97' E420 Immobilizer Issue (Red & Green Lights) - Mercedes-Benz Forum
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post #1 of 216 (permalink) Old 04-17-2019, 06:18 PM Thread Starter
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Exclamation 97' E420 Immobilizer Issue (Red & Green Lights)

Hello everyone! TL;DR near the bottom.
New member here, Id like to start by thanking everyone who post on the forums. I've read alot of helpful information you have my thanks.

Now onto my problem. About a year and a half ago I managed to get my hands on a 97' E420 (w210) with 130k miles at an auction for $1100. It started right up and was driven home. During the time ive had it I taught myself to do automotive body work and painting in order to to repair / repaint some problem areas. A year later Ive repainted the whole front bumper, rear bumper, hood, as well as some other areas with defects (scratches, dents, rust, etc). Ive since completed the paint work and am going through the steps to get it back on the road.
Unfortunately I have been unable to start it for about a week or so . This kills me inside, I really love this car (that ive never driven on the road) and would love nothing more then to give it new life. Im pretty sure the issue is with the DAS/Immobilizer system as I have the (dreaded, feared, satanic) red and green alternating lights in the rear view mirror.
Again they alternate (tik, tok, tik, tok, red, green, red, green) And it does seem to only last 30 seconds but just comes back when I try to start the car. The engine cranks but will not start, like the engine is not getting fuel or spark. This is probably the 3rd or 4th time ive had the issue where the engine refuses to start since ive had the vehicle but usually the issue just went away on its own after like 30 minutes, but as I mentioned this time ive been unable to start it for over a week.
Since then ive been doing quite a bit of research into the immobilizer and DAS systems but ive decided to make an actual post for my issue to better track my problem as I make progress on it. Im currently thinking the issue could be because the vehicles battery is pretty much dead (it seems to hold a charge for a few days if I run the vehicle a bit but I havent been able to) so ive been connecting a large Duracell car jumper pack to it to roll down the windows when the weathers nice and to diagnose the issues im having. Also since I got the car from an auction I dont have the remote key only 2 blade keys (see pic).

TL;DR
So im pretty sure my issue is the immobilizer/DAS, now I just need to find the solution.

Could my issue be that when I connect the near-dead battery (just before connecting the battery pack) the electrical system has too little power when being connected?

Or maybe I just need to order a remote key?

A massive thank you to anyone who took time out of their day/night to give this a read. Any suggestions are very welcome and appreciated!
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post #2 of 216 (permalink) Old 04-17-2019, 06:32 PM
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Welcome Will_R,

Have you attempted to resync your keys yet?

Please read thru this check list.
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post #3 of 216 (permalink) Old 04-17-2019, 06:39 PM Thread Starter
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Thank you khomer2, great to be hear.

Ive seen/read of people resyncing their key fobs. But to my understanding this doesn't work with just the blade keys that I have. Thats one of the reasons I thought I might need to order a fob but ive started this car probably 20 times without ever having a fob.

I could be wrong, and in this case id like to be.

Thanks for the reply. I instantly feel less alone in dealing with this lol.
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post #4 of 216 (permalink) Old 04-17-2019, 06:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Will_R View Post
Thank you khomer2, great to be hear.

Ive seen/read of people resyncing their key fobs. But to my understanding this doesn't work with just the blade keys that I have. Thats one of the reasons I thought I might need to order a fob but ive started this car probably 20 times without ever having a fob.

I could be wrong, and in this case id like to be.

Thanks for the reply. I instantly feel less alone in dealing with this lol.
I think you do realize that these blade keys are chipped, both the valet and fob, correct?
If you do have to resort to obtaining a new replacement key / fob, you will need to take with you to the stealership, ID, registration, proof of ownership, live warm body (Im sure you are aware of all this stuff....).

Another suggestion if you havent yet searched thru the threads on this topic.
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post #5 of 216 (permalink) Old 04-17-2019, 06:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Will_R View Post
Thank you khomer2, great to be hear.

