I have a co-worker with a 2001 E320 she and her husband bought last year. Looks just like my car did when I bought it, same color, same interior, same features, same unappealing wheels (man, I never miss those things!).
The other day I mentioned I was getting ready to change my motor mounts. She jokingly suggested that I should change her spark plugs for her. I opined that it really wasn't a fun job, tight confines, sharp edges, easily injured wires, etc. She just said her mechanic had recommended it and it was a bit expensive. I agreed they charge a lot and reiterated the lack-of-fun part, which is part of the cost. Then I asked her why she was changing plugs. Her response: there was a "miss" you could feel at idle and that was the mechanic's diagnosis. No CEL, no codes. No "miss" in neutral, only in gear.
I furrowed my brow and said, gee, that's funny. That's EXACTLY why I'm changing my motor mounts, and you have the classic symptoms for them. Perhaps you should indeed consider changing ... mechanics.
Vehicle: 2001 E320 - Brilliant Silver/Ash: MBCA member
Location: The Mountain State
Posts: 6,381
Greg, good takeoff on the "Steven Wright" lawyer joke we chuckled about earlier. You might remember you corrected me as to the source.
I don't understand how a mis-firing cylinder (isn't that what a true "miss" is?) and bad motor mounts are related. Could your co-worker and her mechanic be using the wrong term for her symptom?
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Ich liebe meinen Mercedes-Benz!
Last edited by Musikmann : 05-07-2008 at 07:00 PM.
with the proper tools are a walk in the park.
the 17mm boot tool I sell for $28 delivered is the key to the ease and not hurting the wires.
Anytime you want to come down and walk in my park you're welcome to do so. Between my back and the sharp edges, it simply wasn't fun. I used the Lisle tool and didn't have any real challenges with the wires/caps, at least once I remembered the dielectric grease (insert dope-slap here) but until then it was harder getting them back on than it was removing them.
The Benz was almost worse than doing them on my 1984 Z-28, on which I couldn't even see most of the plugs. The benefit on that car was that I could throw a piece of carpet over the engine and just lay on it, with the new plugs up on the cowl, just reach down, pull one out, toss it over my shoulder, put in the new one, find the darn wire, put it back, and move on. On the other hand they had to be done more frequently than the benz, so...
Still, pretty much anything is better than changing the battery on the original Cobra (remove passenger side cylinder head) or doing plugs on the old Chevy Monza with the V8 (unbolt motor mounts, raise engine for center two plugs on each bank).
im a mechanic and i KNOW 95% of us are not rotten. Now What I do think is that 50% of them misdiag for the wrong thing, and 45% know the problem but sell the parts that may effect the symptom to cover their ass.
What if your car had a misfire due to (lets say) 5 plugs and 5 wires? Now, the GOOD mechanic (5%) just replace those 5 wires and 5 plugs to save the customer some money. The rest of the plugs and wires are just as old as the faulty ones, but are still within spec, and let it go. A month or maybe 3 months down the road, the car acts up. The client Brings the car back to the dealer and the mechanic tells them that their car is missing again, but its because of the OTHER 7 plugs and wires that are faulty this time.
If you were in this situation, How would you feel after spending $300 for plugs/wires and its starts to mis again? If i was that client, I would go to the service manager and complain about why wasn't my car fix the First Time! "You should of caught that other 7 Plugs/wires" One thing for sure is THAT mechanic just lost time & money AND the dealer just got a bad name. FYI Mechanics dont get paid the second time if the car comes back.
Your car may need motor mounts for rough idle but how do you know her car need motor mounts? It may have been changed before she bought the car. what if her car had a leak in the vacuum system, (no cel, no codes)rough idle depending on the size of the leak.
Vehicle: 2001 E320 - Brilliant Silver/Ash: MBCA member
Location: The Mountain State
Posts: 6,381
Motioneffects,
I would like to underline and paraphrase one of your points. The key to being a good mechanic is the ability to properly diagnose the problem. Any so-called "wrench" can remove and replace parts (to CYA or otherwise).
Thank you for speaking up and defending your profession my friend!
The old lawyers joke, which I think was applied here was 3% vs 97.
I am trying to understand misdiagnose. That happens to doctors all the time, so why refuse mechanics rights to do so?
But after experiencing too often that the "regularly changed oil and filter" on next change turns that the filter element is extra crispy?
Or replacing "6 quarts of transmission fluid" in 3 quarts pan.
Or "replacing" 15 years coolant every 2 years?
Vehicle: 2001 E320 - Brilliant Silver/Ash: MBCA member
Location: The Mountain State
Posts: 6,381
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kajtek1
The old lawyers joke, which I think was applied here was 3% vs 97. I am trying to understand misdiagnose. That happens to doctors all the time, so why refuse mechanics rights to do so?
Hi Kajtek1,
I won't argue the % with you, you might be correct. As to the doctors, sometimes people die due to a mis-diagnosis. To me, this is a different scenario than spending too much to have our cars repaired.
This could become a long debate between you and me. But let me say that my father was an MD, I spent 1 year in medical school, and my sister and her husband also have MD degrees. Therefore, I have an obvious built-in bias on this issue.
Be that as it may, everyone is capable of making a mistake. It is sometimes catastrophic when medical doctors make them. Unfortunatly, these are more often than not, covered up by other doctors reviewing the cases. I think the same might be true when lawyers are accused of malpractice.
Than - as you pointed we can open a can of worms here.
What is your definition of "malpractice". My late friend, who was MB repairman told me that in situations when one of dual electric fuel pump failed, he always replaced both. His practice proved that single pump working double duty for some time is not going to last. So is mechanic replacing single pump in dual system doing malpractice?
Mechanics don't study as long as doctors, so we expect from them less.
Than again if their hourly charges equal doctor charges, why not?
Than again, one more time, cars -unlike human body are not self-fixers. Meaning doctors have it easy
A mechanic and surgeon are talking at their kids' soccer game. The mechanic says, 'You and I are much the same. Someone comes in with a problem, we listen to them and ask questions to diagnose it properly and then fix the problem. The only difference is that I have dirt under my fingernails to prove I work for a living. Yet I am in debt and many people don't think too much of me. And everyone bows down to you and you live at the country club. Doesn't seem quite fair, you know?'
The doctor looked at him and replied, 'That's not the only difference. When you tear apart the engine at least you get to turn it off first.'
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