[Chili58]

I am going to replace ABC control unit. But is there any software to be copied from the old box, or programming needed to do when replacing the box with another one?

I have Xentry/DAS/STAR to do adaptation, but is that required and what else possibly is needed?

Car is C215 year 2001 S600 - the same as W220 regarding ABC, I assume.

 

[Dave2302]

Check the version Codings in the old module and then check the replacement to make certain they are identical.

If the car doesn't sit at the correct heights after that you will need to calibrate the ride heights, which (despite what others say) is only done correctly by using the procedure of measuring rear driveshaft and front lower arm angles with the Car standing absolutely level on a 4 post lift or pit, and then entering the correct figures using your SDS

BTW why are you replacing the ABC Controller, I have never yet had to replace one and I work on an awful lot of ABC Cars

HTH

 

[mersum1es]

You are still not getting it working? As above, probably not control unit but more like mechanic problem (these fluids really would need shorter change interval...)

 

[Chili58]

Dave - Good to hear that there is someone who is at least familiar with the system! That is what I would like to be in future, as well

Regarding the ABC control unit: I have changed pretty much all, but that one is only overhauled. I also noticed from my notes that when that control unit came, I got solid 173 Bar pressure during the whole 15 min pressure sensor test. So it is just a wild guess that it may - or may not - have issue.....


How does it behave, if the heights are not perfectly the same? How accurate those need to be adjusted and what will happen, if those are not? With that note about heights, you referred to the replacement of control module?

Have you ever tested how much is the flow from pressure relief valve back to the ABC hydraulic oil reservoir? Does that amount of oil flow give any indication about whatever?

How can I be sure what is the correct unit, if the previous owner already changed a wrong on there? My model is 2001 CL 600 before August that year - I assume. Anyone knows what codes are used that time?

@mersumies - yes, still struggling with the same Mercedes. Only issue is the hydraulic pressure. At idle - 750 rpm - the pressure goes down when warming up; but if i give it to 900 rpm, it goes to the ceiling - which seems to be limiter - 172 bar and stays there. I even think that could it be that that absolute figure is erratic, and the correct, real pressure is something else - like 193 bar. And that is because all the pumps + 3 units, which I have tested behave the same way! Pressure sensor I have changed twice. I have used two different pressure relief blocks, as well. All the pumps have had its new suction valve. Pipeline from the pump to the pressure relief/pressure sensor is new, as well as damper. All the solenoids have new O-rings - and the car stands on on its wheel forever; no sagging, no leaks.

And the motor runs perfectly. I changed the oil-water cooler also, ingnition coil, sensors lambdas etc. And oil seals here and there, also the left cylinder bank valve adjusting hydraulic systems - that one by the way had stonehard, leaking O-rings!

 

[mersum1es]

OK so lotsa hardware malfuncions have been already ruled out... you could try a old school hydraulic pressure gauge with t-junction to verify the actual pressure. I think I asked this before; have you checked what does WIS says about function of the system? There usually is very good description about the logic and operating limits (time steps, pressure, temperature, height sensor reading) of the system. Of course Dave's expertise will be helping here too. I personally have never even 'touched' ABC cars...

 

[Deplore]

May not be relevant here, but I have heard of flaky ABC controller. Since it's in the front sam area, clogged drain hoses, improperly sealed front SAM lid and water runoff could cause those issues. ABC module is the closest module to the edge, to the drain after all.

The previous generation W140 and R129 with ADS (fully hydraulic suspension like ABC, but far more primitive) also had massive QC issue with the control units. IIRC those cars had the modules behind the false wall where passenger place their feet (prefuse area in W220) and clogged sunroof drain would shower those.

I haven't had to replace one yet, though I did delete a fair few at owner request. As long as the donor module did not come from a car that had aftermarket adjustable level sensor linkage and was falsely calibrated to fool the ABC module to tuck in the tires at the fenders -- you know which I'm talking about. As long as it did not come from those cars, and as long as you're remaining to the factory suspension, keeping factory suspension intact and sticking to factory wheel sizes, should be ok. There should not be excessive tire wear due to odd suspension geometry....

 

[Dave2302]

I have a 2002 CL600 in at the moment, It will be going on SDS in the next few working days, so I will get you some screenshots of ABC Data and Version Codings, you'll have to bear with me though because I've 20 million other things to do right now and injured my shoulder, don't know how, but it's bloody painful and slowed me down a lot

 

[Chili58]

@mersumies - I have consulted also ABC Soilutions in Netherland; they have send some items just to check, if those help - free of charge. They have another client with excatly the same errors and behaviour he is also "testing", because STAR/WIS does not find the solution.

Yes, I have considered testing the hydraulic pressure with an analogical meter at the pressure relief valve block. There it can be done. The pipe has Banjo-connection - that makes it a bit harder, but I have not tested it ye; has to find that from a hydraulic shop. Good thing is that I have the old pipe with me to look the correct parts with it. May I ask where do you live - or where you MB lives - oh, you do not have W220 or C215 to measure the pressure as a reference.

 

[Chili58]

I have a 2002 CL600 in at the moment, It will be going on SDS in the next few working days, so I will get you some screenshots of ABC Data and Version Codings, you'll have to bear with me though because I've 20 million other things to do right now and injured my shoulder, don't know how, but it's bloody painful and slowed me down a lot

Thanks @Dave - I will appreciate your help in that; would be interesting to see, if you have the very same coding version, and what is the pressure limiter value - the highest pressure it gives - and what is the pressure at idle. I have at 750 rpm some 150 - 130 - and when hot even less, but it does not matter what is the temperature, if I give it 900 rpm, the pump shows 173 Bar.

