[bikedoctor]

Ok, so I've been a German car guy for a while, but I'm having some second thoughts on this one. I've got an opportunity for a 1999 E430 with 106k on the clock for a decent deal ($9500). It is supposed to have been a Penske exec car and there is a logbook in the trunk. I have it right now at my house and was able to take it to my garage for an inspection. All looks well aside from three areas. The problem that was identified was an inopperable A/C. Doesn't seem like a big deal as the pressure sensor reads 00. I'm thinking fill it up and see. Next I remove the backseat to see the happenings of the battery compartment and find piles of the light green corrosion powder. I do not know what to make of that, but the vent tube that exits the bottom ends without connecting to the battery. Worse yet the front driver's side spring perch is corroded quite a bit causing concerns. Does anyone know how MBUSA will treat such an old car or will it be on a dealer by dealer basis? Any thoughts? I'm going to try and post pictures, but I'm not sure it will be a success.

This car is to be my wife's and she is to have our baby in August. Right now she has an SLK and I'm thinking its time to grow up. She loves her baby Benz, but its time for a four door and to think a bit more about safety. What are your thoughts?

 

[bikedoctor]

No one?

No one has anything to offer? Spring perch? Worrisome? Should I see about the stealership helping?

 

[acarter53]

You have not purchased the car yet, by your e-mail. If you are buying from a private seller, I would not put my wife in that car until the SP issue was addressed. You will have to pay to have this fixed. If you do a search on the forum, you will find more info than you can read in a day about it. If you are buying from a dealer just have them address the issues before you purchase the car. Good luck!

 

[Benzboy124]

My $0.02 -

Do not buy that car until the spring perch is properly (reputable dealer) fixed. Period.

I don't think the battery issue is a huge deal, I would clean things up, get the battery inspected and replaced if necessary and make sure that compartment is properly vented (tube installed correctly).

AC - determine the source of the leak. Could be an easy fix (not as likely) or could be something like a leaking evaporator (more likely and $$$ to fix).

Good luck, the E430 is a great car!

 

[jlomon]

The a/c issue could be expensive depending on where the leak is, but it wont be life-threatening. I can't say the same thing for the spring perch. Don't touch the car unless it is repaired first. I'd also make sure it was repaired at a facility that was acceptable to you. I'd hate to have them do a half-assed job on it within their own facilities and then you suffer the failure a few years down the road. A spring perch failure in the wrong time and place could be fatal.

 

[Check Codes]

Hey, bikedoctor.

I tend to lean with my comrades here.

I'd contact MB about the spring-perch, it's a known problem and you should be able to argue them into doing something for you.

The AC is not just a fill, if there's no refrigerant in it, that suggests a pretty good leak, and it will also have to be evacuated and the drier may need to be replaced, all before it is refilled. Depending on the cause of the leak, you could be looking at well over a grand for this fix.

The battery...well, assuming the corrosion hasn't weakened the floorpan, you can just clean it up, get a new vent tube and run it out as it's supposed to be. But until you start the cleanup you won't know.

Personally, unless the car was just an amazing deal, I'd keep looking. (The price you mentioned only sounds decent, not amazing enough to entice me.)

Even if you are a german car guy (what kind of bikes, BTW??) I'd also suggest you have it inspected by an indie familiar with the marque, you've found some obvious things, the money spent in the search for the less-obvious things would be well worth it. IMHO this car has not been well-maintained, so there may be lots of other things to surface.

Take care and enjoy the ride,
Greg

 

[bikedoctor]

Thanks

The A/C is starting to bother me now...

The battery compartment never really did too much.

The spring perch is what's really on my mind. I have a call in to an authorized MB collision center (which has my wife's SLK at present) about the perch. The lady told me they would take it in, inspect it and contact MBUSA about fixing the known problem.

I do have a feeling that, in the beginning of its life, it was well taken care of. Lately it has been sitting for a while. In that time the A/C issue is said to have reared its head and I'm thinking the battery acted up in the same time frame.

So the verdict is pass on this one?

 

[Check Codes]

The A/C is starting to bother me now...

The battery compartment never really did too much.

The spring perch is what's really on my mind. I have a call in to an authorized MB collision center (which has my wife's SLK at present) about the perch. The lady told me they would take it in, inspect it and contact MBUSA about fixing the known problem.

I do have a feeling that, in the beginning of its life, it was well taken care of. Lately it has been sitting for a while. In that time the A/C issue is said to have reared its head and I'm thinking the battery acted up in the same time frame.

So the verdict is pass on this one?

If you really like this car for some reason, then get solid repair estimates for the spring perch and AC. That gives you bargaining power to pull down the price (which would be good if the car didn't send shivers down my spine). You're also looking at flushing/changing every fluid in the car, including ATF, differential, oil (duh) coolant, power steering and brake fluid, since it's unlikely those have been touched, other than perhaps the oil. That mileage is also the range for shock, O2 sensor and spark plug replacement, and that stuff is probably all told close to $1000 - and that's if you supply the labor.

There are lots and lots (and lots!) of 210s out there, unless there is something about this one that just melts your heart (or they cut the price a lot) then there's no reason to spend lots of time digging into this one and getting it back to being solidly roadworthy.

Take care and enjoy the ride,
Greg

 

[acarter53]

^ + 1 Do you have pics of the rest of the car? Lets see her body.

