Mercedes-Benz Forum banner

1 - 10 of 10 Posts

·
Registered
W210 E55
Joined
·
149 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Guys,
I've had so many noises since I purchased this car, less than a year ago, I'm starting to regret it. I now have a pulsing wa-wa-wa-wa-wa-wa sound that I've always considered to be tire noise (bad or unevenly worn). Problem is, I JUST replaced the tires (less than 200 miles). They were road force balanced, but not sure how competent the tech was. I noticed the same (but less invasive) noise on my way home from the tire shop. I assumed that was just the tread soaking it up. I also started getting a warbling/rumbling feel through the cabin. I felt the tires were ruled out so probably rear axle/wheel bearings, right? (I r&r front bearings about 3k/mi ago) Recent MB alignment/inspection had also noted a leaking diff and typical front LCA bushing/ball joint wear. Indie confirmed rear bearings were both bad. Had him replace both bearings (right was shot), drop diff., replace/upgrade both side seals, clean/inspect/reseal cover of diff., oil change and put it all back together. ride is much better now, but I still have the slight (but quite audible) pulsing wa-wa-wa-wa sound from my rear tires? Seems to come as the tires heat up. The guy at a local tire shop said "road force balancing wouldn't do anything for a noise like that", so I had it balanced "again"! I wanted to call BS, but he's a tire guy? Is that correct? Should I waste money on another road force balance (not from him)? Should I get another alignment, as much of the rear was ripped out and put back in?

Other ideas:
Bent rim?
Bent axle shaft?

These don't seem likely as I know I haven't hit anything and it has surfaced after I bought the car. Wasn't there 7 months ago when I bought it.

Thoughts?

Thanks in advance!!
 

·
Registered
2000 W210 E55 AMG, Silver/Black - Stock
Joined
·
611 Posts
I feel your pain. I went through the same thing only to find a bent rim which ruined one tire and after tire replacement, rim repair, and alignment, the noise seems to have stayed away but I do hear a slight noise coming back. Not sure how much worse it will get.

Here are my thoughts:

1. Make sure your tire pressure is correct. Run it on the lower end of the possible ranges.
2. After raising the wheels, grab each one and tug left right, up down, in out. Make sure there is no popping or clunking, even slight. This is an indication of worn or out of adjustment bearings. Sometimes you can catch worn bushings this way too. I changed my front wheel bearings myself using a press. I had to tighten the bearings several times over the following eight weeks or so until they did not need tightening any more and stayed properly preloaded. If this was not done, over time, my tires would have worn unevenly, and I would have ruined my new bearings.
3. Put the car up on stands and with the wheels around eye level and spin them. Eye for any out of round. Looking at the wheel from the side, and front or back of car. Close one eye, line up the other eye on an edge, and spin (or have it spun) continuously until you are satisfied you are not seeing ANY out of round. Do this on the tire tread face, sidewall, and rim edge from the appropriate vantage point.
4. Inspect every bushing and ball joint carefully.
4. Before ANY alignment, the tech MUST perform step 2 above. Not doing so might mean they are adjusting to a condition as the car sits on the alignment machine. A four wheel alignment should be done as our cars have independent multilink rear suspension
5. Inspect the sub-frame bushings. Apparently they are hydraulic and can fail just like motor mounts which may allow sounds/vibrations into the cabin that are normal but would otherwise not be there.
6. To help isolate the source of the noise, you can buy a wireless four microphone setup that will let you affix mics to various points around the car and listen while you drive. They are under $200 on Amazon and eBay. I have read that wired ones are not nearly as good.
 

·
Registered
W210 E55
Joined
·
149 Posts
Discussion Starter #3 (Edited)
I feel your pain. I went through the same thing only to find a bent rim which ruined one tire and after tire replacement, rim repair, and alignment, the noise seems to have stayed away but I do hear a slight noise coming back. Not sure how much worse it will get.

