[darraghodonnell]

I have my car since 65000 miles - now 110000 miles...it has suffered rough idle that no mechanic/indy has been able to locate - finally I checked the part number of the HARMONIC BALANCER aka Crankshaft Pulley because I have been advised by many at this forum-
Anyway the part number is A 112 035 00 00
I read in a post that this exact part was recalled - maybe it is the source of the rough Idle - (believe me, I have done everything else to try and smooth the car - mounts sparks maf cleaned throttle, air cylinder test etc etc etc)
1. Can someone confirm if this is a recalled part?
2. Is the recall applicable in Ireland?
3. If so , What is the standard way of getting satisfaction from Mercedes?
4. The car has gotten progressively shakey since I have owned it - is there anything else I need to ask mercedes to include because of potential damage the faulty recalled part may have caused?

Thank you for listening,
Darragh

 

[SunGuy61]

Main Text of MB's Harmonic Balancer Campaign

This was the US recall/service campaign language that came out some time ago. The material doesn't say whether it is US only or worldwide. The best and easiest thing for you to do is call any MB Dealer, give the Service Advisor
your VIN and request a VMI lookup to see if this or any other service campaign/recall applies to you.


FILE:
SERVICE: GROUP 00 OF SERVICE INFORMATION BINDER
PARTS: GROUP I OF INFORMATION _ PARTS & ACCESSORIES BINDER

Campaign No. 2005020003 April 2005

Revised May 2005

Revised July 2005

Revised December 2005

This revised Service Campaign bulletin 2005020003 supercedes previously issued Service Campaign bulletin 2005020003 released in July 2005. This campaign has been updated to include model 463.

Please destroy all previous Service Campaign bulletin versions.

TO: ALL MERCEDES-BENZ CENTERS

SUBJECT:
MODELS 163, 202, 208, 210 WITH ENGINES 112,
MODELS 129, 163, 202, 208, 210 215, 220, 463 WITH ENGINES 113,
MODEL YEARS 1998-2000;
MODEL 170 WITH ENGINE 112, MODEL YEAR 2001

INSPECT, IF NECESSARY REPLACE HARMONIC BALANCER PULLEY

This Service Campaign has been initiated because DCAG has determined that due to a supplier quality problem the harmonic balancer pulley in certain model year 1998-2001 vehicles may, depending upon vehicle use characteristics, be subject to high under-hood temperatures that can, over a long period of time, cause it to deteriorate. Prior to a harmonic balancer pulley deteriorating to a point of affecting vehicle performance and drivability, it will create several different types of driver warnings such as noticeable engine vibrations. Affected vehicles will be checked and the harmonic balancer replaced, as required.

Shown in this bulletin is a sample copy of a letter which owners of the affected vehicles will receive.

Prior to performing this Service Campaign:

^ Please check VMI to insure the vehicle has not been previously repaired for this condition and does not have other open campaigns.

^ Please review the entire Service Campaign bulletin.

^ Please verify the customer has presented a letter or has a complaint related to the harmonic balancer (explained above).


Approximately 363,487 vehicles are affected.

 

[Check Codes]

If you go to the general forum and search for threads I started mentioning harmonic balancer you'll find the details, including the two suspect part numbers involved in the recall. I'd link it for you but I'm on a smartphone.

However, IIRC it was a recall only in the US.

How does the rubber insert on yours look? Even if not recalled (or the suspect PN) if it is deteriorated or bulging irregularly it should be replaced.

That said, when they go south it usually affects more than just idle.

Good luck.

 

[wayneg]

When I first got my car I took it to a local Indy in London for servicing and a once over. They picked up the Harmonic Balancer was on the way out and told of the potential for massive damage. This was not a recall in the UK, the car was low miles with full MB dealer history. I could see the balancer visibly wobbling once pointed out and when removed could see the state of delamination of the rubber. It should be easy enough to check yours and not that costly to replace with the added benefit of peace of mind .

 

[monkeymerc]

Sorry for the stupid question but where is this located any pics so I can check mine

 

[miketiggy]

Sorry for the stupid question but where is this located any pics so I can check mine

there it is ...
* M112K Crank pulley / Vibration Damper / Harmonic Balancer information * - MBWorld.org Forums

 

[monkeymerc]

there it is ...
* M112K Crank pulley / Vibration Damper / Harmonic Balancer information * - MBWorld.org Forums

Many thanks all clear now:thumbsup:

 

[miketiggy]

I read a lot of horror stories regarding the failure of this item
so i think replacing it before its too late is important and money saving

check many stories here Crankshaft Balancer Failure! UPDATED - PeachParts Mercedes ShopForum

 

[darraghodonnell]

Hi,
I spoke to a service man and emailed the letter which is attached below to one main dealer and he said because it is dated 2005 it is irrelevant.....does the date matter?
I called three dealers to ask if there is any recall on my chassis number and none show up - when I asked they said the source of information is Germany.
I think they just don't want to know.
Next step?

thank you for the informative replies
regards
darragh

 

[SunGuy61]

Hi,
I spoke to a service man and emailed the letter which is attached below to one main dealer and he said because it is dated 2005 it is irrelevant.....does the date matter?
I called three dealers to ask if there is any recall on my chassis number and none show up - when I asked they said the source of information is Germany.
I think they just don't want to know.
Next step?

thank you for the informative replies
regards
darragh

darragh,
When you pose the question about 'next step', I went back to read this entire thread and have a couple questions for you...

