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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Class action attorney looking into key problems with Mercedes Benz. Please report key replacement problems to him at this web site.
http://www.fazmiclaw.com/mbzkey.html
Anyone with $3600.00 major lock problem like i had or other similiar issue please report to him.

Roger Stephens
 

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We all have problems.... Some more than others.. Lets not cry about it...



I have been in the Off-Topic forum too much.. [:D]

I agree with Andrew. I honestly did not have this problem and I am sorry you did. Maybe I am due for a major failure soon... But I have gone through two transmissions. So if you want to put that on your list too because both of those get me to a grand total of $8,000...
 

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I know that class-action suits generally benefit only the lawyers, but unfortunately, that’s often the only way we little guys can get the attention of a big company. I know it may seem to some that Roger is “shining�, but the reality is this could happen to any one of us. All it takes is a dead battery or a faulty RFID antenna in the ignition switch and you will need a new key. At $150 each, that’s not such a horrible thing, but when enough keys die that you have to shell out over $3K pay for someone else’s poor design, I say it’s time to get MBUSA’s attention.

I know others have argued that this is no different than transmission, engine or even fuel pump failures, but it is. The difference with those mechanical items failing is that the repair requires labor and replacements of physical pieces. In the case of the key failure, MBZ could, if they wanted to, allow the AAM to be erased to virgin state, then reprogrammed with a new key set (or even the old keyset). Assuming $120 per key and an hour of labor, the repair should cost under $500. Instead, they won’t let the dealers know how to erase the AAM and they make customer pay for replacing expensive parts requiring many hours of labor. This would be like having to replace your computer’s hard drive every time you were infected with a virus.
 

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rudeney - 4/7/2006 10:43 AM
I know others have argued that this is no different than transmission, engine or even fuel pump failures, but it is. The difference with those mechanical items failing is that the repair requires labor and replacements of physical pieces. In the case of the key failure, MBZ could, if they wanted to, allow the AAM to be erased to virgin state, then reprogrammed with a new key set (or even the old keyset). Assuming $120 per key and an hour of labor, the repair should cost under $500. Instead, they won’t let the dealers know how to erase the AAM and they make customer pay for replacing expensive parts requiring many hours of labor. This would be like having to replace your computer’s hard drive every time you were infected with a virus.
What a great idea! We should start a new Anti-Virus tool.

"Instead of having to mess around with all those advanced anti-virus tools, just open your computer case and pop in a new hard drive!"

But what will we call it?
 

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Great job parkrog..!! Thanks to real educated owners like you, other owners don't have to massively pay for harmonic balancers damage, sludge engine damage, etc. and owners are even adviced that there are serious issues that need to be checked before some catastrophic damage occurs and/or before they buy a vehicle.

There is a difference between paying for normal random average problems and paying for problems created by way above average defective quality/part/design issues caused by money saving schemes. i.e. Harmonic Balancer, engine sludge failures, under-designed steering pumps and parts, transmission troubles because of poorly designed parts/design, etc.

Some people seem to think that having a high end vehicle means throwing/burning thousands of dollars to crooked dealers and cut-corners companies for [email protected] design, quality, parts, and service. Mediocre thinking MB managers that think like that may be bring down Mercedes Benz as the company we use to know...
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
1998 and 1999 ML Mercedes only have 8 keys!!!
You don't have to loose them, they will just stop working.
If you jump start a ML with a running car you can kill the key - this is what dealer warned me of after I just paid over $3000.00 to get a key.
If your alternator goes out this can kill keys.

Toyota and other manufactures have similiar problems
but they don't rip off their customers like Mercedes.

See Washington Post article March 14, 2006
 

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parkrog - 4/7/2006 10:49 AM

1998 and 1999 ML Mercedes only have 8 keys!!!
You don't have to loose them, they will just stop working.
If you jump start a ML with a running car you can kill the key - this is what dealer warned me of after I just paid over $3000.00 to get a key.
If your alternator goes out this can kill keys.
Actually, ALL W163’s have a limit of 8 keys. Even though they upgraded the ML to DAS-2b in MY2000 and then DAS-3 in MY2002, they did not change the AAM to allow for more than 8 keys like the infrared “Smartkey� system on other models with DAS-3.

The issue with jump-starting or a bad alternator (or battery) is that any “interruption� of the circuit or transmission that re-writes a new rolling code to the RFID chip in the key can kill the key. I can’t prove it, but there appears to be no handshaking or re-write verification in this process. Basically, the DAS simply broadcasts a new rolling code, and if the key fails to accept it for any reason, then the key can never be used again.
 

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The supplier is a unit of Delco/Delphi.



Some info is here:

http://delphi.com/manufacturers/auto/safesecure/theftprotect/immobilization/
 

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Wolfgang - 4/7/2006 11:15 AM

The supplier is a unit of Delco/Delphi.

Some info is here:

http://delphi.com/manufacturers/auto/safesecure/theftprotect/immobilization/
Wolfgang, I’d be the last person to second-guess your expertise, but are you sure about that? MBZ has been using this same system for years, far before even the concept of the ML. I’d be surprised that they would have used parts like this from a US company (and subsidiary of GM). Maybe they just subcontracted Delphi to assembly the system for the ML, based on MBZ specs?
 

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rudeney - 4/7/2006 9:21 AM
but are you sure about that?
Rodney, I'm sure. There was a better info site available by the Delphi unit which makes the immobilizer but it was discontinued a few years ago. There also was a customer list on the site, and it was long, probably 40+.



PS. I have no interest in this suit. My keys work fine.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Still looking for key replacement information for attorney at: http://www.fazmiclaw.com/mbzkey.html
 

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Wolfgang - 4/7/2006 12:38 PM

rudeney - 4/7/2006 9:21 AM
but are you sure about that?
Rodney, I'm sure. There was a better info site available by the Delphi unit which makes the immobilizer but it was discontinued a few years ago. There also was a customer list on the site, and it was long, probably 40+.



PS. I have no interest in this suit. My keys work fine.
I thought that both the keys and the locksets were produced by Huf:

http://www.huf-group.com/opencms/export/group-en/produkte/index.html
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Looking for owners with key problems.
Please let class action attorney know your story.
If you have had any key just stop working need to let him know for possible reimbursement.
Roger
 

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parkrog - 4/12/2006 7:18 PM

Looking for owners with key problems.
Please let class action attorney know your story.
If you have had any key just stop working need to let him know for possible reimbursement.
Roger
Are you shilling for the attorney or do you actually work for him??? On commission??
 

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I think parkrog is doing a right thing if there is indeed such a common problem. Though the result would fat some attorney's wallets, manufacturers should be responsible for what they have designed or done wrong. And we couldn't say it's not right or even unethical just because some lawyers would make more money.

I gues some of us may be lucky and have a problem-free truck. However, the truth is there are lots of problems resulted from MBUSA's design and quality management.

I am sorry but when you doubt if someone is working for some attorney, the guy could also doubt if you work for MBUSA, couldn't he?

And I'm not saying that a manufacturer should be responsible for all things including consumables, but they should take the response if it's their fault.

P.S. I don't work for any attorney, I don't work for MBUSA, and I don't work for parkrog.
 

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Andrew2004az - 4/6/2006 7:46 PM

Class action suits only line the pockets of the lawyers... And the cost gets passed back to the consumer.
The lawyers and the original plaintif, as he/she gets paid a substantial fee for "information services" (helping the lawyers). The rest of the class gets zip.
 
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