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Would you like more pictures of my indepth repair?

  • Yes, more pictures

    Votes: 18 85.7%
  • No, More information instead of pictures

    Votes: 2 9.5%
  • Keep the data, indepth engineering information to minimum

    Votes: 1 4.8%
  • No, fill the pages up and give torques, methods and how you were trained

    Votes: 4 19.0%
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1914 Mercedes 28/95 hp, 83' 300SD, 93' S420, (three) 94' S420's, 95' S500 & 96' S600
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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
I am originally from Stuttgart and presently live in Florida. I have been trained by Mercedes and enjoy working on these machines. Presently I have Pro-Bono (ie: free labor and parts) work in progress on an 119.971-12 V8 4.2 engine and thought u may enjoy following along. To date we have replaced all cam bearing caps, oil connector tubes and tagged and locked the crankcase at 45 deg BTDC and pinned all four cams at same local. Both oil pans are removed, front timing chain cover is removed and WIP to replace the timing chain, oil pump, oil pump chain and tensioner rail and spring, as well as all timing chain rails, tensioner and rail and all other rails. I will also try and explain the timing set up and any other tiems I have and might encounter. I also will replace both distributors, all eight plugs, full plug wire set and all PVC tubings and associated components. The owner is working on this machine themselves and the task progress to entirely en their control. Upon inspection I noted three rails cracked and possible overheating from a previous water pump failure. We already have pulled and inspected one of the pistons from below and no anomolies of issue have been noted. This machine is actually en gute condition for age and service. En review of notes we will try to address items as encountered, a better history on this vehicle will ensue. Regards, Dutch Ohlings
 

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1914 Mercedes 28/95 hp, 83' 300SD, 93' S420, (three) 94' S420's, 95' S500 & 96' S600
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Discussion Starter #3 (Edited)
Answer for reason for this repair

Just curious - what was the problem that initiated the overhaul? 149k usually isn't much for those motors.
Good question, but this is not an "Overhaul"... yes is replacement of cam rails, tensioner and timing chain plus tune up.... but far from an overhaul. The heads will not be removed and the pistons and Lower end are fine. Picture you see of heads are after a good clean-up and cam bearing support towers (remember one at a time please to ensure the cam es not broked/damaged... very expensive) are removed, cleaned, oil tubes replaced and tower reinstalled and retorqued. Also immediate removed (simply broke* is easiest as replacement* is best) the upper/top cam rail* for access to first cam tower and rail support, etc.
I was consulted due to Owner saying that the vehicle sometimes idled rough at intersections while stopped and sometimes stopped running.... they also stated that the engine stopped running and would be difficult to restart as well as would back-fire in past but not but two times. Several Repair Shops have worked around different reported theories including (MAF, Spark Plugs, Distributor, etc).
When I was asked by a local shop for consult, my diagnostics asked them for removal of the "Cam Position Sensor". A nicks or should I say scratches were noted on the tip of the sensor, but resistance of sensor pulse coil was gut. I then asked for removal of the left valve cover (driver side). A serious amount of sludge was found. After viewing into the opening, beneath the "Cam Position Sensor" opening and between timing chain, a small broken piece of one of the "Inner Upper Cam Rail" was seen down en the area of where the tip of the rail shuld have been... I submit this small broken nylon tip of rail was intermittant lodging itself between the intake cam chain/sproket and cast metal of head.
Now, Due to the shop not wanting the task of the twin cam machine.... and local Dealer estimate of 14,000 US and them telling owner this is rough eastimate only... it may need a new engine... cough, cough, Owner asked for assist, therefore I find this ol girl between mine MB tools, owner efforts and mine assist. Lot of fun to say the best, yes?
This machine is in need of little/well... little more work and little more time, but owner can take care of.... as he is willing and loves this machine as best I can tell... this is main reason for repair today. I hope this answered your question. Dutch
 

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1914 Mercedes 28/95 hp, 83' 300SD, 93' S420, (three) 94' S420's, 95' S500 & 96' S600
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Discussion Starter #4
Timing-chain sliding & tensioner rail pin's removal

