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Here are a few more interesting widebodies, in case you haven't seen them:

300CE Lotec Turbo:
Index of /images/cars/shopping/1989_300CE_Lotec_Widebody


E36 widebody (the images are 900x7800, so you need to zoom in to view them properly) :
http://www.w124performance.com/images/cars/shopping/1990_E36_widebody_coupe1.jpg
http://www.w124performance.com/images/cars/shopping/1990_E36_widebody_coupe2.jpg



This isn't a widebody, but a Hammer coupe is still pretty cool:
Index of /images/cars/shopping/1988_300CE_AMG_6.0L


:sawzall:
Hi there and thnx for the links.That E36 is not an E36 as is the early AMG with the early m104 engine bored to 3.4 by AMG.Still very nice car though :thumbsup::thumbsup
 

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Zeitgeist, yes, that is the car i thought it was, amazing and beautiful, i would very much like to get my paws on one of those, any idea how many were made? is it a japanese company?
 

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Hi there and thnx for the links.That E36 is not an E36 as is the early AMG with the early m104 engine bored to 3.4 by AMG.Still very nice car though :thumbsup::thumbsup
It's hard to say for sure, because there are no close-up photos of the AMG decals under the hood. The car may have been converted by AMG Japan in the mid/late 90's when the 3.6L engine was available. I refer to it as "E36" because that's what the badge says on the back. It would be nice to get additional information on the car to verify the engine displacement.

:surrender:
 

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It's hard to say for sure, because there are no close-up photos of the AMG decals under the hood. The car may have been converted by AMG Japan in the mid/late 90's when the 3.6L engine was available. I refer to it as "E36" because that's what the badge says on the back. It would be nice to get additional information on the car to verify the engine displacement.

:surrender:
That E36 badge should not be there.If you look at the last pic of the first link,it shows the early m104 engine.:)
 

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the lotec link above doesnt run on my computer, if it is the car i think it is then imo it is the best looking merc ever,the lotec just looks so correct. the wings flare out all the way from front o back and top to bottom?
I like that look too, similar to the M3 and 944 fenders. I wonder if it's formed metal or fiberglass...
 

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Nice to see the photo's of the panels Neville has. Fuuny everyone who know's him says the same thing, he keeps himself to himself. Id love to get a sheet metal company to make some copies of those parts, it would really finish my E36 off.
 

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Nice to see the photo's of the panels Neville has. Fuuny everyone who know's him says the same thing, he keeps himself to himself. Id love to get a sheet metal company to make some copies of those parts, it would really finish my E36 off.
What's a fair price to have them made? A metalshaper formed one-off custom flares for my Porsche but he's made wood bulks to make a small run of flares. I suspect flares from machined dies would be more expensive...
 

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That E36 badge should not be there.If you look at the last pic of the first link,it shows the early m104 engine.:)
Is the early M104 engine incapable of being punched out to 3.6L?

3.4L (M104.980) = 91.5 bore x 84.0 stroke (3314cc)
3.6L (M104.992) = 91.0 bore x 92.4 stroke (3606cc)

Yes, the engine in the photo is the early M104, but I don't see how that proves what the displacement is. AMG Japan could have still converted it to 3.6L, no?

:confused:
 

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Is the early M104 engine incapable of being punched out to 3.6L?

3.4L (M104.980) = 91.5 bore x 84.0 stroke (3314cc)
3.6L (M104.992) = 91.0 bore x 92.4 stroke (3606cc)

Yes, the engine in the photo is the early M104, but I don't see how that proves what the displacement is. AMG Japan could have still converted it to 3.6L, no?

:confused:
God knows,they`ve done so many things.Still though as a prefacelift car,should have the gen1 kit.:surrender:.It kills me though as they had so much more on the table :)
 

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Is the early M104 engine incapable of being punched out to 3.6L?

3.4L (M104.980) = 91.5 bore x 84.0 stroke (3314cc)
3.6L (M104.992) = 91.0 bore x 92.4 stroke (3606cc)

Yes, the engine in the photo is the early M104, but I don't see how that proves what the displacement is. AMG Japan could have still converted it to 3.6L, no?

:confused:
Thats a good question! All the converted cars I have seen or read about were 3.4l M104 motors starting with a 3.0 CIS motor. All of the E36 motors I have seen started life as 3.2l HFM motors. Of course with all the unknowns, I guess anything is possible when it comes to AMG
 

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Thats a good question! All the converted cars I have seen or read about were 3.4l M104 motors starting with a 3.0 CIS motor. All of the E36 motors I have seen started life as 3.2l HFM motors. Of course with all the unknowns, I guess anything is possible when it comes to AMG
My RENNTech 3.6L is based on a M103 w/CIS. Besides a dyno, who's to know until you open it up...
 

