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(sorry if this is a noob question) If the wheels are offset 25, how exactly does the spacer help? Would a 12mm spacer bring the gap down to 13?
As others have pointed out, the spacers don't modify the rims. A one-piece wheel's characteristics are set when manufactured.

The spacers modify the mounting surface, pushing it further out from the centerline of the car.

The effect of buying an otherwise identical wheel with an offset that is 10 mm lower (ET 15 vs. 25) is the same as using a 10 mm spacer, but with fewer complications (longer wheel bolts, centering issues, etc.).
 

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Hoping for you guys these knock-offs are better made than the AMG R129 18 x 9"/10" cast one piece knock-offs (also made in China) that myself and a few other coupe owners bought and ditched a few years ago. All of us had vibration issue at highway speed and despite numerous goes at getting them re-balanced the vibration issue would always return after time (not immediately but after a while of driving)
We all had the same problem and lived in different states and in the end we all got rid of them and problem solved. No spacers with those rims as they were a straight bolt up.
Steve over in Melb whose brother owned a tire shop came to the conclusion it was in the quality/manufacture of the rim and nothing could be done.
Since then i have always paid more and stuck with genuine wheels

The cheap price of these rims coming from China has me wary of the quality of the alloy content and wish one of you guys who owns them would get a metallurgy test done to verify alloy content for piece of mind. The W126 is not a light car by any means and hitting bumps and potholes at speed in general road use over time is what we are talking about and only time will tell how they stack up.

Not knocking the rims here but just stating you only get what you pay for and to cut costs a high grade alloy would most likely not be the case
 

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I concur with Kim "KRH" as I first encountered this issue about 10 years ago when there was a huge influx of inexpensive wheels imported from China. Not necessarily for MB's but for all types of autos. I was at a wheel repair shop having a couple AMG aero 1's trued up (seems like every set of those I have purchased used were bent one way or another). The head wheel guy had a few wheels sitting around with chunks missing and I asked him how he was going to fix those? He said I can't, the metal doesn't bend it just cracks or as I could see chunks of metal were missing on the rims. He then said he tells all his customers that if they buy these knock-offs make sure you buy at least one extra as when this type of failure occurs it's much cheaper to replace the wheel as they cannot be repaired. At that point I decided to steer clear of these types of wheels. It took 10 years and I did buy a set of Penta repros that Roland sells only because they are TUV tested. I am a believer that the factories in China can produce excellent product at a reasonable price if the proper specifications are in place and executed. I will say most of the crap wheels I witnessed at that time were 18-21" and all wore low profile tires making them more conducive to receiving a hard blow by a pothole etc. My many years of experience with too many to count W126's I have not witnessed any issues with 15 or 16" factory or period correct aftermarket wheels produced in Germany or Italy. As in ZERO. As enthusiasts we have a much better probability for success compared to someone that buys some cheap wheels at a local tire shop because they want something new and shiny. Mike
 

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On the flip side of the coin, I've had about 5 various sets of aftermarket wheels (various sizes, styles from a 2002 Lincoln LS to my current E55, to my old CLK55, all made in China I believe) all with zero issues in vibration and overall quality. Only exception that I noticed is that some are not as durable from a gloss finish aspect, to strong wheel cleaners, and the finish tended to dull on one set. Switched to a practice of only cleaning wheels with carwash soap, and that took care of that for remaining sets of wheels. From a strength aspect, here in this part of Va, roads are generally in very good condition so reduced risk associated with bad roads/potholes. In the DC area? Different story, but in many years of experience, cant say the OEM alloys were significantly stronger than the aftermarkets I've had. Only exception being OEM forged BMW wheels I once had on a E36.
I suspect my vibration issues may be tied to larger than the norm (25mm) hubcentric spacers on the rear, especially since on my rebalance on the Hunter last time, all wheels were still well within road force specs and balance specs. (one wheel was 1/4 oz out of spec, but was remedied with an additional weight). But thats just a guess

I'll continue troubleshooting until I get it smooth.
 