Here are my thoughts:

1. Make sure your tire pressure is correct. Run it on the lower end of the possible ranges.
2. After raising the wheels, grab each one and tug left right, up down, in out. Make sure there is no popping or clunking, even slight. This is an indication of worn or out of adjustment bearings. Sometimes you can catch worn bushings this way too. I changed my front wheel bearings myself using a press. I had to tighten the bearings several times over the following eight weeks or so until they did not need tightening any more and stayed properly preloaded. If this was not done, over time, my tires would have worn unevenly, and I would have ruined my new bearings.
3. Put the car up on stands and with the wheels around eye level and spin them. Eye for any out of round. Looking at the wheel from the side, and front or back of car. Close one eye, line up the other eye on an edge, and spin (or have it spun) continuously until you are satisfied you are not seeing ANY out of round. Do this on the tire tread face, sidewall, and rim edge from the appropriate vantage point.
4. Inspect every bushing and ball joint carefully.
4. Before ANY alignment, the tech MUST perform step 2 above. Not doing so might mean they are adjusting to a condition as the car sits on the alignment machine. A four wheel alignment should be done as our cars have independent multilink rear suspension
5. Inspect the sub-frame bushings. Apparently they are hydraulic and can fail just like motor mounts which may allow sounds/vibrations into the cabin that are normal but would otherwise not be there.
6. To help isolate the source of the noise, you can buy a wireless four microphone setup that will let you affix mics to various points around the car and listen while you drive. They are under $200 on Amazon and eBay. I have read that wired ones are not nearly as good.
Hey buddy. Thanks for the info. I was actually thinking the higher end of the TP range would be better as it seems louder at lower pressures. I'm running 44 rear and 37 front right now. Has anyone ever figured out the proper tire pressure for the W210 E55 from the various stickers on the car? I read my eyes dry last night trying to find something concrete. Just seemed like a bunch of people guessing. The one thing that made any sense to me was someone "speculating" that the gas door was meant for a base 210 while the driver door plaque was replaced by AMG. That would mean 48r/42f is correct..but even I find it hard to swallow. Who knows though, maybe some of the problems with rear bearings have stemmed from running low pressure (comparatively speaking)? Sure have seen a rash of them on here. 390 ft/lb of torque is probably not a wheel bearings friend either. Every tire guy I've ever asked says to use what's in the door on US model cars. IS ANYONE ON HERE 100% CERTAIN WHAT TIRE PRESSURE WE SHOULD BE RUNNING??? If so, please provide the numbers and source of your info. (thanks)

Yeh, both rear bearings were professionally replaced 2 days ago and my indie is pretty good about inspecting things around the problem area. He also resealed the diff (except pinion seal). Had him pop off the breather/vent and clean it too. I did my own front bearings as well. Carefully banged out old races and used them to "carefully" bang in the new ones. Used an entire tube of green goodness on 2 bearings... mashed..pressed..mashed. My indie said they were fine but did need adjustment once and may be the culprit here. I'll have them checked and adjusted as my next move.

Your advice on rocking the rear wheels to find worn bushings is golden as is the hydraulic sub frame bushings (I thought the rear were solid based on just eye balling them). Is r&r a DIY on those?

My alignment was done by MB less than 600 miles ago, but a lot has been done in that time.

Chassis ears were part of our original conversation when I was hunting the first noise (random 60mph vibration). They are in my amazon cart still..but I'll try a few more cheaper things before I drop the $200. I really don't think it's a bent rim because I know I've not hit anything (not even a slightly rough pot hole), and it wasn't doing this during my 6 hour test drive or even for several months after purchase. Was yours visible? Did you simply take a chance and have it tested/repaired? I've done it on my coupe before when someone left a brick paver in the road for me...

Thanks again and I guess I'll continue down the process of elimination path. If I can get it right, I'll never let it go! Love the car, but feeling fooled by all the "bulletproof" claims..even though I know the motor is a tank and these other issues will end sometime.
 

·
Registered
2000 W210 E55 AMG, Silver/Black - Stock
Joined
·
611 Posts
Sounds like you have covered your bases so far. My front pass side rim was bent (dinged?) on the inside edge. It was hard to detect just by looking at it. My inde caught it and showed me but wasn't sure it would ever cause trouble. 12 months later that tire was howling and had developed regular flat spots (uneven wear). I had no other real issues other than the ball joints which were still pretty OK but needed replacing, which I did.

