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1994 S600 Coupe, 1995 S600 Coupe
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Thought I'd introduced myself when I first joined, but I guess I never did. 94 posts later, I'm doing it. Never owned a Mercedes before, but owned and raced lots of Porsches and have owned a few BMWs. Also have another V-12, in a Jag XJS.

When I first joined here, it was right after I saw a video from Mercedessource on his S600 coupe. I was intrigued with the car, so I started hanging out here well before I found one. Never considered anything except the S600 coupe. I'd been looking on eBay and Craigslist all over the Southeastern part of the US and California for rust free examples, when one popped up locally. Surprised me. Went to take a look. Didn't run right, and knew it would take some work, but it was rust free, straight, no accidents, and most things worked. All of the wiring harnesses had been changed, and the throttle bodies rebuilt. Engine was in limp mode, and was obviously only running right on one bank. I knew from watching Victor's YouTube videos that the issue was mostly EGAS related. Price was right, and I ended up buying it. Ordered my C4 scanner for HHTWIN the same day. I've been gradually working on it, mainly awaiting an EGAS module at a decent price. Communicated a lot with Martin (MAVA), and he found one that worked at a local wrecking yard. He also helped me with other parts. Finally got it running right today after finding two cross wired sparkplug leads.

Interesting comparing the engineering between my XJS and the S600. The XJS, an 87, was built when Jaguar and Britsh Leyland we're struggling for money, and the lack of refinement shows. Zero built in diagnostics, which makes it a pain to trouble shoot. Contrast that with the no expense spared Mercedes, and pretty good diagnostics, and the differences are night and day. The Jaguar is all electromechanical controlled (and Lucas electrics to boot), except for the engine ecu which is pretty basic, while the Mercedes uses computers for everything, sometimes to a fault. And I find the Mercedes no harder to work on than an Audi allroad 2.7 biturbo I owned.

Turn all my own wrenches, and am retired, so I have the time. Enjoy this forum, especially the international flavor.

Enough for now.

Jon

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Interesting comparing the engineering between my XJS and the S600. The XJS, an 87, was built when Jaguar and Britsh Leyland we're struggling for money, and the lack of refinement shows. Zero built in diagnostics, which makes it a pain to trouble shoot.
Interesting story Jon, how many miles on the c140 (and the XJS)? Is the transmission holding up?

I am afraid I will have to make a small correction. Jaguar was divested from British Leyland almost completely by 1984 and the XJS (TWR division) was killing it on the tracks -- many consider the mid 1980s as the golden age of the modern Jaguars. I am a big fan, as i believe that since TWR crushed BMW
https://www.youtube.com/embed/if2j6yqZg0Q

they entered into the V12s, which prompted delays in the w140 design, but ultimately led to the creation of the M120.

Anyhow, the mid 80s Jag V12 is a TRUE V12 (single distributor, point ignition), whereas the later examples under Ford (scottpeter has two of them I think) use Marelli systems, found in Lambos and Ferrari's from the same vintage.

They have diagnostic capabilities, but unlike the cracked C4 that you've got, nobody has attempted to do the same for the JDS (very large market for the MB vs negligible for the Jag I suppose).

Topic for another discussion.

Good luck with your project,
Steve
 

· Registered
1994 S600 Coupe, 1995 S600 Coupe
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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
The later XJS' under Ford had some diagnostics, mine has none. The JDS was a derivative of the Ford system.

Mine was built well before Ford, after Jaguar separated from British Leyland in 84, but had no substantial redesigns until the Ford takeover in 1990. I've also got a 1984 XJS, and other than the slightly updated HVAC, they are virtually identical.

There are no points in any XJS ignition. All were breakerless, two variants of Lucas, and the later Marelli. Mine has the second Lucas variant, and uses the GM breakerless module housed in a Lucas box! All had distributors of various sorts.

S600 has 167k miles, 84 Jag about 125k, and the 87 right at 50k.

Not sure yet about S600 transmission. I got it home running on 6 cylinders, so I didn't learn much. Receipts I've got are incomplete, but show some work done to it. Tires are scary trash from sitting for a couple of years, and I won't drive it until replaced. Many suspension parts have been replaced, accumulators done twice, etc. Power steering/suspension pump replaced. In the early part of it's life, no expense was spared to maintain it.
I'm not sure of the true mileage. There was a huge jump of 60-70k miles in 2 years, with a note about an inop odo before that, so it may have been replaced with a higher mileage unit. Receipts are sparse in that period, so I'm not sure, and Carfax didn't shed any light.


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The later XJS' under Ford had some diagnostics, mine has none. The JDS was a derivative of the Ford system.
Jon, I think you are confusing the Jaguar Diagnostic System (JDS) with the WDS (as you correctly state, based on the World Diagnostic System by Ford for all OBD2 equipped vehicles under their umbrella)

In any case. The Jag 5.3L V12 has been underdevelopment in the 60s and in production for over 30 years before BMW and MB decided to (re)enter the V12-club with their own power plants. I don't think drawing parallels is even possible.

There are no points in any XJS ignition. All were breakerless, two variants of Lucas, and the later Marelli. Mine has the second Lucas variant, and uses the GM breakerless module housed in a Lucas box! All had distributors of various sorts.
I don't know anything about those, but have read quite a bit on the Lucas Constant Energy Ignition.

V12 IGNITION SYSTEMS / AJ6 Engineering

There is a trigger wheel and a coil inside the dizzy, right? Centrifugal advance, right? This is what I call old school point ignition.
Yes, there are two coils and an amplifier of some kind, but this is hardly electronic as the timing is controlled buy the distributor.

S600 has 167k miles, 84 Jag about 125k, and the 87 right at 50k.
Whoa, you've got 3 V12-engined cars that you work/maintain on your own. Amazing!

Best regards,
Steve

PS This is near me and if the 600SEC wasn't taking up space in the garage, I'd be getting it:
https://delaware.craigslist.org/cto/6128265068.html

A company down under sells 5-speed manual conversion kits (off of Toyota Supra) and allegedly in second gear you can do close to 100 mph. What can happen in 3rd and 4th...?
 

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Jon,

Glad you made this intro, and your contribution to this forum is stellar like everyone else's.

Glad to be of help..

Martin
 
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