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Hold or Fold on a W212 Bluetec

12K views 25 replies 10 participants last post by  DBV 
#1 ·
I own a 2011 E350 Sport Bluetec; ot was a Tier 5 car purchased certified with a 3yr warranty. It's a impeccable car with 38K miles. I'm reaching a decision point. The warranty expires in Jan. 2015. The car will soon need tires and the fuel filter replacement. I absolutely love the car. My wife drives it and I know she's safe in it. It's gets stunning gas mileage, is gorgeous to look at, and does just about everything right.

So the question... take the plunge and hold onto the car or dump it from another one? A lot depends on the long-term reliability of these machines. Several mechanics have warned me to unload the car now while it's still under warranty. My brain is skewed by having owned a 300D that I drove so many miles I can't even remember... what a tank. I've always owned Mercedes, but returned to the diesel side with the W212 line. However, it's a far more complex machine with more sensors than stealth fighter. I loathe Mercedes dealerships and like to maintain things myself, but this beast looks to be quite a challenge for the long haul.

I've always come to this forum for advice... I could use some in this case.

Hold or fold?
 
#2 ·
My opinion...

I just bought an '11 E350 BT myself, and plan to buy an extended warranty when the factory runs out (2016 / 100K).

There are not too many long term issues that I have found surfing this forum. The engine is rock solid; the tranny can be an issue for some; the electronics 'could' be a long term cost although must suffer from infant morality followed by old age with a few in the middle. Those are the big ticket items.

Fuel filter and tires are maintenance costs and part of operating any vehicle. If you are decent with a wrench you can do many of these items yourself and save major costs. If not, an independent shop can do it for half the dealership cost. Anyone can bolt on new tires.

If you love it, keep it!
 
#4 ·
I would not call the OM642 diesel engine rock solid. If you look in W211 and W164 forums you will find posts related to a lot of issues with the OM642 engine, above a certain mileage. Carbon build up, leaking seals and oil cooler ($$$) problems are unfortunately more common than not. I encountered them with my diesel truck.

I'd say use your best judgement. An extended warranty will be nice to have if you decide to keep the car.
 
#5 ·
I very much appreciate the feedback. You folks have really framed the dilemma very well. This is a super machine. Other than a minor heater replacement under the urea tank, it has a spotless record since new. Standard maintenance items don't bother me at all... not even replacing the fuel filter (I'd like to meet the engineer who decided to bury it like that). But what really nags at me are the issues MAE320 spoke about, I've heard exactly the same problems with the 642 diesel over the long haul. When you look at the book value of the car it really plummets as you approach high mileage points; far faster that many other models. That math happens for a reason.

If I thought about it more I'm sure I could sort what's going on inside the business offices of MB, but right now I'm just scratching my head. Exhorbitant maintenance costs, a dizzying array of engines, and service departments that will only diagnose problems spit out by the computer... it seems as though MB doesn't care much for brand loyalty any more.

Based on the numbers and the feedback we've decided to fold on this car. My best judgment is it isn't a machine to hold on to. It's also unfortunate that we can't seem to like the new versions of the car either. There has always been a Benz in my garage and my brand loyalty was tied to stunning performance and reliability from the machines I've owned. But I'm reluctantly coming to the decision that MB has made business decisions that no longer match what I want in a car.

Thanks again all for the input!
 
#6 ·
Only 38k miles and you're giving up on it? I agree that MB has lost its way. I just read an article about Camry and Accord buyers moving over to the new MB CLA. The CLA is such a disaster! As for the BlueTec, the OM642 is not a new engine, so troubleshooting problems will be well-documented and you know what to expect at certain mileage and you'll know what the symptoms and preventative tasks are. However, the BlueTec is not as DIY friendly as a TDI or an older MB. The new E-class has ditched the 6-cylinder in favor of a 4-cylinder, so besides the 535d or the A6 TDI, nothing will have that wave of torque that you're used to now. Keep in mind that you are folding on a car that has given you zero problems, and you are merely speculating that it will have issues. Get a CPO with a 100k warranty if you're that concerned about coverage. In my opinion, you don't drive enough to worry or need an extended warranty. If you love the car, you should hold it until you find something else that you'll love more. For me, the force is very strong with the Audi A6 TDI.
 
