[VT404]

My neighbor has a 416 @ his shop (customers) for some fab work & some other "small" repairs. One of wich..... is to get it to shut off with out stalling in gear every time you want to stop. PO's have made many custom mods one of which is a electric fuel pump at the back of the cab (not sure why & if this has anything to do with the other problem. Took a quick a look & have never worked on this diesel before. Electrical shut off i presume (I.E. no pull cable)? solenoid location? Any help would be appreciated. :surrender:

 

[MiniMan]

You should have two mechanical systems used to cut fuel to the motor. One is with the hand throttle and the other is with the gas pedal, presuming the hand throttle has already been placed in it's off position. Make sure the gas pedal isn't getting stuck depressed part way, as that will keep fuel flowing and the truck running. If you have the hand throttle in the off position and you pull the gas pedal upwards/towards you and the truck continues to run, then I would check the linkages for each and adjust as necessary. I can't figure it would be much more than that.

Best of luck!

Corey

 

[tkv000]

yes, sometimes you have to pull up on the fuel pedal to shut these beasts off, might need some adjustment if that's the case.

 

[itjobhunter]

The hand throttle is on the side of the foot well just to the right of the accelerator pedal, and it should be moved as far forward as you need to in order to kill the engine's fuel supply. Some times you might need to pull back or up on the accelorator pedal too, if it is sticking or the linkage is binding.

If you have an engine brake (AKA exhaust brake) pedal, you can also stand on that at low RPM's and it will stall the engine. The pedal is about where the heel of your right foot would be, it is meant to be depressed with the right heel anyway!

There is no "electronic switch" to kill the motor though.

 

[gordon123]

I usually find its the little return spring on the right hand side of the engine as viewed from the rear. Sometimes the spring rusts through and then the engine wont switch off.

If I remember rightly, a genuine spring only costs a few pounds from MB. If you want the parts diagram or part number then let me know and I'll look it up on the EPC.

In the meantime, to switch it off without having to stall it take the engine cover off and pull the rod that the spring acts on backwards.

Cheers,

Gordon

 

[hammogger]

Did you mean the 'other' right heel, or is yours actually under the right heel? I think the logic is that the driver will never want to clutch and exhaust brake at the same time (would kill engine) but it's natural to wheel brake and engine/exhaust brake at the same time, so the valve is under the left (clutch) heel.

Just a small point but might confuse someone not familiar with these exhaust brakes.

Happy mogging New year everyone!

Bob

The hand throttle is on the side of the foot well just to the right of the accelerator pedal, and it should be moved as far forward as you need to in order to kill the engine's fuel supply. Some times you might need to pull back or up on the accelorator pedal too, if it is sticking or the linkage is binding.

If you have an engine brake (AKA exhaust brake) pedal, you can also stand on that at low RPM's and it will stall the engine. The pedal is about where the heel of your right foot would be, it is meant to be depressed with the right heel anyway!

There is no "electronic switch" to kill the motor though.

 

[ACAD_Cowboy]

The exhaust brake is not self acting on throttle lift off? Strange.

 

[mogmaner]

fail to stop

one thourt you say there is a electric fuel pump ,if the pump is still runing , i have had the extra presure cause the idel to rise not alowing the pomp to shut down fully hense engine wont stop.

 

[VT404]

Thank you soooo much for all the replies. This is exactly the info we were looking for to point us in the right direction. I'm not sure if the aftermarket fuel pump is playing a role in this problem but now that I know how it is suppossed to work, I will check the linkages first then go from there.

 

[MegaMog]

VT404, this drawing of the throttle linkage may be of value to you. Keep in mind that the drawing shows both the dash mounted hand throttle (on the upper right of the drawing), and the doghouse mounted hand throttle (on the left side of the drawing):

 

[itjobhunter]

Bob (hammogger),

My exhaust brake is under the right heel. I think your rationale is good as far as the clutch vs exhaust brake goes, but it is equally true that you would never depress the accelerator and exhaust brake together either. I would not speculate on the placement of either of our exhaust brake pedals, but I would say that in my 416, I have no place (due to the wheel well) to put my left foot when it is not depressing the clutch, except pulled back to where it appears your exhaust brake is... My foot well is very small!

Either way, I took and labeled a pic for VT404. You can see the following pedals: clutch, brake, accelerator, and exhaust; and the hand throttle as well.

 

[rmontez]

Hijacking this topic with a question but related....

Folks,
I'm having a problem where if I set the dash mounted hand throttle at the idle indent it will barely idle in the low 600rpm range. when I adjust the cable at the hand throttle to get it around 700rpm then I can't shut the engine down.
Can somebody provide the steps they used to adjust their throttle linkages, both hand throttle and the foot throttle so it idles at about 700rpm and it hits the stop at 2800-3000rpm and it shuts down with the hand throttle. Put another way where do you start? Start at the IP and make sure you hit the stop and work your way backwards? Start at the hand throttle and work your way to the IP? Or.....
Thanks for any help
Rick

Coachgeo, it this is to far off topic please make it a new one.

