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99 E 300 Turbodiesel.

9K views 28 replies 15 participants last post by  nightmare_t 
#1 ·
Would you recommend buying a used 98 or 99 E turbo deisel? Any problems, anything to watch out for?

Thanks!

Jeremy@Progear.com
 
#2 ·
Depending on your budget, I would wait for the new diesels coming soon. I have a 98. It is a fantastic car when it's working correctly. I like the look and the performance. Especially for a car that gets 30 MPG and winds up to 130 MPH or more like it has a large electric motor in it. That being said. It's a POS. Problems with fuel delivery system, transmission, electrical, a/c etc is not something you want to fix if you're paying the bill. The glow plugs on this car were replaced at 35K and 70K. I paid almost $2,000 the last time. Check your local dealer and ask him the price to replace them all. They're difficult to get to so once you have it apart you'll want them all done. For me, and I don't know exactly why, diesels are an addiction and this car is like no other diesel I've had but it's still a POS. My advice FWIW is to not buy one unless it's under a very good extended warranty. I also advise you not to drive one if it's not under the warranty because you'll want to own it.
 
#3 ·
The new diesels will only be worse. No mechanical injection anymore. Just like a gasser, it will have electronic fuel injection. Monitoring all the fuel pressures going into each injector solenoid through the common rail at an ECU-4 set rate. If the alternator goes, the engine stalls. A lot of the new CDI's are made out of aluminum crankcases too. Pushing an 18:1 compression ratio(uggh). OK in a gasser, but I wonder how it will do in a diesel?

I'm looking towards gassers now. The 3-valve M111, M112 engines Mercedes has been pushing out are building up a good name for themselves. With the exception of harmonic balancer issues, of course.

Maybe a well pampered used E55 normally aspirated version might be a nice upgrade from my E420.[:D]
 
#4 ·
If you paid $2000 to change the glow plugs, its time to find another shop. All six plugs, parts and labor, cost me $310 the last time I had it done. I have also done individual ones myself and I can change one glow plug in about 30 minutes.
 
#5 ·
Being originally from Europe, I do not understand why anyone in the US would want/need a diesel. They are more expensive to fix, you get yourself potentially dirty/greasy everytime you go to the pump, and often have to stand in line with pickups or other trucks.

To get decent power, you need a turbo which causes another potential repair expense. I would have to think an E320 a better choice. With respect to gas mileage, the math does not seem to justify the additional headaches.
 
#6 ·
The E320's get very good gas mileage too. I've heard of 30 mpg being reached on a long trip.

Not trying to put down diesels, but I don't see any real benefit to them anymore. Since fuel economy is coming in closer between the two ICE's and the price of diesel is more than the price of premium gas in some places.
 
#7 ·
Jeremy, If there is any difference between the two cars besides a year , I would be surprised. I recently bought a 98 after looking for the right one for months. mbusa says the mileage is different 98 26/34 and 99 27/36 mpg but this is different because of changes in epa testing. My other car is a 93 e300 td and I put 282,000 miles on it with very few repairs. If the 98 or 99 is half the car my other car I would still be happy. The car has alot of pep for a deisel (other was very slow off start) and will always hold its value over a e 320 even after the new 2005 e300td comes out in spring 04. My motor mounts of the 93 were replaced at 100k and have not given me any more problems. I would have liked a 99 but my 98 was loaded with most all of the possible options except e1 (xexons + a few other goodies) If you drive alot buy one. If not a gas e320 is fine .. good luck
 
#8 ·
True. The values for the diesel are always going to be more than the mass produced gassers.

I love how on mbusa they post not only the MPG mistake, but the performance page for the '98 is false.

0-60 in 8.5 seconds is true, but... 174 bhp @ 5K? I don't think so. The horsepower kicks in at max from 4400.

Oh, and the torque curve is a smooth as a baby's butt with 244lb/ft of torque available from 1600-4800 rpm. Something even the CDI's can't match.

The only difference in turbodiesels between '98 and '99 have nothing to do with the engines. 2 more airbags, different radio, and a crappy steel spare wheel as opposed to having a full 16" alloy wheel.[:(!]

I also heard that they do not have a 3.46 final drive. Is that true? Do all E300 Turbodiesels have a 3.46? Someone believes his is a 3.07, like the E320.
 
#9 ·
Rick,

The OM606 diesel motor (that's what is in the E300DT) has the intake manifold covering the glow plugs. Only one can be gotten at with the manifold on. The manifold is a real pain to get off. ~12 easy bolts and one real bastard. I just replaced my plugs in my G (also OM606). It wasn't that hard, except for the one that seized in the head and sheared off. I think that a PO broke that plug during a previous plug change.
 

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#10 ·
The 603 can be a PITA to get at too. You don't have to take off the intake manifold to replace glowplugs, but you'll have a Hell of a time trying to get in there under it.

The same problem occurs with adjusting the ALDA. The stupid box is shoved underneath the intake manifold![:(!] Whereas the old 617 had it right next to the dome cover.
 