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Here is the explanation I found some years ago regarding the C36 engine, which is the same as the E36 in this context:

"The C36 power plant is a modified version of the same in-line 6-cylinder engine that powers the C280.
The basic engine is far from wimpish, producing 199 foot-pounds of torque at 3,750 rpm.

But AMG took that engine and enlarged the cylinders. The bore, or diameter of the cylinders, grew from
89.9mm to 91mm. And the stroke - the distance the piston travels in the cylinder - deepened from
73.5mm to 92.4mm. So the overall displacement of the engine - the space in the cylinders - grew from
2.8 liters to 3.6 liters. Those numbers led to the naming of the cars - C280 and C36.

The engine got other enhancements, such as flat-topped aluminum pistons derived from AMG's motorsport
design, remapped valve timing and a modified camshaft; a balanced, lightened crankshaft; a larger,
lightweight intake manifold; sodium-cooled valves and enlarged exhaust ports."
 

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the 350 turbo desil crank (wich makes the jump to 3.4l) will fit in any of the 103 and 104 blocks. i am not sure wich rods need to be used (the 103 3.2 amg used 190e 2.0L desil rods, and when i had my shortend rods made for the turbo install, the guy said that the difference between the 103 12v rods and the c36 rods was allmost unnoticable) all the 104 blocks can be bored to take the larger pistons(wich take it from 3.4 to 3.6) i am sure ive read that the larger pistons will alson fit the 103 block, as the 103 and 104 blocks are basically the same that seems a reasonable assumption, so concevably you could build a 3.6 12v if you wanted. in fact im sure brabus did build a 3.6L 103.
 

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the 350 turbo desil crank (wich makes the jump to 3.4l) will fit in any of the 103 and 104 blocks. i am not sure wich rods need to be used (the 103 3.2 amg used 190e 2.0L desil rods, and when i had my shortend rods made for the turbo install, the guy said that the difference between the 103 12v rods and the c36 rods was allmost unnoticable) all the 104 blocks can be bored to take the larger pistons(wich take it from 3.4 to 3.6) i am sure ive read that the larger pistons will alson fit the 103 block, as the 103 and 104 blocks are basically the same that seems a reasonable assumption, so concevably you could build a 3.6 12v if you wanted. in fact im sure brabus did build a 3.6L 103.
the 2.8L rods need to be used.
 

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Here is the explanation I found some years ago regarding the C36 engine, which is the same as the E36 in this context:

"The C36 power plant is a modified version of the same in-line 6-cylinder engine that powers the C280.
The basic engine is far from wimpish, producing 199 foot-pounds of torque at 3,750 rpm.

But AMG took that engine and enlarged the cylinders. The bore, or diameter of the cylinders, grew from
89.9mm to 91mm. And the stroke - the distance the piston travels in the cylinder - deepened from
73.5mm to 92.4mm. So the overall displacement of the engine - the space in the cylinders - grew from
2.8 liters to 3.6 liters. Those numbers led to the naming of the cars - C280 and C36.

The engine got other enhancements, such as flat-topped aluminum pistons derived from AMG's motorsport
design, remapped valve timing and a modified camshaft; a balanced, lightened crankshaft; a larger,
lightweight intake manifold; sodium-cooled valves and enlarged exhaust ports."
Yes, you are correct, the C36 motor was built from a 2.8l. Whether or not you start with a 2.8 or 3.2 motor, the same mods need to be done. I read a data sheet about the W124 E36 which stated they started with a 3.2l motor.
 

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My RENNTech 3.6L is based on a M103 w/CIS. Besides a dyno, who's to know until you open it up...
Renntech and Brabus did punch the m103 and M104 out to 3.6l. I can't comment on the Renntech but the Brabus 3.6l motors were pushed too far and thus were not reliable. Hence why AMG only went to 3.4l. Again, this was some technical article I read a few years back that discussed cylinder wall thickness or better, lack thereof on the Brabus 3.6l conversions.
 

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On a similar note. Since a friend of mine is installing a C36 motor into his 190e, he has it apart for a rebuild. Last week we were looking at the machine work that went into building that motor. For one, it has extra oil squirters which required machineing grooves into the crank to clear this oilers. So a regular 350sdl crank isn't going to work, unless you machine it or don't install the extra oil squirters.
 

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The original OM603.97 block that housed that 3.5L crank also had piston squirters, but maybe they were in a different location.
 

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The original OM603.97 block that housed that 3.5L crank also had piston squirters, but maybe they were in a different location.
Yes, most all blocks have piston squirters, but AMG added additional squirters to spray oil on the bottom of the pistons.

In the first picture you can see the machine work done to the C36 crank. If you wanted to convert a motor to 3.6l, the question arrises "Are the additional oil squirters really necessary?" I wouldn't try a conversion personally, probably better to just get a 3.6l motor and rebuild it.
 

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