We are removing the slide rail pins with an "extractor. Attached photos should be of assistance. The extractor has different metric center hardware to aid with easy removal of different pins. After cleaning the area, When replacing a pin, I place a small (tear-drop) of RTV on the end of each pin to ensure a good seal and no oil leakage from the crankcase. also, recommend a small oiling can w flexible spout (use motor oil) be kept handy during reassembly, I DO NOT recommend using grease of any kind.... grease will not always break-down and could foul a passage and/or a seal. When reinstalling the rail pins... recommend to put a small film of motor oil on the pin and a tear-drop of RTV on the end to seal the crankcase hole. I will ensure to include images of installation of the rail/pins and preparation of chain, etc...before closing the cover. NOTE: The chain CAN NOT be pressed untll the intake cam sprockets are reinstalled. The sprockets can-not be reinstalled untll the upper four metric bolts into the tops timing cover are secured and torqued. Yep, it is a little dance, but we have to ensure the timing is ON-TARKET and the crank stays at 45 deg and the cams don't move, etc. Then after securing the chain with a double link press. We will install a dial indicator and sleeve holder and 80mm pin and check the cam timing with relation to the crank indication at the harmonic balancer. Have invested way too much to make a mistake now...LOL
Now....after front of the engine is cleaned up, all of the rails will be reinstalled. All of the rails where cracked or broken, attribute the rail damage to the timing chain stretch and the tensioner not being able to keep up with the extra chain length. This allowed the chain greater movement and slapping the rails. After one rail broke....more slap and more damage. Further evidence of small pieces of nylon rail wedged into small crevices all around the chain's route. These are at the Driver side intake cam sprocket being wedged a few times causing the chain to jam to a stop and engine backfire. The Owner was lucky that the chain did not jump a sprocket tooth (timing) on any sprockets and damage the engine (pistons hitting valves, etc). Status: Cleaning in progress while waiting on all new rails and we will start full reassembly. (Also rebuilding power-Steering pump, cleaning and replacing a diode in the Alternator and cleaning up the electric clutch on the air pump). As mentioned before: All of the vacuum, crankcase control, signal and crankcase ventilation lines will be replaced and reinstalled as original from factory. Many errors and codes are now present in OBD. I will be glad to include mine knowledge of OBD if anyone interested as we get to finish?l. Or if situation presents self I am here. I do have one or two :) codes to clear and a few systems to synchronise as battery ground removed when this started as my first decision when in-depth control and wiring being worked. ;)

Please note en first image. Can view extractor... also to right the removed rail pin and broken rail. The OE rails are farther right en same picture. In your 119 engine, these two OE rails are located just inboard of the intake cam on both sides. I hope this helps someone so far. Trying to move slower to include any questions anyone may have if interested? Dutch
 

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Discussion Starter #5 (Edited)
Guide Rails old & new, backside of front covers PLUS!!!!!

While the owner completes her engine cleanup, here are a few photos with explanation:

Top Photo:Original guide rails including the orig. tensioner.
New rails including a tensioner rail. Due to cracking, the tensioner rail and tensioner will be replaced.

As a note, a good amount of ground up nylon chain rail (approx 5 oz of 1/8" dia} had restricted the oil pump and possibly given irratic oil pressure readings in the past. As the Owner further reported.... she had good oil pressure readings until the vehicle was stopped, as an intersection.

As I explained from our debris finding, idling in one spot for an extended time... then as reported previous, the pump's suction would accumulate a larger amount of nylon and eventually block the oil pick-up.