#8 ·
Unless there's a compelling reason, I'd say stick with what you got.

Though I must disagree with in2dwww on the CLA; it seems to actually be a pretty decent car, especially when compared to the Camry and Accord. I've not had a chance to drive one yet, but I've heard that MB really did a good job on the FWD aspect.
 
#9 ·
Off point:

I think the Volvo S60 is a better FWD car for the money. At this point, the CLA is just clamoring for buyers to the badge. Pretty soon, that will wear out. Remember when the 2007 C-class hit? The power seat switches on the seats rather than the door, the omission of the rear headrest drop button, and the basketball texture dash - nothing Mercedes about that at all, it was more like a Honda for $40k.

The Volvo S60 looks better, is far more comfortable, and has no badge appeal. The CLA is out there on a wing and a prayer that someone will actually buy a FWD MB.

The only FWD you'd catch me in is a VW, and the CLA is smaller than the CC.

Still, the only new MB I'd buy right now is the GLK350. I had one for a loaner and it was chunky and fun. I'd do crazy things to own a GLK55/63 AMG if they ever make one.
 
#11 ·
in2dwww - when you run the numbers on the car it's a borderline case in terms of whether to hold it. At 40K the fuel filter gets pulled and it needs new rubber (it's a sport model with run flats). So I'll soon be dropping 3-4 grand on the car. The resale value starts to turn south pretty fast after 50K miles, faster that many asian models. I wish Mercedes paid more attention to people like me who are loyal to the brand and like to find a good car and keep it. Your point about this engine not being DIY friendly is certainly on point, and that was not something I considered properly when buying it. It's a point that really pisses me off. If it rolls, flies or floats I can fix it; but MB is certainly not making it easy on this model. I have a sense that the ivory tower folks have succumbed to the notion that it's better to have people flip a car every few years (which makes you wonder where the old ones go....!) so "maintenance friendly" isn't much of a consideration. The numbers on this model certainly seem to indicate that it's not financially wise to hold it.

It terms of buying another Benz... I just can't find anything I'd want. The 2014 E BT is out of the question. What in the hell are they thinking? My current car gets 41 mpg all day long on highway trips; why would I want a less capable engine to get a small increase in fuel economy? So here too I agree with you - MB has lost its way.

I did drive the CLA. It seems like someone's idea of a bad joke. It had an annoying (scary would be a better term) vibration whenever the engine kicked in. In terms of the interior it felt more like a Kia than a Benz. Just a complete turn-off.
 
#12 ·
The numbers will never work out - at some point, anything will cross the threshold. On one hand, if you trade in your E350 BT for a CPO E350 BT, you'll be covered to 100k miles. On the other hand, if you went the CPO route, you'd just be kicking the can down the road since it's the same, non-DIY car - you'll be in the same spot 2-3 years from now.

If I had a W212 BT, I'd fold for the new A6 TDI. Otherwise, I'd hold and roll it for 12 more months. I'd still probably end up in the A6 TDI anyway. In either case, I have control over the net worth demolition... the car I have now will decline as I drive it. The car I replace it with will decline the moment I drive it off the lot and I'd start the process all over again.

So if you have the itch, now would be the time to make the switch.

This is why I have the A6 TDI on order. I figure that when I get to that threshold in the A6, it will be near 120k miles and not 50k miles like a MB.

I went for the A6 because the E250 is absurd in my view. Oh, and they cost about the same when you equalize the options.
 
#14 ·
The E 250 is absurd? Why?

It's quite OK to drive, gets far better FE than the 6 and will go 150 MPH in European guise.
 
