What to do next??? - Page 2 - Mercedes-Benz Forum
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post #11 of 20 (permalink) Old 09-02-2018, 09:05 PM
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The primer pump should not leak diesel under any circumstance. If it does, it has to be replaced because it draws air into the system and that can affect performance and make the engine run rough. When they are shot, you can't even prime the system.

The good news is that the primer pump can be easily replaced for little money.
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post #12 of 20 (permalink) Old 09-03-2018, 08:55 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by luisg92 View Post
The primer pump should not leak diesel under any circumstance. If it does, it has to be replaced because it draws air into the system and that can affect performance and make the engine run rough. When they are shot, you can't even prime the system.

The good news is that the primer pump can be easily replaced for little money.
It leaked\sprayed fuel when it reached prime, and it didnít take long to prime. Doesnít leak fuel otherwise when it is twisted to the locked setting. I canít say yes or no as to if it is letting air into the system. So...

Iím looking on eBay and find Bosch part # 0440017997 Fuel pre-pump for sale from seller partscontainer. His chart says that it doesnít fit my 84 300d. And only goes up to 81 for the non turbo 300d... Is this the correct part? Or does someone have the correct part #? Or should I just buy the plunger???


Thank you.
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post #13 of 20 (permalink) Old 09-03-2018, 03:11 PM
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0440017997 This is for the lift pump and primer pump.

If the primer pump or plunger is leaking, you need part 2447010038. It’s an updated design that doesn’t require unscrewing, you just push the plunger and you should be able to get a new one for less than $20.

If you want to know whether air is getting inside the system, you can replace the plastic fuel hard lines between the fuel filter housing and injection pump (they get brown with age and don’t allow to see the flow of diesel) to see if there are air bubbles, however they are pricey.

Some suggest that you can replace just the plastic line with another plastic line for temporary use, just to see if there is air inside the system and then replace it with regular rubber fuel hose and clamps. I haven't tried this but if my problems persist, i might give a shot.

I would replace primer pump (or as you call it plunger) because, based on your description, you have the older type that is known for drawing air and leak fuel.
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post #14 of 20 (permalink) Old 09-03-2018, 05:47 PM Thread Starter
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Yes, I have the old style. And as I think on it for a minute, the cars symptoms have increased each time I use the primer... when I changed the filter the first time, when I removed the injector lines while doing the glow plugs, next when I put in new injectors two weeks ago...so, I will cross my fingers, and replace all of those. I think I will replace both the lift pump and the primer pump. Then Iíll look at replacing all of the hoses if that doesnít work. The part # that I put up earlier was for a non turbo motor and off one digit. It should be 0440017998 For the 84 300d with a turbo.

Thanks for you help and insight.

Iíll post my results after I work on it next weekend.
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post #15 of 20 (permalink) Old 09-08-2018, 05:26 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by luisg92 View Post
No electric pump there. Diesel is draw by the lift pump attached to the IP and is all-mechanical. I rebuilt mine hoping that it had something to do with the idle shake, but I didnít do any difference.

When the lift pump goes wrong, engine oil starts to get diluted with diesel or the engine just quits because the pump is unable to feed the IP.
I just finished with the new parts(primer pump, new hose from lift pump to secondary fuel filter, short hose from primary filter to lift pump........

No change...

If the car is emitting some smoke when it runs rough, and not when it is running good...( tested in park or neutral, at different rpmís). Higher rpms= less smoke. Idle=lots of smoke.

Am I ordering a new lift pump???? If it lets engine oil get into the fuel when it is bad, and as it gets worse, it wonít run at all?

Or...is it a turbo problem? If it idles and runs rough at lower rpm, and runs a little better with some higher rpm... but not under load?

Just thinking out loud again, thanks for your comments/ suggestions.

I donít know whatís more expensive right now, the parts for the car or the fuel cost of driving one of my wifeís 1ton trucks?
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post #16 of 20 (permalink) Old 09-09-2018, 02:19 PM
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No change...
Well, that sucks.

There are lots of things you can do, you decide what to do, but this is my opinion.

I don’t think the lift pump is the problem, in fact don’t order a new lift pump until you measure fuel pressure (you can find instructions on how to do that on many forums and on the free version of the factory service manual). The lift pump is kind of expensive and shouldn’t be replaced just to see if it makes any difference. You have to be sure is bad.

Smoke could mean a lot of things: unburned fuel due to excessive quantity or poor quality, wrong timing, poor spray pattern, coolant or oil being burned, bad turbo, poorly adjusted ALDA, etc. Just lots of reasons for smoke to show up.

Neither do I think your problem is the turbo. Usually a failing/bad turbo causes other problems like power loss, excessive oil consumption, lots of grey thick smoke and drilling noises. Lumpy idle is not one of the symptoms as far as I know (unless the turbo failed spectacularly and sent pieces to the engine and those pieces destroyed the cylinder walls and piston rings, but your engine would be burning lots of oil and making agonic noises).

I don’t know if you have done a diesel purge, but is one of the first thing you should do (specially considering that is cheap, easy and quick) and very recommended when you have performance and smoke issues on a diesel. Over time dirt builds up inside lines, IP, injectors and the diesel purge cleans that restoring performance. If your injectors or pump are worn diesel purge won’t improve things, though.

Next, you have to adjust the valves and inspect the condition of the timing chain. Tight valves produce uneven compression, which in a diesel is a big problem. A loose chain can change IP timing. Adjusting the valves is “easy” (once you acquire practice) and the tools needed are cheap. IP timing can and should be adjusted every certain millage to compensate for wear.

After the valve adjustment and chain inspection, do a compression test. If compression is uneven, for example 380PSI on one cylinder and then other is 300PSI, that engine is worn and is never going to idle smooth again until you rebuild it.

In fact, a valve adjustment and compression test are the first thing you have to do before spending any money on one of these engines. If compression is even, then your problem is most likely an injection problem.

Just for your information, replacing the rack damper bolt on my car made a lot of difference, not perfect, but much better. Still needs further adjustment since I adjusted it very conservatively. You can try that as well, specially if you have the silver version. For 36 dollars and half hour of your time, you don’t have much to lose.

I know this is frustrating, especially if you are trying to keep the diagnosis and repair cost low by doing it your self, but I think there are a few things left on the list that you can do for not that much money before throwing the towel or paying and injection shop to fix it.
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post #17 of 20 (permalink) Old 09-09-2018, 08:11 PM Thread Starter
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Well, that sucks.

There are lots of things you can do, you decide what to do, but this is my opinion.
Thank you for your time and your opinion. Iím here on the forum asking for opinions, and I certainly appreciate yours and the others who have commented.

I read through and evaluate all of the comments and suggestions, and try to figure out what correlates most closely with my observations.

So...
The car may need a valve adjustment, and when the local mechanic that is next to my business has some time itís going to be done, but that may be a few weeks out though.

Iím going to order a lift pump.
Iím going to look up how to adjust the IP timing, and the Alda and try to get to those in the next two weeks.
For the turbo, I was just thinking out loud. If the bearings in the turbo are getting old, they may have increased friction, and only spin/ create boost at higher exhaust volumes which would explain why it feels good and sounds good at slightly higher rpms as long as there is no big load.
Also thinking out loud...if it were a compression/valve/ cylinder, wouldnít it run rough at all rpms, instead of smoothing out at slightly higher rpms?
Yes, I have drained the tank, new good fuel, and the car has brand new injectors. I was in accord with all of those ideas at the very beginning. It makes sense.
Iím not giving up on the car. And itís more of a time issue versus money , but I certainly appreciate your consideration for the financial aspect of repairs.

Thank you again. I look forward to everyoneís opinion/ suggestion, even forcedinductionís.
Thatís why Iím here on the forum.
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post #18 of 20 (permalink) Old 10-09-2018, 07:22 AM Thread Starter
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[email protected]#*&#@!!!! All is well now, purrs like a kitten, and pulls up the hills like it was new. Maybe if I would have listened earlier....

Thanks for all of the info, advice, and recommendations from everyone!!!


Quote:
Originally Posted by PlaneCrazy View Post
Maybe your engine needs a valve adjustment to restore compression to all cylinders? Maybe you need to adjust the injection timing?
PlaneCrazy and rawbeginner like this.
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post #19 of 20 (permalink) Old 10-10-2018, 07:48 PM
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I am glad to see you solved your problem.
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post #20 of 20 (permalink) Old 10-12-2018, 06:37 PM
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Yeah, it is always the simple thing we keep putting off, insisting that it must be something much more complex.

When you hear hoof beats, think horse, not Zebra.

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