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Transmission issue(s)

4K views 32 replies 6 participants last post by  Al_Savage 
#1 ·
Hi guys - greetings from Norway.

1st time owner of a magnificent E430 4matic from 2000(2001) with only 55k miles on it. I have owned and driven the car for 14 days prior to yesterday and I bought it of my brother in law. There's 2 known malfunctions that I know of; Engine Oil Level, a white and red one, I also know that there is plenty of oil in the engine, checked myself with the dipstick. Having read a great deal on this forum I have come to understand that it's a common issue with the oil sender in the pan, it will get fixed during the next oil change. Fast forward to yesterday - I(we; family and I) were driving on a scenic byroad, when out of the blue BAS and ESP lid up on the dashboard. Now in the 14 days I've had the car never before has it indicated any problem other than the 2 know ones nor have I driven it recklessly or any such thing, so I'm a bit stomped really. Anyway I pulled over to the nearest parkinglot and turned the ignition off - then the engine refused to start and it would not come out of P and it would not indicate any gear position on the cluster either or by manually overriding it , I read a lot of posts in a very short time trying to narrow down the problems; Major culprit(so I've read) 0015456409 I had one shipped in a cab to where I was stranded and I changed it with nothing but a house Key but alas to no avail. Finally after a lot of waiting it was towed to the nearest garage which actually happens to be where we live. So this afternoon the shop called, said it was likely this part which is suspect; 2105451332.

So this is where you guys come into the equation because there's more combined knowledge in here about does and donts, DIY, tries and errors on these cars than anywhere else on the planet.

Could it be the battery? Battery is from 2007 never been changed since then, also yesterday I was freezing my butt off so I put on the seat heater and she(my car) refused and gave me low voltage warning instead, the car was turned off for about 5hrs before this happened.

Side information - talking to they serviceman from the garage, he said they couldn't read the error codes either the car refused to let the tool read it, anyone else been experiencing this?

Well I'm at a loss and running a fever from yesterdays trials - so I'm kinda praying you guys can help on the right path to a solution.

Best regards Mikkel
 
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#2 · (Edited)
The repair-shop's diagnosis seems to be right (no gear selector indication on the panel, not able to come out of P). I would disconnect the battery, charge it overnight and reconnect it with key OUT (to prevent possible key damage), then synching the steering wheel, windows, sunroof, etc.

Do you have any check engine light on in the instrument panel ?

I assume your car has the PRND-4321 arrangement rather than PRND-D+- on the shifter. In that case the part is the right one.
 
#3 ·
Thank you for your speedy reply Mrboca;

Do you have any check engine light on in the instrument panel ?
No malfunction with check engine if that's what you mean, in the odometer/computer.


I assume your car has the PRND-4321 arrangement rather than PRND-D+- on the shifter. In that case the part is the right one
It is actually PRND-D+ on the shifter, then I assume that part is no go?

Best regards Mikkel
 
#4 ·
I always hesitate to take shop word for module replacement when they not present the codes.
Than ESP lights could not be triggered by gear module to my knowledge.
Wait for MAVA to give his prof opinion, but in the mean time get the codes the shop read.
 
#5 · (Edited)
If PRND and -D+ (you shift up and own by slapping the knob right or left), then I am afraid you need to replace the whole shifter assembly. Some liquid must have spilled into the shifter assembly (maybe some rain from the sunroof ? )

The part is not the right one for 4matic. see the warning in red

http://www.autohausaz.com/pn/2105451332

Some people have some success dousing the electronic part (TRRS) with electronics parts cleaner and let it air dry overnight. It may or may not work. In case you need to replace, you can get a replacement from a junkyard or ebay (with returnable option). The last person with the same car I helped here, found a used one for about $160.

You can stick the tip of a pen in the hole (with cover) under the D. It should allow you to move the shifter. Try this after the battery recharge / replacement.

Typically you will get a CEL with P07xx I believe, but it may come after the "confirmed" fault. You possibly have a pending one. Possibly pointing to a TRRS fault (P0705) if it is the problem
 
#11 ·
That checks out to be the right part number for 2000 E430 4matic with 210.083, even for some reason, autohausaz says it is not the right part ??? I would double-check it with the VIN number.

I am concerned that the technician could not read the codes from the OBD port, even after you have a brand new battery.

What happens when you insert the key and try to start the car ? Does the car start ? Just crank but no start ? or just a dead silence ?

If the car does not even crank, with the new battery, I would check the fuses on the K40 relay module, and make sure that the ECM gets powered. The K40 relay module is in the module box under cover at the passenger side.

I would look into the power / no access to the fault data issue first before the shifter. Maybe, and (hopefully) it is just a fuse / K40 module issue.
 
#13 ·
What happens when you insert the key and try to start the car ? Does the car start ? Just crank but no start ? or just a dead silence?
I inserted the key to position 2 all the lights come on at the dash, seats inflate, command starts - basically the entire car works. Turn to start and nothing not even a sound or a peep its just dead completely dead.
 
#12 ·
@mrboca,

Thank you for your time and effort thus far - just to clarify its actually a 2001 model.

Well as it turns out the garage didnt change the battery with a new one - they boosted it instead - and still the codes could not be read or retrieved.

I called the national MB technical hotline here in Norway and they did have some interesting insight to share.

