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77 450SL, 79 450SLC 5.0, 67 250SL, 61 190SL, 61 190, 62 180;Others:www.cardomain.com/id/challenger_7
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30 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Hi all.
I am still working on perfecting my car bit by bit, and it is really becoming a dream to drive.
Now one thing came up after having overhauled my gearbox, I noticed the following issues and wonder if they are normal performance.
1. After about 60KPH, I cannot kick down to first gear neither by pressing the gas pedal nor by shifting to L. Is this normal?
2. If I start off in L and keep the gear lever there, the gear changes to 2nd at about 60KPH even if I keep my foot pressed down all the way too.
My mechanic is saying this is normal with this car, but I am doubting that a car which was initially designed to win races, cannot be made to stay in 1st gear till its top RPM limit.
Can someone shed some sense on this please.
Cheers.
 

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Outstanding Contributor
450slc5.0cab 280sl5sp 280se4.5 500seAMG +250seStkW108 350sl4spdX3 500secEuro
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22,133 Posts
Hi all.
I am still working on perfecting my car bit by bit, and it is really becoming a dream to drive.
Now one thing came up after having overhauled my gearbox, I noticed the following issues and wonder if they are normal performance.
1. After about 60KPH, I cannot kick down to first gear neither by pressing the gas pedal nor by shifting to L. Is this normal?
2. If I start off in L and keep the gear lever there, the gear changes to 2nd at about 60KPH even if I keep my foot pressed down all the way too.
My mechanic is saying this is normal with this car, but I am doubting that a car which was initially designed to win races, cannot be made to stay in 1st gear till its top RPM limit.
Can someone shed some sense on this please.
Cheers.

Was the 450slc 5.0 made to win races? Or was the 500slc the car MB "Homolgated" (whatever that means :confused: ) to Rally Car racing. Fotografa taught me last night that the 450slc 5.0 had slightly over 5.0 L displacement, while the 500slc had slightly under 5.0 displacement... apparently so it could be raced.

I don't pretend to know, but I do assume a lot.

Back to your initial question... I too would be interested to know the answer. Sorry I have none myself.
 

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500SLC #2624. Black on Black.
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5,120 Posts
You maximum speed in 1st gear should be 104km/h (65mph). If you can't achieve that. something is wrong. Sounds like some adjustments need to be made.

Both the 5.0 and the 500SLC were built to homologate (homologation means that the cars used for racing are basically the same as the cars sold to the public, with a minimum production run usually required. For example, the O, in the Ferrari 250GTO and 388GTO stands for Omologato, the Italian for homologation) the SLC factory rally cars.

In 1980 the FIA had a rule change for the classes, so at this point Mercedes dropped the engine capacity below 5000cc to meet the requirements for their class.
 

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R/C107 Moderator
1986 560SL: '84 500SL: '84 280SL 5 speed: other 107s
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31,873 Posts
1. After about 60KPH, I cannot kick down to first gear neither by pressing the gas pedal nor by shifting to L. Is this normal?
2. If I start off in L and keep the gear lever there, the gear changes to 2nd at about 60KPH even if I keep my foot pressed down all the way too.
My mechanic is saying this is normal with this car, but I am doubting that a car which was initially designed to win races, cannot be made to stay in 1st gear till its top RPM limit.
Can someone shed some sense on this please.
Cheers.
Find a different mechanic.
 

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'71 250, '78 450SLC 5.0, '78 450SL, '81 380SLC 5.6, '89 260E, '15 Kia Sorento
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5,269 Posts
I noticed that my 5.0 starts off strong, but when it hits second gear it takes off like a rocket. Is that typical for these cars?
 

