a feel of being in control of the road that RWD lacks. So, when I came across the S500 4-Matic, I jumped on it, even knowing I was moving back to Florida within a year. The decision was vindicated on my first trip from DC to Florida, when I drove through torrential rains almost all the way down, and when a tropical storm hit while I was there. The car was just great - visibility was a far greater problem than running through pooled water 3-4 inches deep, near hydroplaning speed. That experience was validated on subsequent trips as well.
 
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