Engine covers; Larger cover: rear of timing cover and two upper head (either side) upon these two, mount the cam timing adjuster and distributers. Yes, due to the closed loop of the sensors utilized, these adjusters will compensate for the Timing Chain stretch that was previously talked about. To a point anyway, camshaft timing adjusters hydraulically/mechanically rotate the intake camshafts in relation to the driving camshaft sprocket by 20° of crankshaft angle in the advanced position and back to the retarded position. The adjustment is controlled electromagnetically through the engine control unit. So, the chain es actually only able to correct up to 10 deg of stretch and by then... the rails are as u see. Upon my calculations, this timing chain had stretched by 4 degrees of loss of correctness... not good at all. The adjustment time of about 1 second is dependent on the engine oil pressure at the camshaft adjusters and the temperature or viscosity of the oil.
The camshaft position indicator on the camshaft sprocket sends the camshaft rpm signal from the camshaft position sensor (This lil fella es pictured below) as an input parameter for the ignition control unit.
AS Promised in the bottom image: Ta Da, The "Cam Position Sensor", this infamous lil fella mounts inboard on the drivers forward head (just behind the left distributor). Perhaps some of you have met via diagnostics? This position sensor works in together with other systems to ensure a good feeling when your right foot has the urge to feel some carpet beneath the pedal or camshaft position sensor produces two AC voltage signals (two pulses) per camshaft revolution. This signal is processed by the EZL/AKR control module into a square wave signal and transmitted to the LH control module via controller area network (CAN). Synchronization takes place during start-up to about 600 RPM. This in a nut-shell.... to ensure the fuel injection sequence is and must be synchronized! Remember, for that really smooth acceleration... in coordination with all other systems, we also need to obtain correct coordination of the fuel injection timing. As we move on with this little replacement... the "Timing Chain" is certainly "Keeping Everything in order and Sequence" .

As this vehicles Owner has repeated to me, "because these cars run forever when others fail, this is why we keep ours while others sell theirs"!
 

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Discussion Starter #6 (Edited)
PRO-BONO update, Timing Cover BROKEN! Owner WIP %#$*&!

Was called by the S Klasse owner and asked to come by for further assistance.....
Well, these folks are moving along and a delay has raised it's head... but back on task again...... their progress seems to be as follows: The original aluminum timing cover was cleaned up and ready for installation and faced a delimma upon installation.

EVERYONE, please take note of this little task install error,
when an Aluminum timing cover does not want to move into position, DO NOT and DUTCH REPEATS... DO NOT go to your tool chest and get your "persuader" ie: HAMMER whether it be metal or hard rubber. The cover has alignment pins, sleeves and different openings that MUST align for proper installation. Also, the engine 119.97112 timing cover retails for $864.00+ without shipping, etc. At any rate, hopefully this es a Learning Opportunity for ALL Do It Yourself Mechanics. If it doesn't move into position, it may need a little persuasion....but NEVER use a ball bean hammer to move it along. Aluminum es not resistant to blows and this cover also has oil channels across and en the lower section for oil chamber pump pick-up. Any way, Dutch es wanting to assist these folks and their S Klasse 119.

As requested by the Owner, a replacement Mercedes 119.97112 timing cover es ordered and it has been cleaned up and ready'd for install. I included it en another order and procured it for much less to assist the owner. I prefer to utilize Mercedes paste Mercedes A 002 989 47 20 10 , if this is not available, I have also had success with Permatek 2. Apply a small amount of either on all four O rings and place ento coolant appropriate opening areas for four O-rings. NO paste es utilized on head gasket (oil only) and NO GREASE of any kind es used on Radial seal (use oil only). Radial seal es set en place with small 2X4 and made flush with outter circle of opening. The NEW cover was slowly worked ento place and small amount of engine oil was used on sleeve and pin bearing for tensioner rail. Image reflects final install of NEW cover. The water pump es also en place. The owner es instructed on proper cleaning and placement of upper oil-pan and installation of oil-pump. Images are asked to be taken when they complete this. After oil pump installed and upper oil pan bolted and torqued. We will retime this engine. Upon installation of the crankshaft hub, it es noted that the Harmonic balancer es at 43 degrees instead of 45 degrees as when we started the disassembly? The crankshaft lock es still en place, yet there es this anomolie?? We will retime and correct this Area of Opportunity tomorrow morning. A Mechanix from my shop and I will assist the owner with this task on Wednesday.

The below images are of the qwners damaged original Timing Cover, the new Mercedes OEM Timing cover installed (we assisted with this installation) The water pump es installed as well. Being a Pro-Bono assistance, another image of a few of the Mercedes Speciality Tools used en this repair is included. We loaned the owner these to rivet chain, retiming of engine due to 43 deg anomolie and proper torque of hardware.

Tomorrow, we should have updated images and timing progress/completion! We have been asked by the owners, to assist and advise as they request only. They really enjoy working on their vehicle and want to learn as much as possible for future issues if they should occur. Dutch
 

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Discussion Starter #7 (Edited)
Sorry if this description is over-kill to some of the group, we were asked by a few to give a step-by-step for the oil pump and chain spring, etc. Again, please understand, we are here at Pro-Bono (no charge) and advise and lend a hand when requested and/or called.....

