Mercedes-Benz Forum banner
1 - 20 of 27 Posts

·
Registered
1987 300E
Joined
·
65 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I have a 97 E320 and need to know the R134a capacity. I looked for the usual label under the hood but could not find one. It is also not in owners manual - which was no surprise.
I did several searches in the forum but could not find it. Thanks for the help.

Art
 

·
Registered
'04 G55 '80 280GE '99 S420 '98 E320 2011 E350 2016 GLA250
Joined
·
3,104 Posts
What problem is prompting the refill?

Hey.

My '98 E320 takes 950 Grams (Per WIS).

If you are opening the circut, be sure to change the dryer/receiver.

Also, depending on what repair you are doing, you will need to add a specified amount of oil to the circut.

This is why I ask what job you are doing.
 

·
Registered
1922 Ford T no OBD, no ECU, no SCN
Joined
·
37,854 Posts
Having mysterious leak on my 98 model, that holds the coolant for months to completely drain it overnight, I experienced that one can (I think 12 oz) will make the system working, but not efficient since low pressure switch will keep on killing the compressor clutch. 2 cans make it perfect. My static pressure on cold (50 F) morning is 5 bars and on 100 F the system is freezing my elbows.
 

·
Registered
'04 G55 '80 280GE '99 S420 '98 E320 2011 E350 2016 GLA250
Joined
·
3,104 Posts
Having mysterious leak on my 98 model, that holds the coolant for months to completely drain it overnight, I experienced that one can (I think 12 oz) will make the system working, but not efficient since low pressure switch will keep on killing the compressor clutch. 2 cans make it perfect. My static pressure on cold (50 F) morning is 5 bars and on 100 F the system is freezing my elbows.
Kajtek,

I had the same issue, so I FINALLY broke down and went to an A/C shop, who found my "Micro Leak" in the Condensor using a "Sniffer". I changed the condensor myself, and had them refill the system.

I felt environmentally "Guilty" for leaking freon into the atmosphere.

Get it fixed! like I did.
 

·
Registered
1922 Ford T no OBD, no ECU, no SCN
Joined
·
37,854 Posts
It is fixed for now. Didn't add coolant in a month. As Matt suggested the only logical explanation for such strange leak is main compressor seal. Works till it give up.
I am not looking forward to compressor replacement so if I can get away with 3 cans of coolant a year, I am fine with it. It is not like I am dumping hundreds pounds of R12 every month like I did working for automotive shop.
 

·
Registered
1996 210.020
Joined
·
3,972 Posts
I don't know how hard it is to change the compressor shaft seal on our Denso compressors. It is fairly easy on some compressors if you have the proper tools. On many cars, you can change the shaft seal without removing the compressor from the car. The system must be evacuated first.
 

·
Registered
1922 Ford T no OBD, no ECU, no SCN
Joined
·
37,854 Posts
Well.. do MBUSA sells the compressor seals separately?
When I was trying to buy seal for power steering pump, I was offered only whole pump for over $600, or rebuild one for $450.
 

·
Registered
1994 E320 Wagon,1999 E320 Wagon,2000 E 320 Wagon, MGB Track/Rally, ,1988 300E ,more....
Joined
·
6,019 Posts
300 million registered cars in the United States