 

[Chili58]

May not be relevant here, but I have heard of flaky ABC controller. Since it's in the front sam area, clogged drain hoses, improperly sealed front SAM lid and water runoff could cause those issues. ABC module is the closest module to the edge, to the drain after all.

The previous generation W140 and R129 with ADS (fully hydraulic suspension like ABC, but far more primitive) also had massive QC issue with the control units. IIRC those cars had the modules behind the false wall where passenger place their feet (prefuse area in W220) and clogged sunroof drain would shower those.

I haven't had to replace one yet, though I did delete a fair few at owner request. As long as the donor module did not come from a car that had aftermarket adjustable level sensor linkage and was falsely calibrated to fool the ABC module to tuck in the tires at the fenders -- you know which I'm talking about. As long as it did not come from those cars, and as long as you're remaining to the factory suspension, keeping factory suspension intact and sticking to factory wheel sizes, should be ok. There should not be excessive tire wear due to odd suspension geometry....

Thanks @Deplore - I have seen the same. This control unit was once overhauled, but you never know....

 

[Chili58]

@Dave - would you have possibility to measure the diameter of the pulley of the hydraulic pump. I have it 13 cm - which means 5 inch and 2/5.

I was just wondering that when raising the rpm from 750 to 900, it means 20% raise up. The same effect can be achieved by having 1 inch smaller pulley.

I would like to confirm that the previous owner has not messed with the pulley; as he had messed with the pulley of the alternator, and routing of the belt and width of the belt. It took me quite a long to notice/see that the alternator pulley was wrong size. It destroyed one of my brand new belts because of that - in 30 min running.

 

[mersum1es]

@Chili58 I am at Tampere area, and yeas I have sold my W220 though it had just Airmatic, no ABC.

Note: Do not mix pump speed and pressure... Fluid power basics number one: Pump delivers flow. Pressure is only function of load (or restriction of flow). True, higher flow against fixed flow resistance (orifice, pipe, valve, manifold, whatever restrictor) will increase pressure, only it is not linear...

 

[Chili58]

@Chili58 I am at Tampere area, and yeas I have sold my W220 though it had just Airmatic, no ABC.

Note: Do not mix pump speed and pressure... Fluid power basics number one: Pump delivers flow. Pressure is only function of load (or restriction of flow). True, higher flow against fixed flow resistance (orifice, pipe, valve, manifold, whatever restrictor) will increase pressure, only it is not linear...

Yes; I am not mixing it - and that is why I am a bit confused that only 150 rpm more speed gives top pressure. How would you explain that?

 

[mersum1es]

Yes; I am not mixing it - and that is why I am a bit confused that only 150 rpm more speed gives top pressure. How would you explain that?

A leak. If I recall right you had some temperature problem too? Or temp related. That would point leaky system too.

 

[Deplore]

It shouldn't. Rodeo is done with the engine entirely at idle, and that's a pretty stressful test. The tandem pump, when in good condition, should be able to maintain 170-180 bar when under stress (with engine idling). AMG are 200-220 bar, I think.

 

[Chili58]

@mersumies - I do not know that I have temperature problem in that car. I thought that it is normal that oil gets warm - some 80 - 90 Celcius? Good point; what should be the normal temperature?

 

[Dave2302]

I will try and get all the info you need today the CL is here until next week at least, but I have torn ligament in my shoulder, very painful, full of strong Ibuprofen so half stoned as well .................

Even typing this is hard work with 1 finger of my left hand and try using a bloody mouse with your left hand

That said, being a one man shop, I've gotta get 2 cars SDS'd today, so I can order any parts needed

 

[Dave2302]

OK,

Here we go ................

The best pulley measurement I could get was with a Tape Measure, viewed at an angle as I wasn't going to remove hoses etc to get really accurate, but best guess was somewhere between 13 and 14 cm probably 13 cm if you accurately measured yours

There are no easily alterable Version Codings, it seems that an ABC Module is an ABC Module, regardless of other Vehicle specs, in other words buy a good used Module off the same Car / same Engine and it is plug and play, but if it doesn't sit level will need Calibrations done.
There are 3 different Calibrations that can be done ....

Plunger Travel, Ride Height and Load, which have to be done in that specific order on a Chassis Jig, but I expect we could do these with a truly level pit or 4 Poster Lift plus a decent suitable Angle Finder and decent means of height measurement, eg Laser "Tape Measure"

clickable pics ....

Pressure Data

Stone Cold Engine not started ....



Stone Cold, just started and Suspension settled, still on fast idle with SAI Pump running ....



Stone Cold now at normal idle speed with SAI off ....



70 c idling ....



95 - 98 ish c idling after a spirited 16 mile high speed run through local twisties / undulations, just before Cooling Fan kicked in ....



ABC Module Identity Data



The 3 Technician Adaptable Calibration items in the Adaptations Menu



HTH

 

[Chili58]

@Dave - thank you for the info; good to be now sure about the diameter. The photos; I do not get them visible?? Anyway already that one that you tested those and got 90 celcius - that is good info also - a big hand for that to you! The photos - how to get them visible?

I am capable to do calibration of the heights; have tested that already with Star/Xentry. Maybe that would be one to do, as well while waiting for new ideas - to adjust them perfectly.

Today I got that separate analogical-pressure-meter-pressure-relief-valve-block-complex. Tomorrow plan is to install it and get measured the real pressure coming from the pump. Then I shall have the pressure figure from the control unit and real pressure to compare, if there is something strange. Have a look:

The relief block is equipped for and with a grey sensor and those are for sale - it does not fit into my car's system - even if it looks alike. Never used and here it is only for testing the installation.

.

 

[mersum1es]

I can see the Dave's photos ok... try copy the links and open them other browser. Or are you using a phone only?