I forgot about it until I went to a tire shop and they flagged it. It was very noticeable upon spinning the wheel on a lift.

I had the rim repaired for $140, bought new tires, and its been fine so far.

Someone did a write up on replacing the sub-frame mounts. Looked like a bit of a pain. Sorry I do not recall where I saw that write-up.

That noise you are describing sounds a lot like a tire. You need to put it up and spin those wheels and look for out of round on the tire surface now. My guess is you will find the source of the noise in the tire. Incidentally, in my case, I thought the noise was coming from the back but it was the front and it would have been described as yours.

You can disable the ESP and put the car in gear to spin the rear wheels with the engine.
 

·
Registered
W210 E55
Joined
·
149 Posts
Discussion Starter #6
Sounds like you have covered your bases so far. My front pass side rim was bent (dinged?) on the inside edge. It was hard to detect just by looking at it. My inde caught it and showed me but wasn't sure it would ever cause trouble. 12 months later that tire was howling and had developed regular flat spots (uneven wear). I had no other real issues other than the ball joints which were still pretty OK but needed replacing, which I did.

I forgot about it until I went to a tire shop and they flagged it. It was very noticeable upon spinning the wheel on a lift.

I had the rim repaired for $140, bought new tires, and its been fine so far.

Someone did a write up on replacing the sub-frame mounts. Looked like a bit of a pain. Sorry I do not recall where I saw that write-up.

That noise you are describing sounds a lot like a tire. You need to put it up and spin those wheels and look for out of round on the tire surface now. My guess is you will find the source of the noise in the tire. Incidentally, in my case, I thought the noise was coming from the back but it was the front and it would have been described as yours.

You can disable the ESP and put the car in gear to spin the rear wheels with the engine.
Yes, if I had not just changed the tires (100-200 miles on brand new bf Goodrich comp 2's) I would swear that was it. It's why I changed them. Did this with two other 'imperfect' tires in short order leading up to this tire purchase. So my primary symptoms are:
1) the aw-wa-wa-wa warped tire sound
2) howl/hum/deep whine that only happens at speeds right around 70mph
3) minor intermittent vibration


You also mention "howling"??? I am very curious how you define howling. You really have me thinking bent rim. I guess I'll jack it up and see if I can spot it.

Thanks again for your advice & experience
 

·
Registered
2000 W210 E55 AMG, Silver/Black - Stock
Joined
·
611 Posts
I am glad to offer what I can.

My noise was most apparent at low speeds below 30 and coming to a stop. It was felt slightly in the wheel and car and made a loud howling noise. It also made a lot of noise on the freeway.

Have you inspected your driveshaft flex discs?
 

·
Registered
W210 E55
Joined
·
149 Posts
Discussion Starter #8
I am glad to offer what I can.

My noise was most apparent at low speeds below 30 and coming to a stop. It was felt slightly in the wheel and car and made a loud howling noise. It also made a lot of noise on the freeway.

Have you inspected your driveshaft flex discs?
Thanks for the additional info. My flex discs have about 2k miles on them. The originals were rock hard and starting to crack. I'm not ruling out the center prop shaft for the hum/howl. The warped tire noise is really the primary focus at the moment. I can live with the hum as it's not constant and I can usually stop it by speeding up/slowing down. I'm thinking that if I find one source, it may fix both issues. I think they may be related, but will probably grab a set of chassis ears if it's still there after I have the front bearings inspected/adjusted on Monday.
 

·
Registered
2000 W210 E55 AMG, Silver/Black - Stock
Joined
·
611 Posts
BTW, the proper tire inflation pressures are on the gas filler door. The top set is for low-normal driving speeds and lightly loaded and heavily loaded. The second set (lower numbers) are for prolonged high speeds - probably for economy and safety. IIRC, it is over 130Kph. This also has lightly and heavily loaded inflation pressures.
 
1 - 10 of 10 Posts
Top