#11 ·
Thank you for the tips! I currently have an 87 300D Turbo that has 260k miles on it. The engine is in excellent condition (no abnormal oil burning and the compresion is excellent) however my tranmission has failed. They are recommending that I get a rebuilt one however it's going to cost 3-4k to get it done right. I am thinking about a 98 or 99 however I have some concerns around the reliablity. I haven't had good luck with my 2000 ML 320 and my latest purchase of an 03 G500. I don't think MB provides the servive that I am used to anymore.

Thank you!
 
#12 ·
Rick, Id be interested in knowing who you got to change your plugs. I could ship my car there and save money next time (Not kidding). Mercedes list on the plugs is something like $56 a piece. That's over 300 just for those parts. That doesn't count the labor to R&R the manifold and doesn't count any additional problems they find.

I'm certain I could find a shop to do it cheaper but not for 300 or anywhere close.
 
#13 ·
Try benzbin.com or epsparts.com. I think I paid less than $25/each for the plugs. Given what a pain they are to get to, it's best to change them all.

I am trying to think of a better way to put in the one difficult fastener for the intake manifold. It would be nice to be able to remove it quickly. The coarse fuel filter is under there too.

One design defect in the OM606 is the o-ring based fuel line seals. The seal for the pressure side of the lift pump (attached to the side of the injection pump) vibrates just a little with each pressure stroke. Eventually the o-ring fails. Our e-class just had this happen. The G seems OK, but I'm replacing them all anyway. MB should have stuck with the old banjo nut system. Those were bulletproof.
 
#14 ·
I've got a source for discount parts and have used them for parts like brake pads etc. I haven't got the time to do something like change the glowplugs myself. I've found an independent shop to do them next time but I still can't buy the parts and bring them to the shop although the overall price will be lower. The discount parts sources are usually good only if you do the work yourself.
 
#16 ·
Mercedes Tech here.Havent seen any major problems with 210 diesels.Common items are glow plugs,and fuel lines-which seep fuel.If work hasent been done recently,Would replace glow plugs and fuel lines as well as o-ring at fuel shutoff valve as intake is removed for either repair and labor would be saved by taking care of both at one visit.
A good underbody inspection-check engine mounts-diesels are hard on the mounts,transmission electrical plug-common with 722.6 trans throughout MB production caused by bad cast on elec. trans conductor plate. Other than what is mentioned above,very minor.Overall 210 diesels rule in my opinion.And always with a Benz-have an extended warranty!!!
 
#17 ·
Mercedes Tech here.Havent seen any major problems with 210 diesels.Common items are glow plugs,and fuel lines-which seep fuel.If work hasent been done recently,Would replace glow plugs and fuel lines as well as o-ring at fuel shutoff valve as intake is removed for either repair and labor would be saved by taking care of both at one visit.
A good underbody inspection-check engine mounts-diesels are hard on the mounts,transmission electrical plug-common with 722.6 trans throughout MB production caused by bad cast on elec. trans conductor plate. Other than what is mentioned above,very minor.Overall 210 diesels rule in my opinion.And always with a Benz-have an extended warranty!!!
 
#18 ·
Well Mercedes Tech.
I do own a 99 300TD. It does run smoothly, and im glad that i didn`t buy the 2000-2002 first edition commonrail.
That one cost a lot of money.
Here in Denmark most MB are Taxis, and they are having a hard time, but are the best car for the job.
Many Taxi owners had offerd me trades, when they meet me at the service shop, cos the 300TD was the last MB dieselengine that are made really well.
Those Taxiowners spend lots of money on especially the fuelpump/commonrail,(211) and they have major electically problems.

But....

Over the past year i think my diesel has got more of a metallic sound.
When started cold its sounding like a smooth commonrail, after a minute or two...the sound changes like a the really old diesels, with the hammering sound.
Hope its not the injectors or something like that, they cost at horrible amount of money.

Overall im happy with my 300TD, but after this one ill never buy MB again, they are robust, its absolutely prestige to ride MB, ....but still too many problems overall.
I havent ever before owned a car, that went to the serviceshop that many times.

During one year, i had:

* 2 services as supposed, cos of ordinary mileage service.

* Further more i had been there mainly cos of electricially problems(sunroof, Park Distance Control, Generator)

* two times it leaked about ½ a gallon diesel on the parkinglot (Fuelsystem)

* We havent yet found the faliure that cause alarms all the time, # low oilstand, # defetive headlamps and so on and on. Now I just restart it like a computer, and the problems are gone.
(Checks the oil manually though)

* The muffler broke apart from the rest of the exhaust pipe, at its 4 years birthday.(at 100.000KM) They "normally" break where its welded at the muffler.

* The body had the doors changed due to rust problems, the luggage hatch, and other parts was changed too.

* The stabilizer arms sometimes gives wierd sounds like an old wooden boat, when you get in and out, they was changed too.


The E 300TD is allright, considered its a Mercedes.
Next time ill go for a Volvo or BMW, im tired of the coffe in the waiting room, at the MB serviceshop.
 
#19 ·
jzaroh - 12/24/2003 2:27 PM

True. The values for the diesel are always going to be more than the mass produced gassers.

