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  Topic Review (Newest First)
01-15-2019 09:54 AM
cowboyt
Quote:
Originally Posted by Huachipato View Post
That is some good info on the HIDs. When I said I changed all the bulbs on the Cobra, I really mean there are no regular bulbs left on the car...

Changing the scope to headlights low beam only - HID is king as far as brightness and ease of install. The light output is by far the main benefit, but when comparing to LED you can't really ignore the fact you don't have to do any bulb heat management either. It will be a while - but at some point I do want to retrofit my headlights with some new projectors and do the conversion to HID at that time as well.

It could be argued too - that is you retrofit a projector that is designed to handle the LED light beam - it should work as well assuming you can find some real 35W LEDs bulbs that will fit... To the point of everyone prior, I'm unaware of any such projector/LEDs for the W220.
Turns out you do need to do some heat management, because there is heat at the bottom end of the LED. They do run way cooler than incandescents, but they do still generate some heat, and LED's, being silicon-based semiconductors, are susceptible to thermal runaway (FET's are not, but both diodes and bipolar transistors are). That's why they have those heatsinks, and sometimes fans, on 'em.

You are certainly correct in that an LED in a projector or traditional reflector that's designed for that type of "bulb" will be very bright, indeed. We see this already on the newer USA Acuras (Hondas everywhere else in the world); their headlights are actually LED strips which are every bit the equal of HID's in output. Them things are BRIGHT. Currently there is work to do projector LED's, and when those do get perfected, they're going to be a fine choice. I'm looking forward to it! See, eventually, our HID projectors will burn out, like what happened with my S600, necessitating replacement. Should take about 10-15 years, depending on use. By then, really good projector LED's should be available at a reasonable price, sort of like what's happened with household LED light bulbs.

Your Cobra, by the way, is like my '90's-era Honda Civic. There is no computer to play nanny regarding the current usage, so the retrofit was conceptually easier. The only "complication" was that Civics use an H4/9003 bulb, which means a single dual-filament bulb in the housing. Hit the high beams, and the power to the "low beam" circuit goes off. Not so good when you're dealing with bi-xenon projectors, as you want that HID bulb to stay on continuously when you hit the high-beams; all you want to do is lower or raise the high-beam solenoid, as appropriate. Calls for a diode in the circuit, basically, and that solved the problem.
01-15-2019 08:21 AM
Dave2302 Hi,

LED's that I've seen in the interiors of MB's do work yes, and they don't put up a fault indication on Dash, because they are not monitored / reported to Dash.

BUT, they do put Fault Codes up in the various Modules that are controlling them, and I'm far too anal for that

I like an SDS "Quick Test" that shows all "Ticks"

None of that F or f malarky on my MB's ...................

Soooooo, when I die, no one can read one of my Cars and say "He had a load of F's and f's in that Car"
01-15-2019 06:44 AM
Huachipato That is some good info on the HIDs. When I said I changed all the bulbs on the Cobra, I really mean there are no regular bulbs left on the car...

Changing the scope to headlights low beam only - HID is king as far as brightness and ease of install. The light output is by far the main benefit, but when comparing to LED you can't really ignore the fact you don't have to do any bulb heat management either. It will be a while - but at some point I do want to retrofit my headlights with some new projectors and do the conversion to HID at that time as well.

It could be argued too - that is you retrofit a projector that is designed to handle the LED light beam - it should work as well assuming you can find some real 35W LEDs bulbs that will fit... To the point of everyone prior, I'm unaware of any such projector/LEDs for the W220.
01-15-2019 06:34 AM
cowboyt LED's seem to work on interior lights, without additional resistors. They also work well inside the trunk. Other places, not so much; this is due, as others have said, to the SAM's. M-B should've made the "low current" parameter a lot lower to account for efficient bulbs (e. g. LED's) in, say, turn signals, reverse lights, tail lights, and so on. Interestingly, license plate illuminators *are* monitored by the SAM. I replaced those with error-canceling LED assemblies, and smooth sailing since.

Back to the low-beams. With the LED's, you can get 35W models, and if you have the XENON=PRESENT setting, the 35W LED's will look very much like 35W HID's, as far as power consumption goes (I'm excluding the initial HID power spike here, of course). When I first tried LED's in the project 2000 S500, I did not get the errors. As time went on, I saw the errors and the low-beam flashing here and there. The project 2000 S500 does have XENON=PRESENT, as it came with reflector HID's from the factory. But then you get into light dispersion issues, as noted above.

Yeah, I'd stick with HID's for our cars.
01-15-2019 05:07 AM
Astro14 If you're looking for better light, go HID. The lights on my S600 are simply superb. They work.

Because the LED has to match the resistance of the bulb it replaces, there is no electrical savings (which was miniscule to begin with).

Most LED headlight bulbs that I've seen, or members have tried, don't have the right pattern and produce lower quality illumination of the road.

In some applications (interior lights), the LEDs make more light, and run cooler, though again, they have to have a resistor to keep the SAMs happy and aren't saving electricity.

I've got lots of LED flashlights and worklights in my garage. They're great. Particularly the natural color one I use when applying wood finishes. I'm not anti-LED, but they're not always an improvement in every application.
01-14-2019 06:12 PM
Barmaley Hi Terry,

After your post I started thinking about LED lights again. The deal is that if LED was not giving good light pattern it means that they were not designed right to replace H7 HID. I think I would need to do search on the bulb which may work for the car! I guaranty that it is possible to design LED bulb with will provide any type of pattern needed. Of course the next concern would be to find a properly designed driver which can emulate halogen bulb. It should be very easy since H-bulb is a simple resistive load.
01-14-2019 05:47 PM
cowboyt
Quote:
Originally Posted by Huachipato View Post
I sometimes wish this car was "dumb" like my Cobra. Unfortunately - the W220 is too smart in some ways.

I've done this to the Cobra - and I've seen how the electrical system is less stressed and everything is brighter now that every single bulb is either HID or LED. I've thought about different ways to do this on the W220 though - and I don't think it is worth it. Everything you do will be with the addition of a resistor to offset any electrical benefits you may have gained. Just doesn't seem worth it.
No, you don't need a resistor on a W220. What you do is code the car for "XENON=PRESENT", and your HID's will work beautifully. Interestingly, the W220 also seems to work fine with halogen assemblies if the car is programmed for XENON=PRESENT. Makes one wonder why MB would bother with two separate settings, doesn't it?

I *love* my HID conversions, and it is most definitely worth it.
01-14-2019 05:39 PM
cowboyt Been there, done that, with the LED attempt. This was in the project 2000 S500, which originally came with the reflector HID's. I had bought a set of AL Bosch OEM headlamp assemblies (again, the reflector type), which were actually for halogens. I tried H7 halogens in there just for fun. Worked, was OK, much like the *reflector* HID's (remember, pre-facelift). So, I tried a pair of H7 LED's in there. Those were a bit better than the halogens. But the *projector* HID's...they *TOTALLY ANNIHILATE* the LED's in W220's. Seriously, they do. I've done the head-to-head comparisons.

Will you "hurt" your car with an LED attempt? No. Will you get the results you want? Very, very doubtful. But give 'er a whirl.

Why do the projector HID's *totally annihilate* the LED's? Reason is what tusabes said. The beam pattern with the halogens in the new AL Bosch housings was properly focused, just not bright enough for me. The LED's were a bit brighter, and the beam pattern was wider, but the light didn't get thrown down the road quite as well, even compared to the halogens. The HID's are both bright and throw light waaay down the road.

Why do the halogens equal the *reflector* HID's? Personally, I doubt that the reflectors were all that good for the HID bulbs; experience has taught me that they really do need projectors. And with projectors, HID's really...well, shine.

Far as I'm concerned, projector HID's are *the* way to go in a W220. I will put your LED's up any evening against the project 2000 S500, the '03 S600, or the E320 CDI, all of which I've retrofitted with projector HID's. Since I'm not driving the '03 S430 as much, I can now do the Morimoto/Hella Gen 3 retrofit on that car as well (it's got un-modded DEPO assemblies now). Dad's car will get the same Morimoto/Hella Gen 3 treatment.
01-14-2019 01:14 PM
Barmaley
Quote:
Originally Posted by tusabes View Post
Led headlights do not project the correct beam pattern so while you get more light at less wattage it is a scattered beam that just blinds incoming drivers and does Not let you see better down the road !!

You need a properly focused beam pattern
I think it was the most convincing argument for me NOT to install LED headlights
01-14-2019 12:02 PM
tusabes Led headlights do not project the correct beam pattern so while you get more light at less wattage it is a scattered beam that just blinds incoming drivers and does Not let you see better down the road !!

You need a properly focused beam pattern
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