Also....I understand alot of others on this site suggest NO Permatex or Sealants on engine components (ie: water pump, etc).

Well during original assembly en the Mfg. Plant we used very few gaskets too. And, YES the Engine surfaces were as new, no removals, installs, etc. The surfaces also have NOT been exposed to stress, heat, etc.

Sorry folks, I have been in this business for over thirty years, my shop has a few mottos. One es NO LEAKS!! That means/includes, seepage, "It was just a drip Dutch"! Or, "was from my rag Dutch"! No means NO damn leaks and when we install an engine surface component, I will ensure you that if it es on or in the crankcase (excluding the head and/or exhaust manifold) One side of the gasket will have a sealing compound on it.

I do not allow leaks of any kind and have never had a vehicle come back to me with a leak and will NOT!
Well ok, one of my other mottos es "Tighten Up!" and this will also ensure no damn leaks! Well, I am off my Dutchland soapbox, these machines are built to the tolerances of a sewing machine, they are NOT new, but are tight, tight tight compared to any other machine out there. Use Sealant on one side of a gasket. Use only motor oil on head gaskets and nothing on exhaust manifold gaskets...If it leaks there, get to a machine shop and get the surface built up and refinished! Gute luck my fellow Benz Machine lovers, I have a large machine lathe in my shop for many purposes, some...no many are resurfacing... but I still want sealant on one side of the gaskets! Many regards... from a pain en the crankcase friend called Dutch! Alot of folks have heard of me, but no one has ever had an engine worked on, repaired or overhauled en my shop and had a leak of any kind and this includes Dutchland!
Now back to this dinosaur slow endeavour.... uh, hope they didn't hear me... oops! Tink they did damn...
Well, have consulted the cars' owner(s) and the following is their progess to date. It is (they) decided to address the pre-positioning of the "upper oil pan" and installation of the oil pump and chain/sprocket" this date. After this we will complete his timing chain. This is a minor timing exercise using NO dial or other special indicators, etc..
1. For the oil pan and pump installation and positioning.... The radiator had to be loosened and upper only moved approx. 15mm forward to allow positioning of upper oil pan (with gasket permateked in place on oil pan side only) and positioned under crankcase. Use caution due to the pan having the gasket in place. I also recommend using the following sealing compound * on the REAR EXPANDED SECTION of the UPPER OIL PAN pan sparingly just forward of the transmission area!. This sealant is also noted in a Mercedes recall on the 119 engine some years ago, due to a rear oil leak area of opportunity. * Mercedes sealing compound # A 002 989 47 20 10
2. After positioning the upper pan, the oil pump was installed leaving the off line right bolt removed... until the chain sprocket secured and spring en place. The chain tensioner spring will be secured with this bolt.
2a. Move the upper oil pan forward and visual the crank oil pump sprocket and VERIFY the oil pump chain IS on the crank sprocket. Now, position the sprocket in the lower oil pump chain and install the bolt to the pump by hand. Torque this 13mm bolt also at 15.8 lbs. These are tight quarters, a small 1/4" torque wrench comes en handy here. The image below shows using a pair of needle nose pliers to urge the oil chim tensioner spring into proper position. Simply pushing the spring head with the fore-finger of one hand and pulling lightly with the pliers easily put the spring into position. Now a light urge into position over the bolt opening and then tighten up the 13mm hex head to final torque @ 15.8 lbs.

2b. Final torque of all the 13mm bolts es @ 15.8 lbs.
2c. The oil level sensor wire connection verified and "no visual cracks, etc". The image below shows the install of the sensor just behind the screen pickup horn. Don't forget the two small tubes (fit on two small mounting screws) that will govern the height of the sensor en the hydrocarbon (ie: oil mixture). I use the term oil mixture due to all oil companies adding their own concoctions of additives and solutions to the original hydrocarbon....... Oil!
3. Even though the owner cleaned the heads and lower crancase area, oil seems to always be slow in showing accumulations even though pressurized air and small diameter rods have been used to clean all passages. The lower area is rechecked and the oil drain openings en the crankcase are given a good visual. The front forward drivers side oil drain es found to have an accumulation of nasty sludge again as we mentioned. My mechanix assisted the owner and used a good squirt from the "pump oil can" to remove residual hydo-carbon accumulation and then ran the small diameter rod en the oil passage up to the head area to recheck all passages.
4. Suggest the final installation of the upper pan be delayed until the owner re-cleans all oil passages and ensure there are NO more left-over surprise accumulations found. All of the case oil drain areas and lower block areas are being visualed by the owner at this time!