if 1% 0f them follow the 3 cans a year theory that's 3,000,000 cars * 3cans*12oz. of r134a= 6,750,000 lbs. of 1,1,1,2-Tetrafluoroethane into what little good air we have left.
That figure is optimistically low.The European union estimates that
46,000,000 lbs. R134a is leaked into the atmosphere by it's 200 million cars.That makes our rate equal to 69,000,000 lbs about 10 times my estimate.
Just adding the United States to the EU total adds up to 115,000,000 lbs. of
1,1,1,2-Tetrafluoroethane.(R134a)
That's 23 Olympic sizes pools (capacity 648,000 gallons each)
R134a has a GWP(global warming potential)rating of 1300 times that of CO2
meaning 1lb. of R134a = 1300 lbs. of CO2 as a greenhouse gas
23 Olympic pool fulls of 1,1,1,2-Tetrafluoroethane times 1300 equals the equivalent of 30,000 Olympic sized pools filled with liquid Carbon dioxide
GWP(global warming potential).It takes 130 tanker trucks filled with 5000 gallons to fill one Olympic sized pool.30,000 pools times 130 tanker trucks=
3,900,000 tanker trucks full of liquid CO2 released into the atmosphere.It takes about 52,000,000 W210 tank fulls of gas to produce that much Greenhouse gas.
My opinion to the original poster.Fix the leak.If other people want to pass down onto their children and their children's children the errors of their ways,that is their choice.After all it is a free country.:thumbsup:
The logic a smoker uses is "well I toss out 3 butts a day what's the big deal?"
That times 40 Million (U.S.) estimated smokers is 120million butts a day tossed out.
We are all being covered up with cigarette butts and suffocated with
115,000,000 pounds of 1,1,1,2-Tetrafluoroethane.:eek:
That's just smokers in the U.S. and neglectful of Car Maintenance owners in the U.S. and the European union.Add in the people in the other parts of the world that believe "If I just throw out 3 butts a day on the side of the road" or think "if I can get away with 3 cans of coolant a year, I am fine with it."
and it is no wonder we are having the problems we are.

Now was that diplomatic enough?:D
ohlord :bowdown:


sources sited: a partial list
R134a lethality incident (George Goble)
Development : KONVEKTA AG
Cigarette Smoking Among Adults --- United States, 2001
http://www.umweltdaten.de/publikationen/fpdf-l/3110.pdf
http://www.alliance-co2-solutions.org/docs/greenpeace_letter_jun2008.pdf
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/12/02/automobiles/02COOL.html?_r=1&partner=rssnyt&emc=rss&oref=slogin
 

·
Registered
1994 E320 Wagon,1999 E320 Wagon,2000 E 320 Wagon, MGB Track/Rally, ,1988 300E ,more....
Joined
·
6,019 Posts
Power steering pump

seal buck ninety on autohausaz.com
diy up in the diy section.If that does not work a whole new pump is only $267 delivered.

Kit for nippondenso A/C compressors is about ______________________________________________
SKU: Seals/ Gaskets/ O rings for 1999 Mercedes-Benz E320 (3.2 V6 Gas FI)
Rapid Seal Kit
All Seals For AC
SKU: 99762-P/N: 26768A Auto AC Parts
Our price: $14.31
Any DIY owner with a modicum of ability should
be able to seal their own shaft:eek:
Sniffer to detect r134a leaks
Harbor Freight Tools - Quality Tools at the Lowest Prices
Seven levels of sensitivity
Sure Beats putting 115million pounds of 1,1,1,2-Tetrafluoroethane into the air 3 cans at a time:rolleyes:
ohlord:bowdown:
 

·
Registered
2006 CLK 350
Joined
·
1,133 Posts
Yes... Stop the leak!

G-AMG, where exactly was that micro leak in your condenser??? Was it at a solder joint??? What was that sniffer they used to find the leak?

I guess they will have to substitute CO2 refrigerant for R134a now to save the environment?

Problem is all the developing countries (China and India, etc.) still use R12 freon and no smog/environmental standards/laws ..... three weeks later their smog circles around the globe to us and we pay to clean it up!

:D
 

·
Registered
1994 E320 Wagon,1999 E320 Wagon,2000 E 320 Wagon, MGB Track/Rally, ,1988 300E ,more....
Joined
·
6,019 Posts
Gas and toilet paper?

Do you mean the Hubbert curve? The 1000 EJ (exajoules)that's 1000 times 10 to the 18th power.
1000000000000000000000 that's For non math majors. Or equal to about 16million times the Atomic bomb exploded on Hiroshima.
Or 278933333.33333 Gigawatts (115million round trips for Marty McFly) So if you are asking about how much fuel we burn a year figure about that much energy in Gas.

If you're talking about Hot air(Gas),I will leave that statistic up to you to figure out.

Toilet paper pollution
The Numbers Guy : Saving the Planet, One Square of Toilet Paper at a Time
Or are you talking about the amount needed to clean up after one's own mess?
I will leave that one up to you to calculate also.

