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Discussion Starter #1
Right then guys I'm looking for some knowledge
My friend (not me) has a vito just like mine 2.3d and wants to run it on Red diesel because he's using it off road for a while obviously.
Now it's know that you can filter the dye out using different methods. I know a few but was after more info if any body knows anything
Regarding how to filter through cat litter (how much is needed to how much fuel)
Also as anyone used the method of 12v battery attached to 2 copper strips
Help would be apprieciated
P.s. I'm not really a tight arse jus curious
Cheers dan
 

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Firstly, ANY vehicle registered for road use CAN ONLY use duty paid fuel, UNLESS it is a farm vehicle that will do NO MORE than 15miles on a road IN A YEAR e.g from field to barn.

MOST Tractors etc are Road Legal at ALL times.

You CANNOT say its for road use then off road then road etc.

RED diesel is NOT legal except a few classes of vehicle e.g construction.

The Red COLOUR is an indicator ONLY..... This is IMPORTANT......

When Customs or VOSA check fuel, they are NOT checking for the DYE but for a CHEMICAL marker which CANNOT BE REMOVED.

This is why people using de-coloured red diesel are caught so easily, the colour is to stop punters being caught out by crooks.
 

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Red diesel isnt nearly as clean as road-diesel. Id not risk putting it in a tank. I work in construction related trade and Ive heard of some guys who've done it, not been caught by the law but had to fork out on injection pumps/seals/injectors etc because its just not as well filtered.

I sell enough diesel filters, lift pumps and injection pumps for construction machinery to realise red it not always as clean.
 

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I agree with samwell, red is aimed at big old-design engines with wide tolerances not modern high-tech engines.

Should mention, thanks to my mate at Customs, that the chemical marker (not the dye) CANNOT be removed from non-duty fuel and can be detected after more than 10 full tanks of legal fuel have been run through the system.

the guy at merc maastricht warns that illegal dye stripping uses acid and certain alcohols and that the resultant fuel is corrosive to alloy engines......... they reject a lot of warranty claims because of this.
 

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in this part of lancashire the standard penalty is £1000 fine, repay all estimated avoided fuel duty and the vehicle is crushed.

A high price to pay.

A few years ago I got the duty scrapped for small users of vegetable oil used as fuel (I have a severe allergy to diesel and petrol) at the time sunflower oil was 34p litre....... now it costs more than diesel so any monetary advantage was lost
 

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I just had a phone call from a forum member (PLEASE only talk through the forum) re the penalties for "red" as the law says £250 fine + duty + other penalties (seizure, crushing etc) and its notoriously difficult to get the maximum.

I live near a VOSA and Customs test centre and, as I said, their norm is £1000 + duty + crushing so I just asked one of them (the mobile crusher is currently on-site)

What they do is look for the colour, test for the marking chemical and if the marker is found (it shows up in a dilution of 1000ltrs) they then proceed as follows

They instantly seize the vehicle for duty avoidance

They phone the insurer to tell them about the offence

The Insurer cancels the insurance for breach of contract (everything must conform and be legal at all times)

They then impose the "red" fine PLUS the "no insurance" fine and if argued with, get the road tax nullified (can't have tax without the insurance that just cancelled) and they add that fine as well, they then add the "Seizure" fine and crush the vehicle in front of your eyes.

They allow you to remove any personal items and you can leave (if you've satisfied them who you are or the police are called (they are on site anyway)) as the site is "inside" a motorway junction you must get a taxi to leave, if you walk off the police do you for "trespass on a motorway"

Really Wonderful use of the rules and made possible by adding the recent "all vehicles must be taxed at all times" legislation to the existing road and tax laws.

People wonder why I'm pernickity but I think you can see why...... Police college and Headquarters 9 miles away, Motorway police station 19miles (was 300 yards) VOSA 7miles, Customs 7 and 11 miles........ you don't really stand a chance....... and THEN they get creative with the rules AS WELL!!!
 

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Diesels ok unless you're allergic to it....... and I'm told thats quite common with the commonest symptom of loosing your sense of smell (unfortunately I'm a LOT worse than that but not smelling my wifes farting does have a whistful appeal)

I'm just highly cynical that I got duty dropped on veg oil as fuel and within months its price had risen to that of diesel and is now higher than diesel.............. the arguments relating to crop yields etc do not hold water... its just getting our money

off me soapbox and get out the drugs..... byeeee!!


confuscious say -- man who sniffs own fart has nose on wrong end
 

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That is what I keep saying about LPG, the more people convert the more it will get taxed.
I saw it a few weeks ago and it was either 74p or 84p, I can't remember but it has shot up.
As for diesel it used to be cheaper because it's cheaper to make, now it's more expensive (than petrol) because people get more MPG.
You have every right to be cynical....I am.
 

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Personally I believe LPG is a con to sell an unwanted by-product.

people are urged to buy it because its half the price per litre of petrol.

what they aren't told, is that it only does half the mpg so you actually pay about the same per mile......... plus hundreds for the conversion............ AND more than a few have "inexplicably" blown up.

when LPG was first sold from the refineries in cheshire, it was 10p a litre and therefore cost effective.......... UNTIL people started buying it.

But when I first moved to the Northwest ICI sold petrol at under half the price of others as it was an unwanted byproduct....... it was the government (good old Harold) that outlawed it.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
So wot your saying is drive an old banger that's worth nothing and run it on red get as much tax free out the robbing government we have then when they catch you let them crush the car (leave a fad cylinder in the boot) and ruin there machine.
Then the day before you go to court sign on the dole offer them a pound a week and you are all winners lol
Well I think it's a good idea lol
Dan
 

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I know you're only kidding BUT don't confuse HM Customs with Civil and Criminal Law (the boys in blue)

Police actions can result in non payment of fines etc and the case being effectively binned because of no income............ but NOT customs.

Customs really will pursue you to the grave and if you haven't settled the bill, will probably sell your ground up bones as cat litter.

Joking aside, they will even pursue relatives for the debt and have been known to take 50% of someones benefits until FULL payment.

I always remember Hayley Mills being pursued over duty on jewellery and royalties (not income tax) she went through all the courts and beat the customs man........ HMC then went to the lords, introduced a law that covered the loophole she won on.... and backdated it to before the "offence" and then did her again........ getting all the money and costs from the previous cases.....

HMC are not to be kidded around with...... but none of us would!!!!
 
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