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77 450SL, 79 450SLC 5.0, 67 250SL, 61 190SL, 61 190, 62 180;Others:www.cardomain.com/id/challenger_7
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30 Posts
Discussion Starter #6
Thank you all for your input.
I thought so!!!!
It even has the yellow line at about 110KPH being the top limit of the 1st gear, and similar lines for the 2nd gear further up.
OK, will change the mechanic:D
dgosh28 I think it is typical of these cars, they are a bit heavy on take off, but when rolling they are pretty fast.
I have heard this form almost every owner, and Tom from the classic center confirms it.
Cheers
 

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R/C107 Moderator
1986 560SL: '84 500SL: '84 280SL 5 speed: other 107s
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31,873 Posts
The linkage to the control pressure lever needs to be checked. It may need adjusting. There was also a problem at the ball socket connection on intake. IIRC it was a nylon insert and needed to be replaced with metal.

I checked your model and the electric kick down solenoid showed not applicable. I do not know how the kick down functions on yours.
 

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77 450SL, 79 450SLC 5.0, 67 250SL, 61 190SL, 61 190, 62 180;Others:www.cardomain.com/id/challenger_7
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Discussion Starter #8
Rowdie, my car does have an electric kick down unit fixed down on the side of the gearbox. Maybe the details you have are not complete.
Of course there is also the physical linkage, which may also need adjustment.
Now that you mention this, I will check to see if my electric unit is functional. Thanks
 

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R/C107 Moderator
1986 560SL: '84 500SL: '84 280SL 5 speed: other 107s
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31,873 Posts
Blame the EPC. It did not make sense to me. Might also check the switch under the accelerator pedal.
 

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77 450SL, 79 450SLC 5.0, 67 250SL, 61 190SL, 61 190, 62 180;Others:www.cardomain.com/id/challenger_7
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Discussion Starter #10
Was the 450slc 5.0 made to win races? Or was the 500slc the car MB "Homolgated" (whatever that means :confused: ) to Rally Car racing.
Fonzi further to what Fotografa explained, here is a small contribution about this car's history which is very interesting:)

"Built as a test platform to collect data for the next generation of aluminum engines, the '79 450SLC 5.0 was manufactured in extremely limited numbers and was breathtakingly expensive. Exactly 1,470 examples were built for road use, just enough for ONS/FIA homologation; only a fraction were used as Competition Coupes in various motorsport arenas. Reportedly, just 40 '79 5.0s were sold new in the United States

In September, 1977 the 450 SLC 5.0 joined the line. This was a special version of the big coupé featuring a new all-aluminum five-liter V8, aluminum alloy doors, hood and trunk lid - and a black rubber rear spoiler.

Starting in 1980, US cars were equipped with lambda control, which varied the air/fuel mixture based on feedback from an oxygen sensor. The 350, 450 and 450 SLC 5.0 models (like the 350 and 450 SL) were discontinued in 1980 with the introduction of the 380 and 500 SLC in March, 1980. At the same time, the cars received a very mild make-over; the 3-speed automatic was replaced by a four-speed unit, the 280 models came with a standard 5-speed (formerly a 4-speed) manual and all five-liter cars gained a black rear spoiler lip

A total of 62,888 SLCs had been manufactured over a ten year period of which just 1,636 were the 450 SLC-5.0 and 1,133 were the 500 SLC. Both these models are sought by collectors today. With the exception of the SL65 AMG Black Series, the SLC remains the only fixed roof Mercedes-Benz coupe based on a roadster rather than a sedan."
 

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'71 250, '78 450SLC 5.0, '78 450SL, '81 380SLC 5.6, '89 260E, '15 Kia Sorento
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Was the 450slc 5.0 made to win races? Or was the 500slc the car MB "Homolgated" (whatever that means :confused: ) to Rally Car racing.
Fonzi further to what Fotografa explained, here is a small contribution about this car's history which is very interesting:)

"Built as a test platform to collect data for the next generation of aluminum engines, the '79 450SLC 5.0 was manufactured in extremely limited numbers and was breathtakingly expensive. Exactly 1,470 examples were built for road use, just enough for ONS/FIA homologation; only a fraction were used as Competition Coupes in various motorsport arenas. Reportedly, just 40 '79 5.0s were sold new in the United States

In September, 1977 the 450 SLC 5.0 joined the line. This was a special version of the big coupé featuring a new all-aluminum five-liter V8, aluminum alloy doors, hood and trunk lid - and a black rubber rear spoiler.

Starting in 1980, US cars were equipped with lambda control, which varied the air/fuel mixture based on feedback from an oxygen sensor. The 350, 450 and 450 SLC 5.0 models (like the 350 and 450 SL) were discontinued in 1980 with the introduction of the 380 and 500 SLC in March, 1980. At the same time, the cars received a very mild make-over; the 3-speed automatic was replaced by a four-speed unit, the 280 models came with a standard 5-speed (formerly a 4-speed) manual and all five-liter cars gained a black rear spoiler lip

A total of 62,888 SLCs had been manufactured over a ten year period of which just 1,636 were the 450 SLC-5.0 and 1,133 were the 500 SLC. Both these models are sought by collectors today. With the exception of the SL65 AMG Black Series, the SLC remains the only fixed roof Mercedes-Benz coupe based on a roadster rather than a sedan."
Great information. Thanks for posting this. I'm loving my car more and more each day.
 

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Outstanding Contributor
450slc5.0cab 280sl5sp 280se4.5 500seAMG +250seStkW108 350sl4spdX3 500secEuro
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Great information. Thanks for posting this. I'm loving my car more and more each day.
Yes. Lots of great information. Too bad some of it is false, and on the site most commonly used for quickly gaining information about the r/c107.



Was the 450slc 5.0 made to win races? Or was the 500slc the car MB "Homolgated" (whatever that means :confused: ) to Rally Car racing.
Fonzi further to what Fotografa explained, here is a small contribution about this car's history which is very interesting:)

"Built as a test platform to collect data for the next generation of aluminum engines, the '79 450SLC 5.0 was manufactured in extremely limited numbers and was breathtakingly expensive. Exactly 1,470 examples were built for road use, just enough for ONS/FIA homologation; only a fraction were used as Competition Coupes in various motorsport arenas. Reportedly, just 40 '79 5.0s were sold new in the United States

In September, 1977 the 450 SLC 5.0 joined the line. This was a special version of the big coupé featuring a new all-aluminum five-liter V8, aluminum alloy doors, hood and trunk lid - and a black rubber rear spoiler.

Starting in 1980, US cars were equipped with lambda control, which varied the air/fuel mixture based on feedback from an oxygen sensor. The 350, 450 and 450 SLC 5.0 models (like the 350 and 450 SL) were discontinued in 1980 with the introduction of the 380 and 500 SLC in March, 1980. At the same time, the cars received a very mild make-over; the 3-speed automatic was replaced by a four-speed unit, the 280 models came with a standard 5-speed (formerly a 4-speed) manual and all five-liter cars gained a black rear spoiler lip

A total of 62,888 SLCs had been manufactured over a ten year period of which just 1,636 were the 450 SLC-5.0 and 1,133 were the 500 SLC. Both these models are sought by collectors today. With the exception of the SL65 AMG Black Series, the SLC remains the only fixed roof Mercedes-Benz coupe based on a roadster rather than a sedan."

There's that Aluminum alloy door thing again. Doesn't that discredit the entire written statement? So much of what's written there is true, but aren't the doors regular SLC doors? Fotografa seems pretty well versed in this, and I believe he commented to me that the doors are not aluminum.

EDIT: Apparently this information is out there on Wikipedia, and as a result it seems to be proliferating.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mercedes-Benz_R107_and_C107

WIKIPEDIA TEXT (apparently needs correction):
---------------------------------------
Model history

The R107 took the chassis components of the mid size Mercedes-Benz W114 model and mated them to the larger engines from the S-Class (W116).

The SL variant was a 2-seat convertible/roadster with standard soft top and hardtop and optional folding seats for the rear bench. The SLC (C107) derivative was a 2 door hardtop coupe with normal rear seats. The SLC is commonly referred to as an 'SL coupe', but in reality it was an S-class coupe, replacing the former saloon-based 280/300 SE coupé in Mercedes lineup. The SLC was replaced earlier than the SL, in 1981, with a much larger model, the 380 SEC based on the new S class.
Mercedes-Benz 560 SL (Japan)

Volume production of the first R107 car, the 350 SL, started in April, 1971 alongside the last of the W113 cars; the 350 SLC followed in October. Sales in North America began in 1972, and cars wore the name 350 SL, but had a larger 4.5L V8 (and were renamed 450 SL/SLC for model year 1973); the big V8 became available on other markets with the official introduction of the 450 SL/SLC on non-North American markets in March, 1973. US cars sold from 1972 through 1975 used the Bosch D Jetronic fuel injection system, an early electronic engine management system.

From July, 1974 both SL and SLC could also be ordered with a fuel-injected 2.8L straight-6 as 280 SL and SLC. US models sold from 1976 through 1979 used the Bosch K Jetronic system, an entirely mechanical fuel injection system. All US models used the 4.5 liter engine, and were called 450 SL/SLC.

In September, 1977 the 450 SLC 5.0 joined the line. This was a special version of the big coupé featuring a new all-aluminum five-liter V8, aluminum alloy doors, hood and trunk lid - and a black rubber rear spoiler.
Mercedes-Benz 450 SLC 5.0 - note longer wheelbase and different rear pillar

Starting in 1980, US cars were equipped with lambda control, which varied the air/fuel mixture based on feedback from an oxygen sensor. The 350, 450 and 450 SLC 5.0 models (like the 350 and 450 SL) were discontinued in 1980 with the introduction of the 380 and 500 SLC in March, 1980. At the same time, the cars received a very mild makeover; the 3-speed automatic was replaced by a four-speed unit, the 280 models came with a standard 5-speed (formerly a 4-speed) manual and all five-liter cars gained a black rear spoiler lip.
The C107 SLC has had a successful rally career

The 280, 380 and 500 SLC were discontinued in 1981 with the introduction of the 126 series 380 and 500 SEC coupes. A total of 62,888 SLCs had been manufactured over a ten year period of which just 1,636 were the 450 SLC-5.0 and 1,133 were the 500 SLC. Both these models are sought by collectors today. With the exception of the SL65 AMG Black Series, the SLC remains the only fixed roof Mercedes-Benz coupe based on a roadster rather than a sedan.

Following the discontinuation of the SLC in September, 1981, the 107 series continued initially as the 280, 380 and 500 SL. At this time, the V8 engines were re-tuned for greater efficiency, lost a few hp and consumed less fuel, helped by substantially numerically shorter axle ratios (that went from 3.27:1 to 2.47:1 for the 380 SL and from 2.72:1 to 2.27:1 for the 500 SL). From September, 1985 the 280 SL was replaced by a new 300 SL, and the 380 SL by a 420 SL; the 500 SL continued and a 560 SL was introduced for certain extra-European markets, most notably the USA. Also in 1985, the Bosch KE Jetronic was fitted. The KE Jetronic system varied from the earlier, all mechanical system by the introduction of a more modern engine management "computer", which controlled idle speed, fuel rate, and air/fuel mixture. The final car of the 18 years running 107 series - 500 SL painted Astral Silver was built on August 4, 1989 and it currently resides in the Mercedes-Benz museum in Stuttgart, Germany.
------------------------------------------------------------------

EDIT #2: Another glaring error in this article is the 280sl 5-speed manual replacing the 4-speed in 1980. I know if a 1982 4-speed parts car in Virginia right now. I also believe there was a member with a 70's D-jet 280sl 5-speed. So the 5-speed as a 280sl option, until a later date when it became standard. What was that? 1984?

Maybe I should start a new thread with a topic of correcting the Wikipedia article. Anyone with more knowledge want to take the lead on this?
 

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1979 450 SLC 5.0
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1979 450SLC 5.0

Yes Sir,

My 1979 450SLC 5.0 will hit 65MPH in first gear if I hold it down in L.

The car will shift at about 50MPH if I put it in S, and about 40 if it is in D.

JetPaul
 
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