0-60 in 8.5 seconds is true, but... 174 bhp @ 5K? I don't think so. The horsepower kicks in at max from 4400.

Oh, and the torque curve is a smooth as a baby's butt with 244lb/ft of torque available from 1600-4800 rpm. Something even the CDI's can't match.

[I read that the maximum torque is from 1600 to 3000 rpm.]

The only difference in turbodiesels between '98 and '99 have nothing to do with the engines. 2 more airbags, different radio, and a crappy steel spare wheel as opposed to having a full 16" alloy wheel.[:(!]

I also heard that they do not have a 3.46 final drive. Is that true? Do all E300 Turbodiesels have a 3.46? Someone believes his is a 3.07, like the E320.
True, our '99 E-300 DT does have the "taller" 3.07 differential gear ratio. And I wish it were the 2.82s that are standard for the V8s. It could easily pull even taller gears such as 2.65s with that readily available 244 ft lb torque.

I think the 3.46s are standard in the '97 and older diesels that do not have the turbo, and are therefore shy about 90 ft/lb torque and 40 horsepower.

I see no reason not to buy one of these fine cars, but at only 96K miles, I'm certainly no expert. Ask me in about five years when ours should be at about one quarter million miles!

[:D]
 
#20 ·
Well, now. I'll just have to catch up here. I have a 2.88 differential and I'm jealous. There is no overdrive in my tranny, and I think the engine works too hard. If you have seen my videos, then you know my car ain't the average diesel.

I'm thinking of swapping a taller 420/560SEL differential into my SDL. 2.47, instead of the 2.88. Main difference should occur in higher speed cruising. I hate being redline limited.[:(!]

My question is, what should go into a differential swap?
 
#21 ·
Hi y'all. New on the forum. I have a '99 E300 TD. It was my dream car when I bought it (new). Had always wanted an MB Diesel. My dad had owned two back in the 60's and early 70's, so that unique diesel 'rumble' was connected to a lot of memories of family vacations and rides with the old man.

This car has cost me nearly $5,000 in the past year, starting right after the warranty ran out. During the warranty period, there was at least another $5k of work done to it. (Broken motor mounts, etc.) While it is a joy to drive, this car has spent more time in the shop than I would have ever imagined.

In the past six months, it has developed a surge just as it shifts from 3rd to 4th gear (whether in OD or 4th). MB says they can't find anything wrong with it. No one but the dealer has ever touched this car and I'm one of those "change the oil every 3,500 miles" fanatics. What really torqued me off was when the dashboard started to crack last year and they told me there wasn't anything they could do about it. This for a car that is garaged 85% of the time and "armor-alled" once a month.

I've never driven a car that I love to drive more, but I've never owned one that has cost me as much. My wife's '92 Lexus hasn't cost me as much in 12 years as my Benz has in the past 12 months. Go figure!
 
#22 ·
Hey LFL, don't use armor-all on anything. It has a tendency to harden plastic making it crack, especially don't get it on the leather. I can't speak for 210 diesels but I own 240D and 87 300td, both with well over 200k. The only probs I have with the motors have been my own fault and fuel line hoses deteriorating. The only thing I can suggest as with any diesel is to run a fuel additive such as Standyne or Howe's b/c there is little lubricant left in the fuel since sulfur has been removed. I am member of the Turbo Diesel Registry where cummins there are documented cummins engines with over 1 millions miles and only minor repairs, other that have fuel pumps that fail b/c filters have not been changed often enough allowing water to rust in the lines.
 
#23 ·
I use vegetable oil on my dashboards. Just a web rumor, and it seems to really work! I used to use armor all and it lasted for about three days.

Last time I applied some VO was two months ago. They still look fresh and wet![:D]

The only strike I have against the E300 turbodiesel is the ECU. I need to chip the darn thing to boost the fuel. So much for the 10mm open-end and screwdriver.[:(]
 
#24 ·
I have a '99 E300, as does my mom. They both have had some small problems, but overall have been very reliable. I had some 'bugs' to work out while it was under warranty, but they were tiny. Knock on wood, I've had no probs aside from a few burnt out bulbs etc. My mom had glowplugs go bad on her, $485 at the benz dealer. It was about 3 weeks after her warranty expired [:(!]

They are much more of a car than the E320 IMO. The diesel is just more fun to drive. I spent a lot of time in my grandma's E320 that I borrowed for a while, and I like the E300 so much better. The torque just keeps pouring on. The other thing nobody mentioned is the diesel has so much more longevity than the gasser. While the gasser is dead at 100-150k, the diesel will keep chuggign along two or three times longer.. 28-30mpg city and 31-34 highway are common, not babying it.
 
#25 ·
Thank you for all the advise. After looking at all my options I decided to replace the tranny in my 87 300D Turbo at 259,000 miles. I debated this with my Mechanic and he won. no oil burning, compression check is really good, and it runs very well. NO reason it can't last another 100k miles.

Agree the 99 E300 is a blast to drive. Lots of torque, it feels like it has energy. Though the only used ones I found where champagne color and most didn't have many options on them.
 
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