RED BULL SECURE AN ENGINE FOR 2016 ? - Mercedes-Benz Forum
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 5 (permalink) Old 11-06-2015, 09:59 PM Thread Starter
CH4S Artist
Outstanding Contributor
 
Teutone's Avatar
 
Date registered: Sep 2004
Vehicle: 1985 500SEC, 1991 190E 2.6.
Location: Los Angeles / Hannover Germany
Posts: 38,864
Mentioned: 19 Post(s)
Quoted: 1896 Post(s)
Lifetime Premium Member
(Thread Starter)
RED BULL SECURE AN ENGINE FOR 2016 ?

Memorable line:
Red Bull Racing have been accused of ‘jumping from an airplane and trying to buy a parachute on the way down.’

Exclusive: Red Bull secure an engine for 2016 | thejudge13

Probably the biggest F1 controversy for a number of years has finally ended. Having cancelled their engine contract for 2016 with Renault without a replacement partner, Red Bull Racing have been accused of ‘jumping from an airplane and trying to buy a parachute on the way down.’ This has led to the widely held view that Red Bull Racing could actually withdraw from Formula One at the end of this year.

The bitterness that has been expressed between Renault and RBR senior personnel has led most observers to believe that the relationship is terminal. And when the normally sanguine Adrian Newey states that, “Unfortunately, our relationship with Renault is pretty terminal — there’s been too much of a marriage breakdown, so we have no engine,” then the only conclusion to be drawn is – that’s that.

However, TJ13 can reveal Red Bull Racing will not be leaving Formula One in 2016. They have in fact tonight secured an engine to power the RB12 at what for many is the 11th hour and 59th minute. Then again, given TJ13’s exclusive reporting on the new engine facility constructed by Red Bull Racing in building 9 at their HQ, maybe this is not so big a surprise.

RBR will be running the Renault 12 token upgraded engine in Brazil, having passed on using it in both Austin and Mexico. This power unit upgrade has been the result of a joint effort between Renault and the Red Bull appointed consultant Mario Illien. TJ13 has learned that the reason Red Bull have refused to run this PU at the past two races is because no agreement on joint intellectual property had been finalised. The deal is now done.

Mario Illien, the former Ilmor engine guru, has been working in the new Milton Keynes building 9 for over a year and assisting Renault in solving fundamental design flaws in their F1 power unit. Much of this revolves around the engine block.

The result is that Renault have agreed to manufacture and supply Red Bull Racing for the near future, the co-designed 12 token upgraded ICE, whilst Red Bull will supply their own ERS components for the F1 power unit.

Further, it has been agreed between the parties that Red Bull will be able to develop the ICE further in their building 9 complex, without reference to Renault, and that intellectual property of the base unit as it stands now, is jointly owned. Disagreements between Renault and RBR over the intellectual property of the ‘co-developed’ PU has been the reason RBR have been desperately seeking a temporary engine partner for 2016. These matters appear to be now resolved.

The Red Bull Racing power unit for 2016 is expected to be branded as Infiniti, should they and Renault-Nissan agree on this. If not, the engine development costs going forward will be met by Red Bull and another partner will be credited.

TJ13 has been informed that Red Bull Racing are already confident they will start the 2016 season with a revised version of the current Renault 12 token upgraded ICE, with a power unit producing in excess of a 40 BHP advantage.

Renault will now complete the acquisition of Lotus to run a ‘works team’ in 2016, and so let battle royal commence between the French F1 engine manufacturer maestro’s of the past 30 years versus the new kids on the block – who by the way said they were never going to be an F1 engine manufacturer.

Then again, when you’ve pissed off everyone else, ‘needs must’ – is the only conclusion.

As an aside, it may well be that the Red Bull engine solution now kills off the Jean Todt and Bernie Ecclestone’s idea of an independent F1 engine supplier. RBR are sorted, ‘crisis over.’
Teutone is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 5 (permalink) Old 11-06-2015, 10:08 PM Thread Starter
CH4S Artist
Outstanding Contributor
 
Teutone's Avatar
 
Date registered: Sep 2004
Vehicle: 1985 500SEC, 1991 190E 2.6.
Location: Los Angeles / Hannover Germany
Posts: 38,864
Mentioned: 19 Post(s)
Quoted: 1896 Post(s)
Lifetime Premium Member
(Thread Starter)
Renault to confirm Lotus deal in Abu Dhabi as Mario Illien denies Red Bull rumours // F1 News // James Allen on F1 ? The official James Allen website on F1
Quote:
Meanwhile, Renault’s current engine partner, Red Bull, is still facing an uncertain future and famous engine specialist Mario Illien has denied speculation that he will help the four-times constructors’ champions assemble its own power unit using unbranded Renault components for next season.
Illien, who’s company Ilmor formerly worked with Mercedes in F1, told Auto Motor und Sport that he had no idea where the reports had come from.
He said: “I know nothing of a dispute. I also have no idea what upgrades Renault has incorporated in its modified engine. I cannot imagine that a large company like Renault [would] secretly install my development.”
Illien did work with Red Bull and Renault during the first half of 2015 to help develop the power unit the team has been running this season, but the Swiss engineer explained that he would be more interested in helping to produce the independent engine that has been proposed for 2017.
Teutone is offline  
post #3 of 5 (permalink) Old 11-07-2015, 04:28 PM Thread Starter
CH4S Artist
Outstanding Contributor
 
Teutone's Avatar
 
Date registered: Sep 2004
Vehicle: 1985 500SEC, 1991 190E 2.6.
Location: Los Angeles / Hannover Germany
Posts: 38,864
Mentioned: 19 Post(s)
Quoted: 1896 Post(s)
Lifetime Premium Member
(Thread Starter)
ILLIEN PLAYS DOWN RED BULL ENGINE SOLUTION RUMOURS

Illien plays down Red Bull engine solution rumours | GRAND PRIX 247

Engine guru Mario Illien has played down speculation he will play a central role to ensure that Red Bull ends its engine supply crisis and races into 2016 with a power unit.

With Mercedes, Ferrari and McLaren-Honda declining to help the embattled former champions, it is suggested a novel solution to Red Bull’s problem has been devised.

It will reportedly involve Red Bull basing its 2016 engine on the basic architecture of the so-called Renault ‘D-spec’ power unit that will make its debut in Brazil next weekend.

Giving some credence to the theory is the fact that it is believed the ‘D-spec’ will debut in one Red Bull car at Interlagos, while sister team Toro Rosso will not run the new specification at all.

That could be due to the fact that Toro Rosso is apparently poised to switch from Renault to 2015-specification Ferrari power for the 2016 season. It is believed Ferrari did not offer the same deal to Red Bull Racing.

So the rumour goes that Red Bull has a done a deal to run an ‘unbranded’ Renault V6 engine next year, completing the package with its own energy recovery systems and the input of Illien, chief of the Ilmor engine company.

It has been suggested the Renault ‘D-spec’ involves the technology developed by Illien, with an intellectual property dispute between Renault and Red Bull perhaps explaining the long delay in the debut of specification.

Indeed, it is believed the ‘D spec’ was taken to both Austin and Mexico, but not used. However, Renault and Red Bull have explained that the conditions – rain in Austin and altitude in Mexico – were simply not right.

And Auto Motor und Sport claims Toro Rosso is not using the ‘D-spec’ simply because it would require an expensive tweak to the car’s cooling package.

Illien, meanwhile, denied any knowledge of an IP dispute between Red Bull and Renault, “I know nothing about it and I also have no idea what upgrades Renault has put in its modified engine. I can’t image that a big company like Renault would secretly install my developments.”

What the well-known Swiss engineer will not rule out, however, is that Ilmor might be interested in the FIA’s new plans for a parallel ‘client engine’ in 2017.

Indeed, Ilmor is considered a front runner for the contract as it already supplies a Chevrolet-badged, twin-turbo V6 engine for the Indycar series, “I will look at what the tender says and decide what to do then.”
Teutone is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #4 of 5 (permalink) Old 11-07-2015, 07:34 PM
Purple Moderator
 
Date registered: Jul 2005
Vehicle: 99 ML430, 00 ML320, 05 E500 4matic Wagon
Location: WI
Posts: 21,597
Mentioned: 35 Post(s)
Quoted: 1527 Post(s)
Lifetime Premium Member
Ilmor does know engines. Especially turbos of the modern era. I wonder what Ilmor will do about the electric power system?

Do you know if Ilmore has any experience with hybrid stuff? I have not really kept up on Ilmor's recent things other than the Chevy stuff they have done.

I also seem to remember that they helped out with the old NA engines that Mclaren used that were branded as Mercedes engines many years ago. That was even before the KERS systems were on the cars.
Noodles is offline  
post #5 of 5 (permalink) Old 11-08-2015, 12:56 AM Thread Starter
CH4S Artist
Outstanding Contributor
 
Teutone's Avatar
 
Date registered: Sep 2004
Vehicle: 1985 500SEC, 1991 190E 2.6.
Location: Los Angeles / Hannover Germany
Posts: 38,864
Mentioned: 19 Post(s)
Quoted: 1896 Post(s)
Lifetime Premium Member
(Thread Starter)
I have no idea.
Cosworth, Mercedes, Chevrolet, Honda, is one heck of a resume
Teutone is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

  Mercedes-Benz Forum > General Mercedes-Benz Forums > Mercedes-Benz Motorsports & Racing

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Mercedes-Benz Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in











Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 

Title goes here

close
video goes here
description goes here. Read Full Story
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome