High milage 722.6 wear questions (MAVA my lord and savior?!) - Mercedes-Benz Forum
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 21 (permalink) Old 06-06-2018, 05:55 AM Thread Starter
BenzWorld Extremist
 
Rossafuss's Avatar
 
Date registered: Oct 2013
Vehicle: 2005 E320 CDI *black on black with nearly every option*
Location: Lansing Michigan
Posts: 870
Mentioned: 19 Post(s)
Quoted: 195 Post(s)
(Thread Starter)
High milage 722.6 wear questions (MAVA my lord and savior?!)

My 05 E320 CDI with 443,000 miles is still running and driving great, but my transmission has always never shifted quite as nicely as my dads 06 E320 CDI. There's no noticeable slipping, no serious shifting delays, BUT i am detecting a bit of an issue with the behavior of the torque converter. Sometimes when accelerating at low speeds in a high gear (low RPM's high torque) the torque converter doesn't feel like its grabbing or "transferring torque" quite as well as it should. I can hear the turbo spooling and the engine revving, but the car intermittently doesn't accelerate as quickly as it should. Again, The experience is NOT slipping, but something else as the car still does accelerate all the time, just sometimes not quite as quickly. almost as if the lockup clutch is not locking when it should.

Second issue, is under hard acceleration between 2-3, i get a HEAVY wub-wub-wub vibration/smacking right under the center console when the engine is at peak torque. it feels as though the vibration is 'muffled', as though its being dampened (By rubber mounts perhaps?)
I've replaced or checked every component post-transmission; driveshaft center support, flex disks, engine and tranny mounts, etc. The vibration definitely feels as though its coming from the transmission.
a similar vibration i feel coming from the same place accelerating at any rate between 3-4. its a light vibration, but it vibrates the whole car noticeably to feel in my butt. i believe these two acceleration problems are connected, possibly related to the torque converter issue? maybe a main bushing failure? (transmission fluid has always been quite nice looking after every 30k mile trans flush. no signs of coolant intrusion. Radiator has been replaced before i got the car, and then replaced again last year after a minor front end impact.

I noted a while ago in another thread that on my last transmission flush, i had tiny copper/brass looking non-ferrous shavings in the bottom of the pan and the filter. A few of you remarked that they are most likely to be from the friction material, but more unlikely COULD be from bushings.

Due to the high mileage, i was basically just planning on just continuing 'as normal' driving the car, and just plan on completely rebuilding the transmission and replacing the torque converter when something finally fails.

ALL of these problems have been present since i bought the car 3 years ago, and haven't noticeably gotten much worse since then. What do you guys think? Any suggestions on what to look at or if i should rebuild the transmission BEFORE it blows up?
as usual your input is much appreciated.

_______________________________________

"Concentrated power is not rendered harmless by the good intentions of those who create it."

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

2005 CLK320 - Wifes DD
2005 E320 CDI - Black on Black 450K+miles - MY current DD
2006 E320 CDI - Dads DD
2007 E320 Bluetec - Sisters DD
2008 ML320 CDI - Mothers DD
__________________________________
Gone:
83 300SD
86 190D 2.5
91 300D
95 C280
97 C280
99 E300D
Rossafuss is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 21 (permalink) Old 06-07-2018, 08:33 AM
BenzWorld Elite
 
Kajtek1's Avatar
 
Date registered: Dec 2005
Vehicle: E320/E250 Bluetec Ford F350 6.7l
Location: V E G A S
Posts: 35,405
Mentioned: 30 Post(s)
Quoted: 1980 Post(s)
When MAVA sure is expert on those transmission, I would suggest sending ATF sample to the lab. I am using Blackstone.
On other hand my $100 scanners allow for monitoring transmission gear changes and slippage during driving. Did not get to it yet, as I have no complains, but the option is there.
MAVA likes this.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Kajtek1 is online now  
post #3 of 21 (permalink) Old 06-07-2018, 08:56 AM Thread Starter
BenzWorld Extremist
 
Rossafuss's Avatar
 
Date registered: Oct 2013
Vehicle: 2005 E320 CDI *black on black with nearly every option*
Location: Lansing Michigan
Posts: 870
Mentioned: 19 Post(s)
Quoted: 195 Post(s)
(Thread Starter)
I am going to do a Blackstone analysis sometime soon, as I'm going to do an engine oil analysis as well.

I have monitored gear shift change times in star before, and there was very little time between "target gear" and "actual gear". MAVA let me know about the adaptation values and how that's a good indicator of transmission health in a previous post, and none were even close to the low or high limit values in either fill time or pressure when I carried out the test. (I would have posted results, but was in a hurry that day and didn't have time to take screen shots.)

I had a feeling the adaptation values would be fine, given that the transmission doesn't really 'hang' between gears at all, and resetting the adaptation data doesn't really drastically change the way the transmission behaves. I have NOT checked them since I reset the adaptation values though, I'll do that tonight.

To me it feels more like an issue with the torque converter. Either with the locking clutch friction material itself, or with the valve body.
The shift quality doesn't quite feel as quick and tight as on my dad's CDI as I stated, but his has less than half the milage. I just attribute that to valve body wear, and it's nowhere near what anybody else would consider a 'problem'.

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk

_______________________________________

"Concentrated power is not rendered harmless by the good intentions of those who create it."

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

2005 CLK320 - Wifes DD
2005 E320 CDI - Black on Black 450K+miles - MY current DD
2006 E320 CDI - Dads DD
2007 E320 Bluetec - Sisters DD
2008 ML320 CDI - Mothers DD
__________________________________
Gone:
83 300SD
86 190D 2.5
91 300D
95 C280
97 C280
99 E300D
Rossafuss is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #4 of 21 (permalink) Old 06-07-2018, 03:45 PM
BenzWorld Member
 
Date registered: Nov 2009
Vehicle: 2006 E320 CDI
Location: Loudon, TN
Posts: 254
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Quoted: 72 Post(s)
Question

What is "MAVA"?
hangit is offline  
post #5 of 21 (permalink) Old 06-07-2018, 03:57 PM Thread Starter
BenzWorld Extremist
 
Rossafuss's Avatar
 
Date registered: Oct 2013
Vehicle: 2005 E320 CDI *black on black with nearly every option*
Location: Lansing Michigan
Posts: 870
Mentioned: 19 Post(s)
Quoted: 195 Post(s)
(Thread Starter)
Quote:
Originally Posted by hangit View Post
What is "MAVA"?
Only one of the most magnificent mercedes transmission experts known to man that lurks with us mortals on the forums.
We really don't deserve him.

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk
MAVA likes this.

_______________________________________

"Concentrated power is not rendered harmless by the good intentions of those who create it."

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

2005 CLK320 - Wifes DD
2005 E320 CDI - Black on Black 450K+miles - MY current DD
2006 E320 CDI - Dads DD
2007 E320 Bluetec - Sisters DD
2008 ML320 CDI - Mothers DD
__________________________________
Gone:
83 300SD
86 190D 2.5
91 300D
95 C280
97 C280
99 E300D
Rossafuss is offline  
post #6 of 21 (permalink) Old 06-07-2018, 09:03 PM
BenzWorld Member
 
PSDCamperVan's Avatar
 
Date registered: Jul 2015
Vehicle: 2005 E320 CDI (SOLD); 2008 ML320 CDI 4MATIC
Location: Orlando, Florida
Posts: 177
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Quoted: 34 Post(s)
My car is exhibiting same issue of mysterious friction noises that appear to be coming from transmission somewhere under center console during cold start warm-up runs. Shifts from 1-2 & 2-3 in Sport mode actually remind me of a bouncing ball as car will surge & coast (ebb & flow like ocean tide waves) after shift to higher gear during gradual accelerations to 25mph or so until coolant temperature reaches about 80 C. A recent ATF flush revealed aluminum in pan & brown fluid after 30k miles. I haven't replaced flex discs on driveshaft yet & have theorized these to be suspect. Best case scenario that I picture occurring is flex disc's gradual fatigue wearing down to act like a springy coily torsion bar on driveshaft right after shift until speed of it catches up to new load demand & smooths out. I actually had a flex disc fail in a previous car. When it came apart it's disintegration reminded me of a baseball that loses it's outer jacket skin to reveal a bunch of tightly wound rubber bands peeling & unraveling away from each other. It's either those flex discs, TC, or a sleeve spring in valve body but since the latter 2 are rather labor intensive to replace or directly access to inspect, I will eventually replace 1st the flex-discs & hope I don't have to change out driveshaft center-bearing as well although likely I will have to replace it too truth be known which will make that job almost as labor intensive as exhaust pipes & mufflers will have to be dropped out of the way to get access to it. DAS hasn't stored any codes related to transmission yet & CC still works nicely. Adaptation resets tend to cure issue for a little while but eventually bouncy shifts return when ATF & coolant are less than normal operating temperature. The friction noises are most noticeable when I accelerate in 1st & then back off the throttle just prior to upshift & allow car to coast to a stop. The friction sounds I hear resemble a spinning lathe that is whittling away on a pipe that has run out or a warped brake rotor that is intermittenly & unevenly contacting brake pad with light braking. I definitely suspect those sounds are coming from TC. I've been thinking about securing a go-pro or cellphone to bell housing to see if I can catch some of those sounds on video live & direct to identify & differentially diagnose it further but for time being I'm just carefully driving the car like driving Miss Daisy until it warms up so as not to rock the boat too far to tip it over. Once it's warm, car shifts smooth as butter regardless how hard I push it & still gets 30-35mpg on highway commutes so I count my blessings & just monitor the situation until something more sinister starts manifesting.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Last edited by PSDCamperVan; 06-07-2018 at 09:14 PM.
PSDCamperVan is offline  
post #7 of 21 (permalink) Old 06-09-2018, 10:17 AM
ot1
BenzWorld Veteran
 
Date registered: Apr 2007
Vehicle: 2006 E320 CDI
Location: Midwest USA
Posts: 600
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Quoted: 143 Post(s)
Who performed the “flush”? This trans takes 8 quarts, but I end up wasting an extra 2 quarts to make sure the fluid is fully replaced in the TC and cooler when its pumped through. Was the pan dropped? Magnet cleaned? Do you have a MB dipstick to check the level? A140589152100 $23 at dealer, this allows you to check the level and color. There are shops that don’t bother dropping the pan but just suck the fluid out the dipstick tube and half of the fluid can still remain in the TC.
ot1 is offline  
post #8 of 21 (permalink) Old 06-09-2018, 12:10 PM Thread Starter
BenzWorld Extremist
 
Rossafuss's Avatar
 
Date registered: Oct 2013
Vehicle: 2005 E320 CDI *black on black with nearly every option*
Location: Lansing Michigan
Posts: 870
Mentioned: 19 Post(s)
Quoted: 195 Post(s)
(Thread Starter)
I did an actual flush by popping off the trans cooler lines from the radiator. I flushed a total of probabaly 10q through when I FIRST got the car. Since then, every 3 engine oil changes, or approximately 35k miles, I drain the pan, change the filter, clean the pan and magnet, and refill with the right amount of oil to top it off to the full mark on the dipstick at 80c. I see no need to do a complete flush every 30k.

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk
MAVA likes this.

_______________________________________

"Concentrated power is not rendered harmless by the good intentions of those who create it."

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

2005 CLK320 - Wifes DD
2005 E320 CDI - Black on Black 450K+miles - MY current DD
2006 E320 CDI - Dads DD
2007 E320 Bluetec - Sisters DD
2008 ML320 CDI - Mothers DD
__________________________________
Gone:
83 300SD
86 190D 2.5
91 300D
95 C280
97 C280
99 E300D
Rossafuss is offline  
post #9 of 21 (permalink) Old 06-09-2018, 12:19 PM Thread Starter
BenzWorld Extremist
 
Rossafuss's Avatar
 
Date registered: Oct 2013
Vehicle: 2005 E320 CDI *black on black with nearly every option*
Location: Lansing Michigan
Posts: 870
Mentioned: 19 Post(s)
Quoted: 195 Post(s)
(Thread Starter)
Here's the results of the adaptation values in STAR!
according to STAR, "if the filling time and shift time are at the adaptation limit, the adaptation values of further gearshifts may be increased."
"If the adaptation values are reached, this indicates a fault in a hydraulic shift element."

"If the filling pressure adaptation values limit is in positive display range, there is damage in the automatic transmission."





Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk
ezzo likes this.

_______________________________________

"Concentrated power is not rendered harmless by the good intentions of those who create it."

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

2005 CLK320 - Wifes DD
2005 E320 CDI - Black on Black 450K+miles - MY current DD
2006 E320 CDI - Dads DD
2007 E320 Bluetec - Sisters DD
2008 ML320 CDI - Mothers DD
__________________________________
Gone:
83 300SD
86 190D 2.5
91 300D
95 C280
97 C280
99 E300D
Rossafuss is offline  
post #10 of 21 (permalink) Old 06-09-2018, 02:43 PM
ot1
BenzWorld Veteran
 
Date registered: Apr 2007
Vehicle: 2006 E320 CDI
Location: Midwest USA
Posts: 600
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Quoted: 143 Post(s)
It really depends on the color of your fluid and the smell on whether or not a full flush is warranted because dropping the pan only gets half of the fluid, and the fluid left(4qts) contains oxidized fluid and if its broken down (not providing lubrication) then you are essentially wearing out your tranny faster. It would be better if you did a full flush every 4th oil change or 5th if the color and smell are good. Putting in new fluid into old which is a 50% dilution is harmful. Old fluid affects the rubber seals too. You see the problem you are creating by only half filling the tranny with fresh is that you won’t be able to judge the remaining life by color and smell. You are not rejuvenating the old fluid in the change. Those molecules are just getting older and older, broken down and worthless, contaminating the new fluid and and shortening the life of your tranny. Ravenol M6 series 236.10 was $14 per qt shipped in October 2017 and you don’t need a funnel, each bottle has a tube spout that pulls out fits right into the tranny dip tube, No spilling or dripping!!!

Last edited by ot1; 06-09-2018 at 08:49 PM.
ot1 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

  Mercedes-Benz Forum > Mercedes-Benz Sedan Forums > W211 E-Class

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Mercedes-Benz Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in











Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 

Title goes here

close
video goes here
description goes here. Read Full Story
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome