2002 MB E320 - Another Tranny Issue - Page 5 - Mercedes-Benz Forum
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post #41 of 95 (permalink) Old 06-13-2017, 07:52 PM
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I guess when the filter is NOT attached to the valve body, and just resting on the pan itself, the fluid is sucked from the hole where the filter is supposed to be inserted. When the fluid is cold, it is already drained into the pan, and the fluid level is high. Then, with the engine running, the fluid is sucked from the pan, with the level getting dropped. At some point the fluid ends up being sucked mixed with air, which causes insufficient levels for the transmission to properly to operate.
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post #42 of 95 (permalink) Old 06-13-2017, 08:41 PM
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Last week when I changed the fluid and filter in my transmission, I didn't notice any "click" when I installed the new filter (Genuine MB).

Is it just held in place by the o-ring? I made sure the tab was in the valve body slot, but I wondered at that time if it could drop off from vibrations. Is the pan high enough to prevent this?

Wonder what the engineers were thinking considering how critical this part is.

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post #43 of 95 (permalink) Old 06-13-2017, 09:09 PM
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I believe this would be more of a problem for aftermarket filters with questionable quality and tolerances (o-ring, pipe). I think if the o-ring is damaged / missing / cut, air will get sucked too. Also a bad quality filter with substandard filtering material can be plugged over time, and cause whines and slips. If the TC out pressure is less than 10 psi, the filter is plugged, and needs to be replaced.
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post #44 of 95 (permalink) Old 06-14-2017, 04:07 AM Thread Starter
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As mrboca said , if the o-ring quality deteriorates , it will stop holding the filter in place I guess . I don't think the filter will fall all the way down since the bottom of the filter will be held by the pan. I don't think the pan is tall enough to let the filter totally get loose wondering at the bottom of the pan.

I tried pushing that old filter back in place into the hole and wont stay in place so surely air was going through around that o-ring. As the car warms up , looks like air is also being sucked up through that deteriorated o-ring since the level of oil goes down thus causing my problem.

I have not installed any of the new parts yet . Am still searching for all possible causes. On the error code 2502 , it says it can also be a solenoid . Since I already have all these new parts , I was wondering if I might as well install the new conductor plate and solenoids . I don't have error codes (P0730 / P0715) that show that the conductor plate is bad though. But valve body will be out so might as well.
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post #45 of 95 (permalink) Old 06-14-2017, 04:10 AM Thread Starter
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but again as mrboca said , if a solenoid is bad , it would trigger another code thus causing my hesitation for the need of dropping down the valve body and replacing solenoids and conductor plate just to make sure and since I already have them.
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post #46 of 95 (permalink) Old 06-14-2017, 06:02 AM
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You have to give the filter a good push and it will "pop" into place as the o-ring seats. Make sure to lube the o-ring well before you try. It should not come out by itself.


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post #47 of 95 (permalink) Old 06-14-2017, 06:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gerrb View Post
but again as mrboca said , if a solenoid is bad , it would trigger another code thus causing my hesitation for the need of dropping down the valve body and replacing solenoids and conductor plate just to make sure and since I already have them.
To clarify, if the modulating solenoid is not operating due to electrical issues (TCM / adapter contamination, defective valve coil, conductor plate connections, etc.), it would be detected and reported with a different code. However, if there is a mechanical issue with the travel range of the valve / restrictions, this is another issue, however if the solenoid is properly installed, it rarely fails this way, and it is not really a conductor plate (electrical) related issue.
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post #48 of 95 (permalink) Old 06-14-2017, 06:46 AM Thread Starter
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You have to give the filter a good push and it will "pop" into place as the o-ring seats. Make sure to lube the o-ring well before you try. It should not come out by itself.
I guess the filter I installed 15k miles prior had an inferior o-ring that after 15k miles , it deteriorated and became loose thus allowing air to get sucked around it and didn't anymore hold the filter in place. The moment I brought down that pan , the filter was with it and even if you push it back on the hole , it won't stay in place anymore . The o-ring definitely deteriorated because of heat.


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To clarify, if the modulating solenoid is not operating due to electrical issues (TCM / adapter contamination, defective valve coil, conductor plate connections, etc.), it would be detected and reported with a different code. However, if there is a mechanical issue with the travel range of the valve / restrictions, this is another issue, however if the solenoid is properly installed, it rarely fails this way, and it is not really a conductor plate (electrical) related issue.
So not having any other codes related with the solenoids or conductor plates , knowing that my filter wasn't fully secured by that o-ring after 15k of use thus air can be sucked through that area , 13 pin ring (trans) connector with oil but no oil wicking upwards the trans ECU ... do you think I can get away without dropping the valve body and just replace gasket, filter, oil and the 13 pin connector ?

Just trying to wrap my mind around the ideas .. "hey you have the parts , the lower part of trans is open..,.. you might as well drop valve body and replace conductor plate and solenoids" AND "if it isn't broke , then don't touch it".

That is what is going on in my mind and debating on right now .
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post #49 of 95 (permalink) Old 06-14-2017, 07:09 AM
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Decisions, decisions..... You have a "confirmed" case of a loose filter, and this is the main problem. Now, has this caused other possible side-effects (unfiltered fluid sucked in causing other issues), who knows. But it would not likely to be a conductor plate issue.

If the dropped filter is not the only issue, what have you got to lose, but some time. You can drain the fluid you changed and re-use it. You can use the same pan gasket, as it is "new". If you drop the valve body, you need to be extremely careful not to introduce dirt, lint, etc. when replacing the conductor plate, solenoids.. You may introduce problems that you did not have.
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post #50 of 95 (permalink) Old 06-14-2017, 06:01 PM Thread Starter
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Decisions, decisions..... You have a "confirmed" case of a loose filter, and this is the main problem. Now, has this caused other possible side-effects (unfiltered fluid sucked in causing other issues), who knows. But it would not likely to be a conductor plate issue.

If the dropped filter is not the only issue, what have you got to lose, but some time. You can drain the fluid you changed and re-use it. You can use the same pan gasket, as it is "new". If you drop the valve body, you need to be extremely careful not to introduce dirt, lint, etc. when replacing the conductor plate, solenoids.. You may introduce problems that you did not have.
Thank you ! I totally agree with this line of thinking. I will go this route. Pretty sure that unsecured filter on the hole that was just sitting on the trans oil pan was introducing air thus causing my problem. No other codes that point to my conductor plate and solenoids were present so your suggestion is definitely the best route . All I have to loose is time if ever. For now I will keep the conductor plate and solenoids as spare. And seeing Martin (MAVA) , who is one of the resident trans gurus here and had always been very helpful, liking your post definitely gives me more confidence that it is the right course of action for now.

I have decided though to wait for the original MB Trans Filter , gasket and 13 PIN connector I just ordered today. What I have that came with the conductor plate seems to be the same one I installed 15k miles ago and are aftermarket.
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