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One thing I did notice: When I place my spacers onto my rear hubs, there is the slightest (and I mean the slightest) amount of play between hole of the spacer and the hub it sits on. I can move the spacer itself up/down or side to side a fraction of a millimeter by hand. Is it possible that this extremely slight play is resulting in runout of the wheel once installed? Enough so that the vibration issue only appears at high speed?
If so, does this mean that hubcentric rings would be the solution? If so, what size would I try?

https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=m570.l1313&_nkw=66.56+centring+ring&_sacat=0
 

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I've had these Performas for about a year w/ no issues so far. I have custom spacers both front and back to solve the different hub/bore issue and to get them away from suspension components. I've had the car up 90mph w/ no vibrations. Concerns about the quality of these wheels are certainly legit. I still have no idea where they were made let alone the manufacturing process but given the fact they are 1/3 to 1/4 of the price of the real thing and look fantastic, they provide a lot of value. I'm still very happy w/ my decision to buy these wheels.
 

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I've had these Performas for about a year w/ no issues so far. I have custom spacers both front and back to solve the different hub/bore issue and to get them away from suspension components. I've had the car up 90mph w/ no vibrations. Concerns about the quality of these wheels are certainly legit. I still have no idea where they were made let alone the manufacturing process but given the fact they are 1/3 to 1/4 of the price of the real thing and look fantastic, they provide a lot of value. I'm still very happy w/ my decision to buy these wheels.
Jake..do you happen to have a link to your custom spacer source? Also, what size are your running in the rear?
If it turns out my spacers are the issue with the high speed vibration, I may try custom spacers as well
 

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Jake..do you happen to have a link to your custom spacer source? Also, what size are your running in the rear?
If it turns out my spacers are the issue with the high speed vibration, I may try custom spacers as well
Wheel Adapters, Wheel Spacers, Hub Rings, and much more! | Motorsport Tech Talk to Lenny, he's the owner. My invoice # was 144021 if that will help. I have 10mm in the front and 15mm in back. If I had to do it again, I would do 20mm maybe even 25mm in back. I think the 10mm in the front was to have the wheel moved out the least possible amount and still get the wheels away from the suspension and not have to use raised center caps. NOTE: I needed custom spacers because the bore of the wheels I bought were 73.1mm and our wheel hub is 66.6mm. The custom part of my spacers is the fact that the side of the spacer facing the hub has a bore of 66.6mm and side of the spacer facing the wheel has a bore of 73.1mm.(this isn't exactly right but it's the best explanation I can fashion at the moment). So, you don't really need custom spacers if the bore of your wheels is the same as our hub, unless you just think these will be machined more precisely than what you currently have.

P.S. a pair of H&R spacers are $95.00 w/free shipping at ECS tuning, so times 2 is $190.00. Mine were $230.00 plus $25.00 shipping w/ no tax. H&R are pretty high quality but my custom spacers weren't too much more.
 

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Running a 25 mm spacer on a et25 performa results in a ET 0 .

Unless you have a widebody this is nowhere near correct for a w126


Not sure where you are going w/ this but at the risk of sounding like a broken record, adding a spacer has no effect on the offset. As Nietzsche said, if the einpress tiefe is 25mm then the einpress tiefe is 25mm.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
 

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Not sure where you are going w/ this but at the risk of sounding like a broken record, adding a spacer has no effect on the offset. As Nietzsche said, if the einpress tiefe is 25mm then the einpress tiefe is 25mm.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
I think what he's saying is that with an ET 25 wheel using 25mm spacers, you're going to push the wheel way too far out. It will go out past the wheel well, hence the wide-body comment.

For reference, the 3 piece wheels I have are: 8.5" fronts ET 18, 10" rears ET 17
 

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I think what he's saying is that with an ET 25 wheel using 25mm spacers, you're going to push the wheel way too far out. It will go out past the wheel well, hence the wide-body comment.

For reference, the 3 piece wheels I have are: 8.5" fronts ET 18, 10" rears ET 17
I may be succeeding but I am not trying to be a dick about this. I realize this a complicated subject but it is important when trying to communicate an idea that we have a care in the language we use, more to the point the definitions of the words we use. If it's possible to search my previous posts from a couple of years ago, I'm sure one can find me asking a question that goes along the lines of "What's an offset?" or "What's the big deal about putting oil in your car?", so I make no claim to be an expert on all of this. That would be the fella who lives on the other side of the world.

So, let's go to pics and see. Again, this is a 10mm spacer on the fronts and 15mm spacer on the back. I think if I went to 25mm in the back ( that's an additional 10mm or 0.40 inches ), I've got plenty of room.
 

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anyone measure the weight of these wheels by chance

out authentic amg 3 piece are heavy as f

i wonder how these are
 

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jake: that SEC looking hot, man. (despite the diving board USA bumpers). :)

Did some testing yesterday: Swapped the 25mm spacers for 20mm spacers that I had in the garage from earlier testing. (both sets hubcentric). Too her out for a test, and vibration in seat definitely reduced by about 40% of what it was, and it pushed the speed at which vibration occurs out from about 65mph to about 73 or so mph. I came back home, and then decided to lift car in air, remove both front wheels, and carefully examine..everything. All looked fine. Very carefully reinstalled wheels with car in air, then carefully in star pattern tightened lugs with car in air. Lowered car just enough so that tires wouldnt spin, but not lowered with full car weight on wheels. Used torque wrench to finalize tigtening of all lugs. Went back out, and now the slight amount of steering wheel vibration that I was feeling, was also reduced.

So my guess: Combo of lowered suspension, larger diameter wheels from stock, wider wheels than stock, bigger and wider tires than stock, wider stance/spacers....all are factors. And considering that most spacers that are 25mm or higher that are sold seem to be the kind that bolt to the actual wheel hub (ie those H&R's and DRA's referenced earlier in this thread) and Im using basic 25mm spacers back there that dont bolt on, I suspect the rear spacers may be the biggest factor. While they are very nicely made CNC machined aluminum, hub centric, etc, due to the rather extreme size, there may be benefit in using the bolt on spacers, especially with the other mods (suspension/wheels/tires) in place that make the suspension/steering/ride, much more sensitive.
 

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Discussion Starter #38
Thank you, i followed your setting from your post years ago, and its a success for me, i like the result, thank you.



I may be succeeding but I am not trying to be a dick about this. I realize this a complicated subject but it is important when trying to communicate an idea that we have a care in the language we use, more to the point the definitions of the words we use. If it's possible to search my previous posts from a couple of years ago, I'm sure one can find me asking a question that goes along the lines of "What's an offset?" or "What's the big deal about putting oil in your car?", so I make no claim to be an expert on all of this. That would be the fella who lives on the other side of the world.

So, let's go to pics and see. Again, this is a 10mm spacer on the fronts and 15mm spacer on the back. I think if I went to 25mm in the back ( that's an additional 10mm or 0.40 inches ), I've got plenty of room.
 

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On an SEC with the original AMG pentas that are 16 x 9" ET0
I believe these knock-offs are 9" rear so 17 x 9" ET25" add a 25mm spacer pushes the rim outwards by 25mm which creates the same result of running a 9" rim with an ET0

To cut through any confusion - adding a spacer does not change the rim specs but it does change where the rim sits in the wheel well by moving it outwards dependent on the thickness of the spacer - It replicates a rim that does has an ET0 offset and that was really pushing the limits before having outer tire rub issues on the wheel arch (they only ran 245 width tires back then on the rear. The British Penta 9" rear was a better offset at ET11 as it is a better fit allowing a 255/50 rear tire to fit without any outer rubbing

Offset is no different for any diameter rim as it only relates to the position of the rim within the wheel well (Tub) of the car - negative offset pushes the rim out and positive offset moves the rim inwards

In reference to Offset (ET) ET0 means no offset - the mounting hub of the rim is dead centre of the rim
Positive offset (ET11 or ET17 or ET18 or ET25 etc) is moving the rim mount face more towards the face of the rim /wheel moves inwards towards the car body - as in majority of cars.
And to make it more confusing an offset specs change with different rim widths, so you can't compare any different width rim as to their offset.
If say a line up of different width rims all with ET0 offset (dead centre mount face) then the wider the rim it would be equally wider towards the outer guard and inner guard.
As soon as you alter the offset say by adding a 20mm spacer - the skinny 7inch rim would have no problems but the much wider 10inch rim would have outer clearance issues as it would replicate a negative offset ET-20

A negative offset is rare and only applies really to widebody cars with wide rear rims
The AMG Penta 16 x 10 ET-12.5 had that rim mount hub moved towards the rear of the rim by 12.5mm from the centreline to push the rim more outwards.
Hence why fitting a widebody Penta rim just won't work on a standard body car unless the guards are modified and the rim wears really stretched tyres - which looks ludicrous and in my own opinion a dangerous practice stretching a tire way past its spec range.

And yes unless the spacer is mounted dead centre of the car hub it will cause vibration issues. At least the type that bolt to the brake rotor hub can be checked with a dial gauge for any run-out versus a straight bolt on with longer lugs which can't.

But any wheel mounted to car that has been balanced and has the correct centre bore 66.56mm (or 66.6mm is close enough) and decent tires should not be causing vibration issues no matter if the rim is wider and/or wears a wider tire than factory.
 
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