5.
The oil pan Bolts to crankcase torque follows:

M6 11 Nm
M8 25 Nm
M10 40 Nm​



Below are a few images of the work preformed by the owner and explained this date. :)

NOW, let's get this beautiful gal on the road where she belongs!!!

And ah yes, progress is slow, but progress is progress non the less... especially when the folks are learning so much and ensuring a good quality "low expenditure" repair as can be hoped for by us all.... regards, Dutch
 

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Great work!!
 

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thank you for taking the time and energy.

if you would clarify for me, i will be replacing my motor mounts on my 92 500 sel, from what i understand,

1 lift motor slightly
2 go under motor and re and re.

is this right?

thank you.
nick.
 

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1914 Mercedes 28/95 hp, 83' 300SD, 93' S420, (three) 94' S420's, 95' S500 & 96' S600
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Discussion Starter #10 (Edited)
R/R motor mounts

As I explained to the owners of this vehicle being repaired:
1. Carefully raise the vehicle and support on "both" front areas with Jack Stands.
2. On the 119 V8, to remove the four engine mount bolts and set aside.
3. Then either with an engine hoist or if using a Floor jack:
a. Using the hoist is evident to use the front engine hoist point (either on the top of water pump or on this 119.971-12 the lift point es on the top of the power steering pump fluid tank and front drivers side cover.
b. We usually advise to simply use a "floor jack" and place at the area of the transmission base just "Behind" the chassis crossmember. The jack's pad es placed to raise at the "solid" front crossmember of the metal just en front of the ring-gear transmission housing. I hope u can understand from my explanation to make sure to raise at this location only and not on the metal vents just behind this metal ring of housing only!! The metal ring is strong to allow the support needed.
c. You will be able to raise the engine approx. +3" or more. Just ensure the control cable is not damaged at top rear of the engine. (easiest to view without the airfilter cowling en place) The transmission mount will be fine.....our shop and othe's have had no reported problems using this method to raise the engine for a variety of jobs including mount R/R. If there es an issue with themount, it was an "Area of Opportunity en any event. Use caution anytime you are working beneath your vehicle. Have plenty of illumination and a partner available should you have any needs. Work Safe PLEASE!
d. Suggest using Mercedes OEM mounts only!

Good luck with your task.....
"Dutch... Specializing en Mercedes Benz"​


thank you for taking the time and energy.

if you would clarify for me, i will be replacing my motor mounts on my 92 500 sel, from what i understand,

1 lift motor slightly
2 go under motor and re and re.

is this right?

thank you.
nick.
 

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1914 Mercedes 28/95 hp, 83' 300SD, 93' S420, (three) 94' S420's, 95' S500 & 96' S600
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Discussion Starter #12 (Edited)
119.97X-XX chain

Well, heard from 420's Owners today and got an update as follows.
The Owner had used the chain press to install/torque (30 Nm) the master link. Each masterlink pin was individually pressed to 30 Nm and visually verified.

1. As explained by the Owner, crankshaft at 44 degrees BTDC. We went over, reverified engine crank ..... and Owner to not worry of small movement when they previously removed the crank lock. OOPS... removed the cam pins and installed an older chain tensioner for tension on chain. Asked the Owner to remove the crankshaft/flywheel lock. Now, to slowly rotate the crankshaft 1 and 1/2 turns with the provided 1/2" drive/ 27mm socket and and to stop the crankshaft as follows. When at/or a fly-hair before 45 deg BTDC (to allow small move to lock tooth) lock the crankshaft/flywheel with the special MB crankshaft/flywheel lock. Turned out locked right on 45 BTDC. ;o)