- In your first post you wrote about the HB recall and part #, etc., but I didnt' read anything that indicates your tech believes that your Harmonic Balancer is the root cause of the vibration problem. Did he ever say this?
If you don't have the perceived fault confirmed by a qualified tech, wouldn't your next step be to have it inspected to determine the facts?

- If it is the source of your problem, then are you really asking, 'who pays to fix it' when apparently there was no recall outside of the US. The 'next step' that I see in this event, is either write the check to have it repaired, or bundle up all the documentation you can get your hands on, make an appointment with the Service Manager or General Manager of the nearest Mercedes dealer and negotiate directly with him/her for Mercedes to pay for it.

It's hard for me to believe that a bad part in the US is only confined to the US and not the rest of the world. Perhaps our NTSB (Nat. Transportation Safety Board) is more rigid in it's findings than elsewhere, but the simple fact would remain, a bad part is a bad part. Hypothetically, if you tansported the car to the US and re-titled it here, would the recall apply? In my opinion, your best bet is direct negotiation (leaving out my sarcasm) with the Dealer armed with the FACTS.

 

[darraghodonnell]

Sunguy,

I have diagnosed it as the fault by process of elimination.
I have had various (5 of whom 2 impressed me) mercedes indy mechanics -unable to diagnose the idle problem - all say the car is faultless but acknowledge its vibrations -
The following has been done since I own the car
MAF
PLUGS
HT LEADS
VALVE COVER GASKETS
BATTERY
CPS
ALL FILTERS
OIL
Two fuel additives and one Engine cleaner through the oil pre oil change
REMOVED CLEANED THROTTLE BODY AND EGR VALVE
AIR CYLINDER TEST HOT AND COLD
NO FAULT CODES
NO leaks from anywhere
TWO NEW COILS swapped around to see if improvement
nothing made any difference
Oh yeah - got the gearbox rebuilt
I sat in an S Class same year same engine and similar shakiness was happening but not felt from the drivers seat.

Process of elimination really - At this stage I know the car pretty well though don't claim to be in any way officially qualified - So after having read a lot about this Crankshaft pulley I checked the part number and it is one of the recalled numbers - It is not visibly wobbling or falling apart but it is cracked several times on the rubber circle that is facing me looking down into the engine - It has to be the problem??

If I get the part myself how do I know if it isn't a rubbish one - Mercedes Ireland wants €246 plus vat and I can get a Febi Bilstein for €104 all in from GSF car parts-
I accept either go with paperwork or just fork out but I don't like being told a recall doesnt count because it is out of date - that has to be BS.


I don't want the hassle however but what if loads of damage is done already - is that mercedes fault?

QUESTIONS_
1. How do I know visually if the HB is damaged by visual inspection?
2. If it hasn't broken up does that mean I am probably not after doing more damage?


Thank you,
D.

 

[SunGuy61]

If I get the part myself how do I know if it isn't a rubbish one - Mercedes Ireland wants €246 plus vat and I can get a Febi Bilstein for €104 all in from GSF car parts- I checked the Harmonic Balancer OEM supplier for my car and it's Corteco, on our side of the pond. It prices out at $74 from one of our on-line parts guys (autohausaz). As long as whoever you get the part from warrantees it, you should be ok.

I don't want the hassle however but what if loads of damage is done already - is that mercedes fault?

You probably know the answer to this rhetorical question already. If MB is not going to take any responsibility to replace this part, if bad, then they're certainly not going to accept the incidental or consequential damages that this part may or may not have caused

QUESTIONS_
1. How do I know visually if the HB is damaged by visual inspection?
In one of the previous posts in this thread, someone provided a link to another site that had pictures of what a bad one looks like.
2. If it hasn't broken up does that mean I am probably not after doing more damage? I'm not 100% clear on what you're asking here. If as you state, you can see cracks around the rim/rubber circle, if it were my car, I'd change it out sooner rather than later.


Thank you,
D.