Study hard you may be tested on this tomorrow in Class

ohlord:bowdown:
"GOT MATH?"


http://www.iea.org/Textbase/Papers/...rl]http://www.rsc.org/ej/GC/1999/a809539f.pdf
 

·
Registered
1996 210.020
Joined
·
3,972 Posts
G-AMG, where exactly was that micro leak in your condenser??? Was it at a solder joint??? What was that sniffer they used to find the leak?

I guess they will have to substitute CO2 refrigerant for R134a now to save the environment?

Problem is all the developing countries (China and India, etc.) still use R12 freon and no smog/environmental standards/laws ..... three weeks later their smog circles around the globe to us and we pay to clean it up!

:D
The problem with CO2 is the extremely high pressures required. 134a runs pretty high and can hurt you pretty easily, but CO2 systems will run at about 2000 psi. I'm hoping that hydrocarbons gain acceptance instead.

As for R12 use, I don't really think that the R12 from refrigeration systems was ever the trouble. The real problem was aerosols, many of which used Freon for the propellant. I don't think that anyone uses Freon propellants anymore, even in China or India.
 

·
Registered
'04 G55 '80 280GE '99 S420 '98 E320 2011 E350 2016 GLA250
Joined
·
3,104 Posts
Condensor Leak

Unit Freebie,

Actually, it was such a small leak, it took TWO separate visits to find, even with a sniffer.

From this pic in the DIY seciton, you can see a faint "Ring" of Oil radiating out from what is probably a tiny Rock which damaged the coil, on the "Driver's side" of the condensor (LHD).
 

Attachments

·
Registered
1994 E320 Wagon,1999 E320 Wagon,2000 E 320 Wagon, MGB Track/Rally, ,1988 300E ,more....
Joined
·
6,019 Posts
Tip

for finding leaks with a sniffer.Put a garbage sack over the condenser and after an hour insert the probe.If suspected in the evaporator,just junk the car:D
ohlord:bowdown:
 

·
Registered
2006 CLK 350
Joined
·
1,133 Posts
1 small can of R134 WITH leak sealant should do the trick...

:) thanks for pix/info on freon leak/detector....

uh.. but... I will have to think really hard about junking my baby if the evaporator has the leak!!!

Most likely it is a small one, most people would just add a can of R134a every year, but shouldn't the freon with the sealant/oil/high mileage freon stop the small leaks???

:rolleyes:
 

·
Registered
1996 210.020
Joined
·
3,972 Posts
:) thanks for pix/info on freon leak/detector....

uh.. but... I will have to think really hard about junking my baby if the evaporator has the leak!!!
It's a lot of work to change the evaporator. Figure on spending a few days on it. Or a few thousand dollars if you take it to a shop.

Most likely it is a small one, most people would just add a can of R134a every year, but shouldn't the freon with the sealant/oil/high mileage freon stop the small leaks???

:rolleyes:
That's what it says on the can. And in fact, there are probably some systems for which this will work. Unfortunately, you have no way of knowing if it will help at all, or if it will have very bad effects.

O-ring conditioners are simple seal-swelling chemicals. If your o-rings are not leaking, introducing seal swellers may make them start. It could also be bad for your compressor shaft seal.

Real leak sealers should be avoided at ALL costs. Never put that stuff into your refrigerant. It wreaks havoc with all sorts of things unless the system is completely dry. Even if the system is completely dry and the sealer doesn't plug your dryer or expansion valve, the next time you want professional AC service, you will be shown to the door. That stuff can cause thousands of dollars of damage to the AC recovery machine.

There is one more thing to consider when you have a leaky system, and that is compressor oil migration. I'm not talking about oil leaking out with the refrigerant, because you are unlikely to lose much oil to a slow leak. I'm talking about the ability of the refrigerant to return oil to the compressor. Being even a few ounces low on 134a seriously diminishes the capability for the oil to be blown through the evaporator and back to the compressor.

Keep it leak-free and keep it full of nothing but pure R134a and PAG-46 oil.
 

·
Registered
1994 E320 Wagon,1999 E320 Wagon,2000 E 320 Wagon, MGB Track/Rally, ,1988 300E ,more....
Joined
·
6,019 Posts
1 - 20 of 27 Posts
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top