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'82 Euro 500SEL, '85 Euro 500SEC AMG WB Cabriolet,'86 Euro 500SEC RUF
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Discussion Starter #1
My 560 SEc has this mysterious thing going on and I have searched for an answer and get more than one.
Scenario: Shifting manually from 1st thru 4th gears. I do not have FGS yet, but have tried to shift this car manually and it does great at about 4500 rpm from 1st to 2nd slap shift (from B to 2nd) and it'll chirp the tires fine. 2nd to 3rd there is a hiccup (forth and back type hunting for gear (a limiter of some kind) hiccup)at about 45000-5000 rpm, if I keep my foot in it. If I let off the merest bit it does fine. If I shift 3rd to 4th it'll hiccup at 45000-5000 rpm, if I keep my foot in it. Again the merest let off and it does fine thru all the gears. No way in H-E- Double Hockey Sticks will this car make it to the red line(6000 RPM) with my foot in it. If I run it up easy it'll do just fine (not more than 45-47000 RPM). Not if I'm getting all over it.

Ordinary driving the shifts are fine. I do not believe that there is anything wrong with the transmission.

Is there a rev/rpm limiter? Is it in the FPR? Fuel Accumulator?
I read a similar thread about a diesel doing the same thing and the fuel filter(s) were replaced and it fixed the problem.
Funny thing is that my 380SE does the same hiccup thing.
 

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Always Remembered RIP
1991 560SEC AMG
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10,146 Posts
The tiny orange dots on your speedometer are the maximum speeds in mph/kph at which the car should go before shifting into the next gear
 

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1987 560 sec impala metalflake over cream
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1,093 Posts
My 560 SEc has this mysterious thing going on and I have searched for an answer and get more than one.
Scenario: Shifting manually from 1st thru 4th gears. I do not have FGS yet, but have tried to shift this car manually and it does great at about 4500 rpm from 1st to 2nd slap shift (from B to 2nd) and it'll chirp the tires fine. 2nd to 3rd there is a hiccup (forth and back type hunting for gear (a limiter of some kind) hiccup)at about 45000-5000 rpm, if I keep my foot in it. If I let off the merest bit it does fine. If I shift 3rd to 4th it'll hiccup at 45000-5000 rpm, if I keep my foot in it. Again the merest let off and it does fine thru all the gears. No way in H-E- Double Hockey Sticks will this car make it to the red line(6000 RPM) with my foot in it. If I run it up easy it'll do just fine (not more than 45-47000 RPM). Not if I'm getting all over it.

Ordinary driving the shifts are fine. I do not believe that there is anything wrong with the transmission.

Is there a rev/rpm limiter? Is it in the FPR? Fuel Accumulator?
I read a similar thread about a diesel doing the same thing and the fuel filter(s) were replaced and it fixed the problem.
Funny thing is that my 380SE does the same hiccup thing.
holly crap! were you out of smokes? that equates to 47, 86, 120, mph. i L.M.A.O. when i read this
keep on trucking:thumbsup:
 

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Is there a rev/rpm limiter? Is it in the FPR? Fuel Accumulator?
I read a similar thread about a diesel doing the same thing and the fuel filter(s) were replaced and it fixed the problem.
Funny thing is that my 380SE does the same hiccup thing.[/QUOTE]
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The rev limiter is in the FPR and we all know how reliable they are. A partially clogged fuel filter will starve the engine at full load - engine wants more fuel than it is getting - not necessarily at full RPM.
 

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'82 Euro 500SEL, '85 Euro 500SEC AMG WB Cabriolet,'86 Euro 500SEC RUF
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Discussion Starter #5 (Edited)
Cascade,
Well to be honest i do not recall what the shift points on the odometer were as I was watching the Tach.

Granit560,
Don't smoke, and no I wasn't doing 120 in 3rd.
Though Cascade tells me at floored the tranny shifts out of third at 120 MPH. THIS CAR WON"T at this time. However it does shift out upon easy run up at over 100 mph. (nice to have a sparsely traveled 4 lane mountain road that is almost a mile in length near by, (Angeles Forest Road above (south) Mt. Emma Rd.).

NordRhein,
Gotcha, that is what I'm thinking too.
It DOES sound and feel like a starvation problem. Not knowing the history on the car I'm guessing I'm way beyond the NLE of the fuel filter. (on both the 380SE and the SEC.) New fuel filters coming up. Both tranny's work as they should other than the hiccup.

Here's the to do list for the next 3 weeks in order.

1. NEW BRAKES all around and new rotors.
Any thought on the good cross drilled rotors on EBAY?
The car doesn't pull in either direction when applying the brakes, even the OH S**T stops, and there is no warp or grab. New rotors may not be needed.

2. New windshield.

3. Fuel Filter

Actually the fuel filter may get put in first as I have one on hand.

4. new FPR on the 380SE
5. New Fuel Filter (380SE)
 

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Depends on the day!
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Check your fuel pump relay, make sure someone has the correct one installed..

Jonathan
 

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'82 Euro 500SEL, '85 Euro 500SEC AMG WB Cabriolet,'86 Euro 500SEC RUF
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Discussion Starter #8
Thanks Jono, I'll check that out too.
 

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Discussion Starter #9 (Edited)
I looked at my FPR today and it is a replacement KAE unit.
Don't know if it is the correct one for a 560SEC but I took the following picture and maybe someone can tell me if it is correct and if it is tuned correctly,(it has no knob, but a port for maybe a screwdriver?). It appears that the adjustment is full to right and it is not quite to the horizontal line in the symbol. About +10-15 degrees from horizontal(Symbol Line) .......if my small screwdriver blade fit the slot correctly. I could not adjust more right to the horizontal line (Symbol).

 

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CH4S Admin , Outstanding Contributor
1985 500SEC, 1991 190E 2.6.
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The KAE don't last, and the 'knob' is a re settable fuse I believe.
 

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Isn't the H.P. peak at around 4800 revs? remember that the M117 will not do as well in the higher rev band like the quad cam M119's U.S. version 560's are more of a low rev torquey engine. Don't get me wrong, they do pull very strong and sound nice doing it when they come on the cam. Mine does the same thing when I push it hard and i have gone through everything. Mine just isn't too happy when pushed over 5K?
 

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'82 Euro 500SEL, '85 Euro 500SEC AMG WB Cabriolet,'86 Euro 500SEC RUF
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Discussion Starter #12
That is a distinct possibility. If I make sure that I shift out at 4500 RPM it does just fine. In my 380 SE if I shift into 1st gear at a light and then shift manually(no FGS electronics) I can red line it and it shifts out at higher RPMs than the SEC.

I cannot do that with the SEC. I do believe that it has something to do with the FPR and possibly the fuel filter, or the FPR isn't adjusted right.

I thried the 4500 rpm thing this evening and it shifted fine, but not if I put my foot in it to let it shift by itself. It just won't do that.
 

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I'd deep 6 that KAE unit yesterday..they're junk.

You need to run these engines out to 6K to maximum acceleration otherwise when you shift you'll fall Way off the torque peak.

Jonathan
 

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'82 Euro 500SEL, '85 Euro 500SEC AMG WB Cabriolet,'86 Euro 500SEC RUF
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Discussion Starter #14
UPDATE:!!!!
Jono and Teutone,
You guys rock!
I changed out the FPR today with a used tested real MB unit and all I can say is......

HOOOOLLLLLY CRAAAAAAP!

What a difference!!! The SEC will red line now in at least in the 1-2 , the 2-3 shift (haven't had the guts or hwy space to red line it in 3rd (120MPH??). The shift points on the speedometer are almost dead on with the shifts.

YEEEHAWWWW!

After testing this car out more than a few times I was convinced that;
1. The tranny is A-OK
2. There was a fuel delivery problem not a tranny problem..
3. Possible fuel filter partially clogged issue.

and after these posts,

4. The FPR

Many Thanks Jono and Teutone


P.S. The KAE was not deep 6'd, but put in my emergency get home travel kit until it will be replaced with another real MB FPR.

Now to find a real MB FPR for the 380SE who is experiencing the exact same problem and has a KAE in it. Missed one yesterday on Ebay.
 
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