Bob

 

[Check Codes]

Sunguy,

I have diagnosed it as the fault by process of elimination.
I have had various (5 of whom 2 impressed me) mercedes indy mechanics -unable to diagnose the idle problem - all say the car is faultless but acknowledge its vibrations -
The following has been done since I own the car
MAF
PLUGS
HT LEADS
VALVE COVER GASKETS
BATTERY
CPS
ALL FILTERS
OIL
Two fuel additives and one Engine cleaner through the oil pre oil change
REMOVED CLEANED THROTTLE BODY AND EGR VALVE
AIR CYLINDER TEST HOT AND COLD
NO FAULT CODES
NO leaks from anywhere
TWO NEW COILS swapped around to see if improvement
nothing made any difference
Oh yeah - got the gearbox rebuilt
I sat in an S Class same year same engine and similar shakiness was happening but not felt from the drivers seat.

Process of elimination really - At this stage I know the car pretty well though don't claim to be in any way officially qualified - So after having read a lot about this Crankshaft pulley I checked the part number and it is one of the recalled numbers - It is not visibly wobbling or falling apart but it is cracked several times on the rubber circle that is facing me looking down into the engine - It has to be the problem??

If I get the part myself how do I know if it isn't a rubbish one - Mercedes Ireland wants €246 plus vat and I can get a Febi Bilstein for €104 all in from GSF car parts-
I accept either go with paperwork or just fork out but I don't like being told a recall doesnt count because it is out of date - that has to be BS.


I don't want the hassle however but what if loads of damage is done already - is that mercedes fault?

QUESTIONS_
1. How do I know visually if the HB is damaged by visual inspection?
2. If it hasn't broken up does that mean I am probably not after doing more damage?


Thank you,
D.

One thing I note conspicuously absent from your list is the motor mounts. When they leak out enough (it's just a small amount of fluid over a long time) then you will feel the engine vibrations at idle in gear. It's usually smooth in neutral, but under a loaded idle it's obvious, then it goes away once you're off-idle. They are relatively inexpensive (about $85 each in the US) and a couple of hours labor to replace.



Re: the HB, just google for bad ones. This is off a mustang, obviously if the rubber is coming out to any appreciable extent, either on the inside or out, you need to replace it.

 

[SunGuy61]

Check Codes,
Good catch on the transmission mounts. When I read that he had his trans rebuilt, I assumed new mounts were installed. Nonetheless, they can still go bad and should be checked for leaking.

Bob

 

[Check Codes]

Check Codes,
Good catch on the transmission mounts. When I read that he had his trans rebuilt, I assumed new mounts were installed. Nonetheless, they can still go bad and should be checked for leaking.

Bob

Just for the sake of clarity: engine, not transmission. The engine mounts are hydraulic, the transmission mount is suspended rubber. (When the transmission mount sags, it can impart a vibration, but it's typically so minimal most people don't notice it.)

Usually on an older car you won't be able to tell anything by a visual inspection of the motor mounts. The volume of fluid is minimal and it seeps out very slowly, so there is no evidence of an issue. But when you pull a collapsed one out and place it next to a new one, it's VERY evident as you can see below.

While this pic is from the W210 chassis (and they are different parts), the design of the hydraulic mount is quite similar.

Mine were not as bad as pictured, but when I replaced them the difference was dramatic. As much work as our Irish friend has already done, this would seem to be the most likely culprit.

Darragh, the part number from the EPC for the mounts (there are two, same PN) is A1402402017.

 

[darraghodonnell]

Sorry, I knew I forgot to mention something, the two front mounts and transmission mount were replaced with original mercedes parts.

No fault codes.

Sunguy, - the HB hasn't broken up but may be the cause of the shakiness since I own the car - I was asking - do you think lots of damage has been done already because of the shakiness for 50000 miles (oil pan damage etc) or do you think I will get away with it as long as I replace the HB before it breaks up? (I am getting it done this week)


thanks all
Darragh

 

[wayneg]

My understanding of the damaged caused is that if the wobble becomes great enough the pulley starts to rub on the engine front cover. If this rubbing becomes excessive it can smash the cover with presumably catastrophic results.

 

[miketiggy]

My understanding of the damaged caused is that if the wobble becomes great enough the pulley starts to rub on the engine front cover. If this rubbing becomes excessive it can smash the cover with presumably catastrophic results.

Just came back from my indy ... exactly what you mention started to happen...
The pulley separated in two parts and it was a matter of hours to make major destructions
I believe i got lucky

As my indy said it usually gives a signal the pulley when it goes out of allingnment so when in idle you hear a strange noise(like a helicopter in my case) from the front end take it straight to the mechanic


m

 

[rorypff]

Did you have the vibration before the transmission was rebuilt? It could be an out of balance torque convertor.

 

[darraghodonnell]

Rory- Was there before gearbox was done. The idle was in the car when I first bought it - just the odd surge at idle which gradually progressed into a constant vibration 5 seconds after the engine is turned on and and worsens as I engage any of the other pulleys around which the serpentine belt spins eg - turning the wheel thus activating the steering pump or turning on the aircon.

I ran it and stared at the HB today - no uneveness in the rubber as the HB spins and no wobbling.

I have ordered a new one anyway.


thanks all
Darragh