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post #11 of 55 (permalink) Old 08-27-2018, 07:05 AM
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Jake,

Take it from someone who has actually done this type of project, it is not easy, nor cheap.

I went the "Rebuild the M117" route and added almost 100 horsepower. I have personally talked to Satish several times about the conversion project and, if I had to do over I would go the M119 route. His car and that article was my influence for rebuilding my SEC in his image.

Yes, the M120 has more power and you may want to go that way in the end, but the V-12's are notoriously finicky. They are basically two 6's on the same crank. You will have two of everything. I would try to find an AMG M119 V-8. That way it's already been tuned, and ready to go in.

Here's basically what is involved:

You need to first find a suitable donor engine out of a car that's been hit from behind and totaled out. You have to make sure you have it's harness and all module boxes too that went with that motor.

Then you need to take out your old motor and trans, exhaust and all of the harnesses in the engine bay. Completely strip out the M117 harnesses. Then you need to open the fuse box and tie the new harness in and you need to run the new harness into the pass bay and fit those models as well.

You will need to remove the secondary firewall and will need to make a new one to fit the engine. You will probably need to move/relocate the battery tray.
There is some metalwork you will need to fab up to make it fit.
You will need to make/have made new downpipes and exhaust interface.

You should read my "A Trek Up North" thread about how I did my motor rebuild and what was involved with that. I had the money on hand to do it and it still took me 2 1/2 YEARS to finish. I fixed everything else in my car at the same time because I had so much downtime waiting on engine stuff!

I have pictures of my car at every step of the way with my engine bay completely stripped of everything in it and the dash removed and the Air Con box removed. I had total access to the entire firewall area and yes, I could have done a type swap to a 119 or 120. But I think you will need to strip it down to that level to do it properly. And as Richter Rox said, and I agree with 100% "Good things aren't cheap and cheap things aren't good." is 1000% true in this instance.

Feel free to call me or PM me your number and I will call you and we can go over it in detail. I believe I am one of the few here that has actually done this and is still on the board. David (@Bondavi) and Jon White (@jonwhite99) are two that have done it. I think maybe Roy has too. (@AzimuthAviation)

But the bright side is that IF you DO do this kind of mod, no mom in a minivan will catch you despite what others who have never done this think...
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post #12 of 55 (permalink) Old 08-27-2018, 08:04 AM
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Rather than swapping engines, I am a fan of power adders, the old M117 takes well to forced induction and I think a single medium turbo or two smaller GT28s would be awesome.
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post #13 of 55 (permalink) Old 08-27-2018, 08:35 AM
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. . . But the bright side is that IF you DO do this kind of mod, no mom in a minivan will catch you despite what others who have never done this think...
It will take a whole lot more than an M119 to get that boat below a 14.3 quarter mile, the out of the box number for a Honda Accord EX.
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post #14 of 55 (permalink) Old 08-27-2018, 09:05 AM
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I am old enough to remember when a sub 14 second 1/4 mile was fast now it is slightly quick and gets you zero respect, getting into the 12's and street legal was an amazing accomplishment today it is commonplace and can be done with the ac on.

gotta love the golden age of horsepower .
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post #15 of 55 (permalink) Old 08-27-2018, 09:11 AM
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THE M119 is probably the best to use as Amg put them into some w126 ,/
Not exactly - what AMG did was take a M117 block and retrofit 119 heads on it, it retained the M117 timing cover, distributor setup, etc. That engine was called the M117/9. Very rare, and moreso found in AMG of Japan cars. Note the front distributor and older airbox pictured.

That engine has yet to be documented on how AMG did the mating of 119 heads to the 117 block, 119 heads absolutely are not a direct fit when Jono did a comparison years ago.





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post #16 of 55 (permalink) Old 08-27-2018, 10:09 AM
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Don’t let anyone sway you into thinking that the m120 v12 is finicky. In my opinion it is one of the most impressive engines MB has put out both visually and reliability wise.
I know, I daily drive two v12’s for the past two years.
Having said this, you need to consider if gas mileage will be a concern or not. My ‘95 is a first gen, with the 4 speed trans and older engine management. This setup would be the more straight forward swap, and donor cars are more readily available than with the second gen cars. Keep in mind you will need to source all the harnesses and computers to make it a successful swap. You are looking at 12-14 mpg realistically.
The second gen engine mgmt and 5speed trans sets the two light years apart, with a gas mileage of 16-16.5 every time.
Neither car leaks oil, I do maintenance like on any other older car I own.
Either way you choose, the power and torque of a v12 is plain addictive.
Good luck!
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post #17 of 55 (permalink) Old 08-27-2018, 10:25 AM
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Why so expensive?


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How MUCh did you think it would be ? $2500?
Just a basics ls swap into an old muscle car is $6000-8000 and thatís with virtually no electronics and no fabrication . Mating a computer controlled Mercedes engine into an old Mercedes is magnitudes more expensive and the few shops that actually do this have rich clientele and arenít cheap .

Just rebuilding a m117 engine at a good shop will cost $5000+ , not even considering a swap.

Renntech will do the m119 swap for about $25000 and Mekatronik will do a m120 or m113k swap but it will be even more expensive and youíll need to ship the car to Europe .

Have you noticed there isnít a list of shops that do this conversion ? Thatís because there are so few and itís so costly virtually no one besides the very rich or the do it yourself Guys do it
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post #18 of 55 (permalink) Old 08-27-2018, 12:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Richter Rox View Post
I am old enough to remember when a sub 14 second 1/4 mile was fast now it is slightly quick and gets you zero respect, getting into the 12's and street legal was an amazing accomplishment today it is commonplace and can be done with the ac on.

gotta love the golden age of horsepower .
You got that right!

As far as stock vehicles, the very low 14's were the territory of 426 Mopar products. A 67 400CI GTO was a mid 14 second car. My 68 427 Vette was a 14.1 second car.

So don't expect that lead sled to get away from a Honda EX unless the OP has a lot of cash to spend beyond an engine swap.
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post #19 of 55 (permalink) Old 08-27-2018, 02:53 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by wilson1010 View Post
It will take a whole lot more than an M119 to get that boat below a 14.3 quarter mile, the out of the box number for a Honda Accord EX.
Point taken. I'm not trying to turn my SEC into a Ferrari, just want to make my car a bit more fun to drive.
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post #20 of 55 (permalink) Old 08-27-2018, 03:08 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by tusabes View Post
How MUCh did you think it would be ? $2500?
Just a basics ls swap into an old muscle car is $6000-8000 and thatís with virtually no electronics and no fabrication . Mating a computer controlled Mercedes engine into an old Mercedes is magnitudes more expensive and the few shops that actually do this have rich clientele and arenít cheap .

Just rebuilding a m117 engine at a good shop will cost $5000+ , not even considering a swap.

Renntech will do the m119 swap for about $25000 and Mekatronik will do a m120 or m113k swap but it will be even more expensive and youíll need to ship the car to Europe .

Have you noticed there isnít a list of shops that do this conversion ? Thatís because there are so few and itís so costly virtually no one besides the very rich or the do it yourself Guys do it
Not $2500, but I didn't think it would be $20,000.
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