2. After reverifing crankshaft lock enplace status, Also, to remove the old chain tensioner and gasket. (13mm nut/bolt and washers).
4. Now, demonstrated the correct final target timing "retarded" position of the intake cam/cam sprocket to the vehicle's Owner and also (moving cam by using the approptate cam's hex journal location) the correct method to safely rotate the right exhaust cam clockwise.... right intake cam clockwise and left intake cam clockwise to allow excess chain be available to allow verifying and final movement of left exhaust cam sprocket to pinned position with no chain movement prior to the cam, etc.... We now demonstrated the correct chain move technique that we use and verballed other incorrect chain method's "prefer'd" not to use. The improper methods usually result with broken "new" guide rails and broken teeth on cam sprockets, etc. So, take your time..... don't use hammers, screwdrivers and other FORCE to accomplish this task. Simply, use the amount of chain available (approx one to two tooth movement across any ONE sprocket) at a time.

3 Now, start at the left exhaust cam and work "COUNTER-CLOCKWISE"! Do not leave any chain movement behind while to ensure both intake cam's are pinned. Making sure BOTH Intake cam sprockets are in the "RETARDED POSITION" (intake sprocket twisted CCW to retarded status with appropriate cam pinned) when chain es placed and chain moved across as tight as possible ie: as to chain movement to a tooth en CCW will allow.... if it will move a tooth...move it, without moving cam.... take ento account as to valve spring tension and normal cam movement with chain en retarded position/place and engine stopped! Main item es "MAKE SURE WHEN" the Tensioner's es en place that all cams are en the as pinned position (for intakes if a little moved to advance, then to now reverify/check... just move with the appropriate intake cam journal to ensure it will move to full retarded position and still be at pinned location and all es fine now! If NOT, have to restart this simple timing task until it es right....

4. Being we already know the chain es within a tooth or so of 45 deg BTDC... We suggested removing the pins at this point. The following es a great excercise to follow if one or two teeth is correction to be completed!

5. When placing the chain to correct sprocket locations and reverifing. Recommend using a hand screw driver en place of Chain Tensioner..... lightly press en/out and ensure there es NO movement of CAMS before installing the TENSIONER. This will/to ensure there is no EXTRA chain movement prior to left exhaust Cam that will allow a possible move of a tooth or so when the ACTUAL TENSION of the Chain Tensioners installation.... and believe me, it will show up and cause you havioc when you turn over the key. Also to reassure cams do not move, except of course the appropriate intake cam back to Full retarded from valve spring movement pushing cam, etc). :surrender:

Another UGLY side is the Not-Retarded (or full advaced chain install position en worse case) Cam Position scenario when installing the chain: Installing in the retarded position will allow the cam position sensor to transmit the Correct Advanced data to the CAN.... other wise a whole can of worms will show itself including to name just a few.... no repeated starting if sucessful at all, power loss on acceleration, bad/ intermittant idle to name ONLY a few. And these and other issues will/can/may appear intermittant and lead some on a real $$$expensive$$$ diagnostic journey.... dependent if, not "Fully" moved as en twisted to end/stop of twist then the chain installed with Intake cam ADJUSTMENT sprockets en "Retarded" position.

GOOD RULE OF THUMB..... when as facing the cam adjuster(s) from the front of engine... ensure the cam(s) are pinned (all in center 6.5mm hole) and the cam adjuster is rotated full CW before setting the "TIGHT" chain upon the gear teeth! When veiwing the cam... the cam is now fully retarded with respect to the cam adjuster and chain in place!

Owner and engine sucessful at 45 degrees BTDC and all cams look good at proper 45 deg (6.5mm holes) locations.

Next task of others is:

1. Owner asked to clean pan witg plastec scraper and then use thin film of Permatek-2 on oil-pan side of gasket only and set same on floor with all bolts holding gasket en place.

2. Before installing same, the rear expanded area will require another coat of sealant to ensure no rear leaks before installation.(as reported en 96' recall). Next time, have a great weekend and we will update of this weekend's Pro-Bono Adventure on Monday, unless the Owner goes Fishing...again.... without us... :) just kidding, will contd' when we are called by Owners.

Oh Well, we're sitting en truck and wanting to go have an good American tradition I am always reminded of!

Have that END of Good Timing, uh I mean "Day.... Beer" Hope everyone else es having a great day too! Attached images should be self explanatory....

Regards, Dutch!
 

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Discussion Starter #13 (Edited)
Reported Installation "Upper Oil Pan" WOES!

Early Saturday morning and our Mercedes S Klasse Owner left report of stripped holes en crankcase for support of Upper Oil Pan. Owner then if we could come over and lend a hand and show him a solution.... Darn if they wanted to drill and retap all the affected bolt holes....:surrender:

I don't think so, not Dutch or any Mechanix working with him if another solution es available!:D

SSOOOOOOOO......After a quick visit to local Sears Tool Area.... with Owner, he now has a solution. :thumbsup: The Craftsman 40 piece Rethreading Set (52105) es less expensive than our shop tap and die sets and will TCO SAE and METRIC en most common sizes with EASE:).

This lil set (images attached) will allow the Owner to run the rethreading tap ento the bolt recess and correct any edges that their face es marred or damaged. I suggested running all bolt holes en the crankcase (Upper) oilpan area and also take the time to utilize the DIE (female portion) to run each bolt to remove any small/minor imperfections en the thread face's and ensure that the oilpan bolts will easily install. All further equipment installation will have a short visit with this equipment (using 11mm and 13mm mostly) to ensure other small problems will not slow the task at hand.

Now, back to working on sailboat.... yes I have another hobby for sure!

Have a great weekend for all! Dutch and crew!
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Oil dip-stick & Filter assy. R/R

Owners ran into a snag when attempting dip-stick install after upper pan en place and oil filter assy not removed. This es why I keep harping on installation plan, ensuring there es a routine en place so installation pattern does not entail install, then remove to install something else, etc. This es also how new components get broken as well! Now enuff of Dutches grouching.....;)

I recommended the oil filter housing be removed and checked for any further debris and while removed to install the dip-stick. Results below..... Owners mouth dropped!

Afterward, they will clean the housing of all debris, verify the check valve es clear of debris and ensure no further contamination. The re-installation will be shown with images, torque values and minor repair to pressure sensor wiring.

Below you can examine the images we gleaned when the Owner removed the filter housing as requested. :thumbsup: This cleanup should be the end of the oil circulation concerns for future life. When repairing the many machines en mine life, I am always proud of how the Dutchland Machine will operate for years, even when abused and not cared for. Other machines would have given it up.... en less than one third the operating lifetime. Darn thes Machines are built to last! Especially when cared for!!!!:)

Regards to all en this holiday weekend.... Dutch
 

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nice pix once again Dutch!

Was the oil sludge build-up secondary to the customer using conventional oil I see? Or, is this a comman when breaking one of these apart with respect to the mileage.
 

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1999 S420
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Thanks God for good and sound advice from competent people. I own a 1999 S420 and is having a problem with hard starting. There are no codes in the computer, but I have a feeling that the crankshaft positioning sensor is out. I would like to replace it, but cannot locate it. Can you point me in the right direction.
 

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1914 Mercedes 28/95 hp, 83' 300SD, 93' S420, (three) 94' S420's, 95' S500 & 96' S600
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284 Posts
Discussion Starter #17
Thanks God for good and sound advice from competent people. I own a 1999 S420 and is having a problem with hard starting. There are no codes in the computer, but I have a feeling that the crankshaft positioning sensor is out. I would like to replace it, but cannot locate it. Can you point me in the right direction.
Hopefully this will assist with your endeavour....
Compliments of WIS/ Work Information System (119 4.2 L) used en Shop

Regards, Dutch
 

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1914 Mercedes 28/95 hp, 83' 300SD, 93' S420, (three) 94' S420's, 95' S500 & 96' S600
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Discussion Starter #18
Was the oil sludge build-up secondary to the customer using conventional oil I see? Or, is this a comman when breaking one of these apart with respect to the mileage.
No, es not the NORM when pulling an Filter Housing off the crankcase. With regular fluid changes and maintenance.... most of the machines are en much better condition. Cleaner and fluid en better viscosity and color, etc. Had I not ran ento the previous oil pan and chain issues.... and the Owner not had the dipstick problem ... and had removed the housing earlier as I suggested when pan's pulled.... well, everything happens for a purpose...yes? And I can only suggest, advise and help only so far, especially with a Pro-Bono effort!

Majority of debris is nylon (crushed and small particulate) due to damaged Nylon Timing Chain guide rails. As the Timing Chain stretched over time, the Tensioner was unable to compensate and the chain started to "whip" and beat the rails ento cracking and coming apart. Keep also en mind that the Cam adjustors en harmony with good position enformation from the cam position sensor can compensate for a good four to six degrees of chain stretch. The more loss of Guide rail support nylon material, the more movement/whip of chain and so on and so on.

The common symptom es a slight tapping at start-up that goes away with a few moments of engine idle. The Chain Tensioner es controlled by Oil Pressure and es a very strong lil fella. It can compensate for only so much chain stretch and then, well excessive chain movement es to be expected with mileage of 125K to 150K US mileage of wear, possibly longer use with regular oil change intervals, etc. I always suggest use of 20/50 wgt. Mobil or any Quality Hydrocarbon product when your machine exceeds 75k of USA mileage. Please, es only our opinion and has held good feedback from many of my friends over the years of use.

I hope this helps with your question, .. Dutch
 

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1914 Mercedes 28/95 hp, 83' 300SD, 93' S420, (three) 94' S420's, 95' S500 & 96' S600
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Discussion Starter #19 (Edited)
Owners moving along... here es an update w/ picture

Went by to check on Owners progress. They asked a question regarding suggested future lubricant R/R intervals, weight and brand and, lubrication, etc.

Responded as follows:

Suggested to use Mercedes OEM filter kit (O-rings, etc), standard grade Castrol motor oil/ 75,000+ mile Plus with 20/50 weight/viscosity.

Interval:
after 500 miles.... oil/ filter change
after 1000 miles.... oil/filter change
after 1500 miles.... oil/filter change... w/ lubrication
after 2000 miles.... oil/filter change
after 2500 miles.... oil/filter change... w/ lubrication
3000 mile intervals there-after es suggested for oil/filter and lubrication. Also, at 6,000 mile interval.... to include removal, cleaning of carbon deposit at ibase of the EGR valve assy. and recheck valve vacumn operation. If carbon is plugging up operation, remember to try cleaning before spending your hard earned funds. Just get out that wet/dry vac. and clean up all the carbon you can within the EGR valve base including within the valves base manifold area


This may seem excessive to some. Please take ento consideration debris, sludge removal and rod of all drains and oil-way passages and findings. This interval has proven good results with other 119 power-plants to ensure a thorough cleaning of flushed out minute particles. Also, ensure a long, productive future.

The Owner has following left, before OBD check/ code clear and startup:
1. Install/ torque:
a. After installation of filter housing/gasket, install lower oil pan, new oil filter, 8.5 qts. of lubricant as noted above.
b. air-pump (mechanical), formed tubing and clutch wiring.
c. A/C compressor and associated hardware.
d. Power-steering unit and associated hoses/ lubricant. Belt Tensioner.
e. both radiator hoses (upper/lower) and both small connecting hoses, 8.5 qts of Mercedes Benz coolant 50/50 mixture with distilled water for total of 16.5 qts.
f. EGR switchover valve and Air-Pump switchover valve control tubing.
g. All new PVC tubing, check valves and installation of Valve Covers.
h. Install new distributor rotor/ caps, plug wires and verify installation. Install new Cam Position sensor and validate the end gap tolerance of sensor.
i. small wiring repair at rear of alternator, visual recheck of wiring connections.
j. hookup ground wire at battery en boot. Install poly groove belt.
k. sync. window operation, door lock/ remotes and enter code for radio operation due to battery disconnection, etc repair.
l. Top off/ recheck all fluids before initial use of starter to rotate engine without ignition for pre-lubrication. Reattach coil wires and start this ol guy. :thumbsup:

We hope everyone has a great weekend, am working again tomorrow on a different owner assist. This will be a little different, being a BMW transmission consult. Will be back here on Sunday for another progress report!

Regards to all, Dutch
 

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Fellows, I need help before I call in the professionals. I have replaced the crankshaft positional sensor, the maf, the temp sensor, the throttle actuator, and now the car will not start. It will turnover, but will not start.. I can smell unburned gas on the rear of the car. But, it will not start.

PS what is the best tool for removing the spark plugs (plug shaft is mighty deep and my crafsman may not release when it is time to reinstall).
 
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