1: If the codes cannot be retrieved at all - it is 99% due to low voltage at the connector at the ecu.
2: They asked me to check pin/point 15 and 30 to see if theres enough juice at those points. Also a relay 87 or point 87? The supply for the engine controll unit.
3: Theres a transmission controll unit near the transmission itself and ATF can leak onto those connectors as well - so they asked me to check that too.
4: The techs was 99% sure it was not the transmission assembly due to the initial errors BAS and ESP.
5: The techs thought it may have been an internal short in the battery due to its age and the nature of the malfunctions and low voltage warnings from breakdown to retrieval(towing).

So as it stands now I have kindly requested the garage to replace the battery with a new one, that will happen on monday - so until then we will see and I will pray.
 
#14 ·
Alright. It is getting more like a K40 relay module issue. Ask the technician to check fuses on the K40 which supply power to the ECM, TCM, RSP, etc. It could be a blown fuse, or a solder crack, or an old and worn out relay contact which can cause these problems.

The battery is old and tired, but when boosted (if done properly), your car should start, right ?

You should get a new battery in any case because it is old and a potential future problem.

If it is K40, the new one should be around $130. A recent case (same model / year) had the same problems you described. A fuse (that supplies power to the ESP module) was blown. Replacing the fuse allowed the car to start then the fuse blew again. Replacement of the K40 solved the problem.

The "new style" shifter problems typically come with a CEL (P0705), and you should be able to start the car, but not shift from P. Since you have no start / no crank condition, the problem seems to be the power distribution issue.
 
#15 ·
@mrboca,

I am leaning more and more towards the scenario you described, is this the right one: 0005400072OE

Here's my two pennies; Brake Light Switch brokedown/shorted due to age(I noticed a crushing sound when you depress the spring loaded pin, like it crumbed internally, when I had it out) this in turn shorted out the fuse(I haven't checked, cause I didn't know where that fuse box was located) for what you described. So come Monday I'll get them to check that K40 relay/fuse box combo.

Your insight Mrboca is priceless - I hope someday I can repay you.
 
#16 ·
It is the right one, and a good price too :)

A crumbling Brake light switch will definitely give you the BAS/ABS/ESP lights on the display but should not cause a fuse to blow, because low power sense circuits of the modules are connected to the contacts of the switch. A replacement, with proper installation procedures followed, should clear the faults, and operate the brake lights when the pedal is depressed. The workshop should confirm proper installation as the first step.

The fuses you see on top of the K40 module power various modules in the same module box where K40 is. The technician should measure the voltages at both sides of the fuses (top access) with the key in position 2 (after the new battery installed). The specification calls for 11V to 14V. If you do not see these voltages, the K1 relay (the reverse polarity relay inside the K40 module is suspect. K1 contact closure provides power to most of the modules for the car to run. If K1 is bad, it is best to replace the K40 as it is inexpensive (rather than attempting to repair)

The best way to repay the forum is to post the final solution of the problem, so it can help others with similar problems.
 
#19 ·
@mrboca

It's normally a RED 10 Amp fuse - it's now a Blue 15 Amp. That turquoise one was a 40 Amp one to get the car running. Once the fuse(RED 10 Amp) blows - the car reverts back to missbehaving again i.e. this thread up until this point. Blue 15 Amp holds - but it is still 5 Amps above what it should be, so the service guy was a little concerned about that. What does that particular fuse entail? The service guy rambled something about a fan that cools the ECU's - but I mean it's never blown before I had the BAS/ESP misshap. Something that fuse drives shorts it though - now to figure out what it is specifcally any thoughts?
 
#20 ·
Alright.. So you replace the fuse. the car runs. You turn it off and restart but the fuse blows and no start. right ?

Yes ask the technician to remove the G connector (the wire that goes to the bottom of the module holder box) and if the fuse does not blow after this and several starts you found the problem.. The ECU fan unit.
 
#26 ·
ECU fan dead, blows fuse. The problem that only exists on the gasoline W210 :)

The service guy rambled something about a fan that cools the ECU's
When the fuse blows, you can't get the shifter out of Park, IIRC. See:

http://www.benzworld.org/forums/w210-e-class/1395141-e200k-2001-w210-ecu-cooling-fan.html

http://www.benzworld.org/forums/r170-slk-class/1648797-d-i-y-ecm-ecu-fan.html

I believe I read that the official fix is to disconnect the fan (?). Member MBGraham spent a lot of time researching an inexpensive replacement fan for his.
 
#27 ·
Hi guys,

My baby is back and running - Al_Savage was right ECU fan was the culprit - unplugged and it all works - fuse is back to RED 10 Amp. Thanks for all your help and please see Al_Savage post in this thread it will save some people a lot of trouble shooting not to mention MrBoca's valuable insight into other possible faulty parts.

I now have another issue with the central locking system after the car battery was changed but I'll make a new thread for that one.

----------------Case Closed----------------------
 
#32 ·
you may want to read this post, as many things can tank the W210

Mikkel, I have nearly the same car with similar issue.

For me it WAS the K40 module! very similar symptoms, check the link below and you will see the STAR Dx and the fact that it can give false information about very expensive modules. Do you know HOW you mechanic traced
the problem to the fan? Did you get a specific code? or maybe he tried to bypass the imputs to test it?
That would benefit others. You may want to pick up a good used K40 module as they definitely go south and are super cheap. When I was guessing my way to a solution bought a used one for $13. Having one around is super cheap insurance.


http://www.benzworld.org/forums/w210-e-class/2698657-abs-esp-bas-lights-car-tanked.html
 
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