Ive seen/read of people resyncing their key fobs. But to my understanding this doesn't work with just the blade keys that I have. Thats one of the reasons I thought I might need to order a fob but ive started this car probably 20 times without ever having a fob.

I could be wrong, and in this case id like to be.

Thanks for the reply. I instantly feel less alone in dealing with this lol.
The fob has nothing to do with the authorization. It is the chip inside the keys (or in the fob if you had one). So your car should be functional with the key, while the fob provides additional function of remote locking / unlocking.

How good are you with a multimeter ? You need to do some measurements at K40 module to ensure the modules like the ECU receives power in key position 2.
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post #6 of 216 (permalink) Old 04-17-2019, 07:16 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by khomer2 View Post
I think you do realize that these blade keys are chipped, both the valet and fob, correct?
If you do have to resort to obtaining a new replacement key / fob, you will need to take with you to the stealership, ID, registration, proof of ownership, live warm body (Im sure you are aware of all this stuff....).

Another suggestion if you havent yet searched thru the threads on this topic.
Jesus no anything but the stealership! (I will if I have to).

Yes im aware that the keys and fob are chipped but im unaware if the keys I have are chipped. Some of the research Ive done has actually lead me to believe mine might not be chipped (see pic).
Thanks for the link, while I have searched the forum before its never hurts to check again. Ive heard about the Crankshaft Pos Sensor being a potential problem, do you know of a way (hopefully not too hard) to test the sensor? Or would I have to replace it to see if that was it?

Thanks again.
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post #7 of 216 (permalink) Old 04-17-2019, 07:20 PM Thread Starter
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Maybe the key I have from the first pic thats not in the second pic has a chip?
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post #8 of 216 (permalink) Old 04-17-2019, 07:25 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrboca View Post
The fob has nothing to do with the authorization. It is the chip inside the keys (or in the fob if you had one). So your car should be functional with the key, while the fob provides additional function of remote locking / unlocking.

How good are you with a multimeter ? You need to do some measurements at K40 module to ensure the modules like the ECU receives power in key position 2.
Thanks for dropping in to help, I really appreciate it.

Im fairly adept with a multi-meter testing the K40 unit is the last thing ive tried. I confirmed that plugs 1 & 3 on the B connector gets battery voltage, fuses are good. Got a used K40 in pretty good condition that didnt fix the issue. Actually I noticed a buzz coming from the engine when I connected the new K40 that didnt happen from the old one, this was with the key out. What additional testing of the K40 would you recommend sir?

Thanks!
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post #9 of 216 (permalink) Old 04-17-2019, 07:42 PM
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?? SO in your post#1, are we correct to assume both blade keys you have do NOT start up and you get the red green alternating flashing?
And that both blade keys were functional before this incident?
They have to be chipped in order for you to start ignition.

Yes, the CPS could possibly be an issue, but you've already got red/green flashing issue right now - this is the system not syncing/recognizing your key with the chip.

I would also suggest you disconnect the battery for 30 min and let the system reset. It may help...
If you decide to do that, remember that you have to synch the system, seat, sunroof, windows etc.
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post #10 of 216 (permalink) Old 04-17-2019, 07:57 PM
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Let's clear something.

For 1996 and some other previous E320 models, the fob did not have the chip. The authorization is done via IR signaling from the remote to the IR module.

For 1997 the key and fob with the chip was introduced. The ignition has a black transponder coil housing to energize and pickup auth. codes.

Since your car starts with a key (as well as a fob you do not have), it has the chip.

K40 B3 is the fuel pump relay output. Have you confirmed that you have fuel at the fuel test port on the fuel rail ?

Check plugs E5 and E6 with key in position 2.

The CPS can be an issue if it is a hard failure (loss of signal from the sensor). If signal is marginal. the car will start only when the engine and the sensor are cold.

If you got a buzz with the key out the replacement K40 cannot be good, can it ?

Make sure you have a GOOD and fully charged battery. Do not rely on boosters to start the car.
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