#15 ·
It's not all about the FE. It's about the most important role a diesel engine plays: torque. Less torque is not an improvement. It's an abomination to plop a 4 banger in there and pass it off as a luxury car. I can get a 4 cylinder diesel in VW's. This stunt is right up there with the CLA. MB has no other choice but to keep up with CAFE standards. They took a special car (E350 BT) and made it mediocre (E250 BT). If anything, maybe the lack proper power will prevent the slide in resale value the OP is concerned about.
 
#16 ·
I've driven one and the 500 Nm (369 lbs-ft) is more than enough for the E body. If the 350 CDI is so special, why is it only worth keeping to a measly 50K miles? (That's a rhetorical question.)
 
#17 ·
The OM642 is also in the S-class. I presume it's required to lug around the weight. The 50k mile point is how the MBAs and bankers write down the value on the books. The real fun starts at 80k miles, where actual maintenance costs start.

Still, less weight and increase in mileage on an already economical car is no excuse for replacing using a 4-banger when they could have improved the OM642 or the gasser E350 for that matter.
 
#18 ·
It is unlikely that the paltry 16 hp reduction or the 31 ft-llbs of reduced torque produced by the 2.1 liter will be felt in the seat of the pants. Keep in mind, the little four banger has almost 100 ft-lbs more torque than the gas engine. It is a remarkable engine, and, it too will see duty in upcoming Sprinter Vans. It is a tough little motor.
 
#23 · (Edited)
How does the E250 cost more than the A6 Prestige? I've configured them to have the same features like for like and the MB costs more.

As configured on the manufacturer sites for the USA:

Your E250 BlueTEC Sedan
MSRP (Standard Features)$51,400*
Exterior: Polar White$0
17-inch 5-spoke alloy wheels$0
Interior: Chestnut Brown/Black Leather $1,620 - leather std on A6
Trim: Burl Walnut Wood$0
Heated Steering Wheel: $250 - part of A6 cold weather package
Premium 1 Package$ 3,870 - required package to get heated steering wheel
KEYLESS-GO$650 - included in A6 prestige
Split-folding rear seats$440 - std in A6
Active Ventilated front seats$450 - included in A6 prestige
4MATIC Package $2,500 - std on A6 TDI
Driver Assistance Package $2,800 - similar to A6 Driver Assistance Package
Parking Assist Package $1,290
PARKTRONIC with Active Parking Assist and Exit - std on Prestige
Transportation Charge$925
TOTAL $66,195

VS

2014 A6 TDI Prestige $57,900 (includes destination)
Driver Assistance Package $2800 - pairs up with P1 on MB (side assist, radar cruise, etc)
Cold Weather Package $500 - rear heated seats and heated steering wheel
Rear Sunshades $500 - part of P1 on MB
Rear Side Airbags $350 - included on MB E-class
Total: $64,540
 
#24 ·
Did you mean the E250 costs less than the A6 TDI? If less, it is because I have been quoted $11K off an E250 and quoted $6k off an Audi A6 TDI (includes supplier discount).

How does the E250 cost more than the A6 Prestige? I've configured them to have the same features like for like and the MB costs more.

Your E250 BlueTEC Sedan

MSRP (Standard Features)$51,400*
Exterior: Polar White$0
17-inch 5-spoke alloy wheels$0
Interior: Chestnut Brown/Black Leather $1,620 - leather std on A6
Trim: Burl Walnut Wood$0
Heated Steering Wheel: $250 - part of A6 cold weather package
Premium 1 Package$ 3,870 - navi, lane assist, bilind spot
KEYLESS-GO$650 - included in A6 prestige
Split-folding rear seats$440 - std in A6
Active Ventilated front seats$450 - included in A6 prestige
4-matic - std on A6 TDI
Transportation Charge$925
TOTAL $66,195

VS

2014 A6 TDI Prestige $57,900 (includes destination)
Driver Assistance Package $2800 - pairs up with P1 on MB (side assist, radar cruise, etc)
Cold Weather Package $500 - rear heated seats and heated steering wheel
Rear Sunshades $500 - part of P1 on MB
Rear Side Airbags $350 - included on MB E-class
Total: $64,540
 
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