 

[hammogger]

Thanks for that picture. Had not seen one like that before. My control is a pushbutton to set the heel on (left heel).

Either position works, and there are logical reasons either way.

BTW, I have found out the hard way not to hit the exhaust brake at 60 mph going down hill when the Claas overdrive has failed to shift past neutral. That woke me up!!! Dead engine, sailing down hill out of gear.....gotta watch that left heel.

Bob

Bob (hammogger),

My exhaust brake is under the right heel. I think your rationale is good as far as the clutch vs exhaust brake goes, but it is equally true that you would never depress the accelerator and exhaust brake together either. I would not speculate on the placement of either of our exhaust brake pedals, but I would say that in my 416, I have no place (due to the wheel well) to put my left foot when it is not depressing the clutch, except pulled back to where it appears your exhaust brake is... My foot well is very small!

Either way, I took and labeled a pic for VT404. You can see the following pedals: clutch, brake, accelerator, and exhaust; and the hand throttle as well.

 

[hammogger]

Do you have the dash-mount type? The detent point is adjustable by rotating the handle on it's splined post. You are probably aware that the tension on the handle can be adjusted so you can set your idle at any rpm you desire. I think the detent is just to keep a quick slap of the idle lever (as to quickly go out of "cruise control, LOL) from killing the engine.

Bob

Folks,
I'm having a problem where if I set the dash mounted hand throttle at the idle indent it will barely idle in the low 600rpm range. when I adjust the cable at the hand throttle to get it around 700rpm then I can't shut the engine down.
Can somebody provide the steps they used to adjust their throttle linkages, both hand throttle and the foot throttle so it idles at about 700rpm and it hits the stop at 2800-3000rpm and it shuts down with the hand throttle. Put another way where do you start? Start at the IP and make sure you hit the stop and work your way backwards? Start at the hand throttle and work your way to the IP? Or.....
Thanks for any help
Rick

Coachgeo, it this is to far off topic please make it a new one.

 

[rmontez]

Hammogger,
I always thought the detent position was where it should idle and where it would "catch" the hand throttle handle so it could not try to move around as the cab bounces and flexes. If my assumption is not correct then I still have a problem becase try as I might I cannot get the hand throttle tight enought to stay put, and I've already replaced the friction disk. Hmmm I'll keep on plugging along.
Thanks
Rick

 

[tkv000]

Bob (hammogger),

My exhaust brake is under the right heel. I think your rationale is good as far as the clutch vs exhaust brake goes, but it is equally true that you would never depress the accelerator and exhaust brake together either. I would not speculate on the placement of either of our exhaust brake pedals, but I would say that in my 416, I have no place (due to the wheel well) to put my left foot when it is not depressing the clutch, except pulled back to where it appears your exhaust brake is... My foot well is very small!

Either way, I took and labeled a pic for VT404. You can see the following pedals: clutch, brake, accelerator, and exhaust; and the hand throttle as well.

Nice Truck!

 

[VT404]

Just an update: the (dash mounted) hand throttle is completely disconnected and a aftermarket cable was installed & tapped into the linkage on the passenger side of the engine. The pivot for the accelerator pedal (where it goes through the doghouse) has about 1/4" - 1/2" of slop. No amount of pulling seems to work. Still need to adjust the linkage to see if that helps but given the amount of slop I'm not sure it's going to help. Probably going to have to do some kind custom pull cable/lever as the owner probably won't want to put it back to the way it was (it's going to be used as a camp vehicle to haul supplies). This poor truck has seen some serious use & abuse over it's lifetime.

Thanks for the quick responses as always... saved some head scratching.

 

[rmontez]

Well, that explains why they had to stall the engine in gear....
Unimirr is in Germany and Couchoffroad is in Colorado. May be they can help with a custom throttle.
Rick


UNIMURR - All for the Unimog


Couch-Off Road Enginering : CORE PRODUCTS : Unimog Denver

 

[VON]

You could put it all back to stock. Seems to work for all the rest of us. I have not found anything that works better than what they have now. I have all the parts in NOS and used. Let me know if I can be of help.

 

[VT404]

You could put it all back to stock. Seems to work for all the rest of us. I have not found anything that works better than what they have now. I have all the parts in NOS and used. Let me know if I can be of help.

Totally agree with you Von....but the customer doesn't want to bother (he would continue to stall it if he had to - didn't seem to bother him). What would all the parts for the hand throttle (everything but the lever on the dash) be worth used?