 

[Musikmann]

I would walk away from that car. There are so many others for sale that have had TLC that I don't think it is worth any further consideration.

 

[bikedoctor]

Update

The brake fluid has been flushed per the records at 100k and the pads/rotors look very good. It has new tires and the shocks feel fine for now, but it did not appear they had been replaced. I was planning on doing the ATF, coolant, plugs and oil. Would a shop be able to give me an A/C estimate without filling the system, which might entail a drier? I'm no good with A/C yet as either my cars have not had it or its worked without issue. There are two small dings on the driver's side and the rims have some peeling clear coat, but those are the only two cosmetic issues. The interior is without issue aside from a very small (<1") crack in the dash near the pass airbag.

The good news is I've gotten them to drop the price to $8500 due to the spring perch. I'm waiting to hear back from the stealership/collision shop regarding MBUSA picking up part of the tab for the perches. While its apart I'm assuming ball joints would be in order, but what else?

The reason this one is a target right now is two fold: most importantly, the wife likes it and the timing is right for us to stay out of another car payment while having the flexibility of 4 vehicles.

Thank you all for your input.

 

[Kajtek1]

All those models have the perch issue, so walking away from this car will not walk you away from the issue. I think adding some weld to them shouldn't be costly, since you don't have to worry about repainting. Just make sure they properly seal it from water.
AC can be $10 for couple cans of freon, or $3000 for new compressor. This is the tricky one.

 

[Check Codes]

The brake fluid has been flushed per the records at 100k and the pads/rotors look very good. It has new tires and the shocks feel fine for now, but it did not appear they had been replaced. I was planning on doing the ATF, coolant, plugs and oil. Would a shop be able to give me an A/C estimate without filling the system, which might entail a drier? I'm no good with A/C yet as either my cars have not had it or its worked without issue. There are two small dings on the driver's side and the rims have some peeling clear coat, but those are the only two cosmetic issues. The interior is without issue aside from a very small (<1") crack in the dash near the pass airbag.

The good news is I've gotten them to drop the price to $8500 due to the spring perch. I'm waiting to hear back from the stealership/collision shop regarding MBUSA picking up part of the tab for the perches. While its apart I'm assuming ball joints would be in order, but what else?

The reason this one is a target right now is two fold: most importantly, the wife likes it and the timing is right for us to stay out of another car payment while having the flexibility of 4 vehicles.

Thank you all for your input.

Assuming the thing runs, a good indie (why go to the dealer?) will be able to pressurize the AC system without replacing anything so they can check it. A fair price for a system check/diagnosis is in the $100 range, depending on where you are and how busy they are that could be up to $150, particularly since they have to fill it with refrigerant. That's just the check and diagnosis, other parts and labor are going to heap on top of that. Many shops will discount the diagnosis if you authorize the repair, but that could be a deal breaker anyway. Personally I'd call around and be up front with the folks, tell them it's empty of refrigerant, how much will they charge to leak test it?

That said, I can't help you with your wife liking it. Worst case scenario for you is if you move ahead and the car turns into a money pit of questionable reliability, no way can you tell her "I told you so" and avoid sleeping on the sofa. Lay all the cards out for her (heck, let her read this thread) so her eyes are wide open, she may decide it's better to look for a different one.

Take care and enjoy the ride,
Greg

 

[bikedoctor]

Next Step

So I talked with the service manager at the stealership about the perch, MBUSA and helping a little guy like me out. I think this is the reason there are so many mixed stories/results out there. He gets a certain "goodwill" allowance per month from MBUSA to use for issues he deems deserving. He said (of course) its not much, but he uses it for customers that purchased there cars there or have a low mileage issue. I asked about pursuing it with MBUSA and he said he thought that to be a dead end. So, upon purchase I would be on the hook for the spring perch.

Soooo, it is now at an indie awaiting A/C inspection. If I had to guess, it will be the evaporator as that seems to be an issue. There is a superb write up I found regarding dismantling the ENTIRE dash to get to it. That is likely what I'll do and see if they'll knock another $2500 off the price. Anyone done that before? The parts are somewhat inexpensive at thepartsbin.com.

 

[bikedoctor]

Update

Naturally its the evaporator on the A/C problem. Ok, the indie MB shop suggested a sealant they have successfully used on 4 Es prior with one still fine from late last year. I told them to go ahead even if it only buys me some time. I don't have time for the dash removal at present as I'm finishing up a gutted kitchen renovation. Has anyone heard of this or had any experience with it?

I got a $600 estimate from an authorized MB collision center for the spring perch. The plan is to pick up our 170 and leave the 210.

We're going to go for it if the A/C patch holds. Thanks for all the help. If it works out you'll be hearing from me more. If it turns out to be a mistake you'll be hearing from me A LOT more!

Now, about getting a repair manual...

 

[Kajtek1]

Repairs manuals are costly and from what I know MB supplies them on protected disks only.
This forum is much cheaper and more practice oriented
Welcome to the MB club

 

[bikedoctor]

Thanks

I've been around the 170 forum quite a bit and am somewhat familiar with MBs in general.

I saw a link to an MB CD for $95; does anyone have this and how informative is it. $95 is worth it to me as I don't have internet at my garage. Any other manuals suggested?