Sorry to hear that. It's bloody frustrating when things like this happen.
Also, our car started messing about again, when I tried the spare key in it.
So now I am fairly sure that; a: we have a connection issue (in the ignition barrel) and b: when the car fails to start, the immobiliser kicks in so you can't try again for 10 mins.
I am tearing my hair out now.
Any idea what it costs to just have MB recode the keys to the cars computer?
Similar starting issue with my A190, which although I have not cured, I do seem to have localised the problem?!
Starting issues began last year, when the weather cooled, unlocked with the alarm key and got in the car one evening, tried to start and nothing happened?!? ALL electrics working, new battery recently!!, new key fob batteries etc, just nothing on final turn to crank starter. After about 15 mins and 20 attempts, starter suddenly roared into life and away I went, non the wiser!!
Gradually as winter came, starting issues started appearing sporadically (especially colder mornings etc.), eventually after many attempts / short while, starter comes alive on final turn.
Then I had a period of a week, when I could not start the car, so investigated possible solutions with Mercedes garages and other Merc specialists. Mercedes said, definately the starter!! and not much change from £1000 to replace due to engine having to be dropped to gain access!!! Crazy.
Later that week car started fine, obviously did NOT spend the huge sum proposed!!
Spring came, and as temperature increased, problem dissapeared altogether, HOWEVER, last few weeks as it has cooled, problem has come back on a few occassions.
THIS TIME, I had thought about it a bit, and tried locking and un-locking car with KEY ONLY (NO ALARM!!!), and hey presto, not had a single re-occurance of the issue. Starts first time - no problem each time.
I THEREFORE STRONGLY SUSPECT THE STARTING ISSUE IS NOT THE STARTER MOTOR ITSELF, BUT THE CONTROL ELECTRICS FROM THE ALARM SYSTEM THAT MAY WELL GOVERN SOME IMMOBILISER CIRCUIT ON THE START FUNCTION, AND THIS FUNCTION MAY WELL BE TEMPERATURE SENSITIVE (I.E. INCREASED RESISTANCE ON CONDUVTIVITY OF A WIRE OR CIRCUIT AS THE TEMPERATURE LOWERS?!?! JUST A GUESS).
Does anybody have any thoughts / experiance in this matter at all?
Would be interesting to hear any solutions that might be suggested, as I would like to have alarm system back, but I suspect replacing all of that might also be rather expensive?!
Sorry to hear that you have had this misery too. You might have read my posts from earlier, guess what?.. this issue is STILL not resolved, we just live with it.
Like yourself, we've replaced the battery in the car and the fobs, but to no avail.
What my wife does, is go out to the car 5 - 10 mins before she wants to drive it and tries to start it. She hears slight movement from the starter, then nothing and it won't attempt to start anymore.
She leaves it 5-10 mins more and then goes out to start it again. 9 times out of 10 it'll fire up straight away! Occasionally, she'll have to leave it 5 more mins before trying for a third time.
How annoying!!
Recently, as the weather has got colder, the issue is getting worse, so we stuck the car into the local Merc dealership and they happily charged us £155 to replace the crankshaft censor. This cured it for about 2 weeks and it was back to square one!!
So, yesterday, we took it back to Merc and left it with them overnight. They called us this morning saying that they'd had a laptop connected to it when trying to start it this morning and they CONFIRM it is the starter motor and want to charge us £750 to replace it.
What a load of tosh!, if it was the starter, the pattern described above would not make sense.
EDIT: Lofty said back in mArch that there are, quote: "Also make sure you get the correct starter for your car I understand there are two types one with a built in immobiliser one without the last thing you want is to fit the wrong one."
It still doesn't make sense that if the unit was faulty, it would not start first thing in the morning, but it WOULD start 5 minutes later.. crazy..
Incidently, a friendly local garage will charge us £300 to fit a genuine Merc starter, so, no way are MB getting the job.
I agree with yourself, it is definately something to do with the immobiliser.
I am going to try what you suggested about opening the car with the key in the morning and seeing if that makes a difference.
I'll keep you posted.
Last edited by mikenco : 10-02-2008 at 09:07 AM.
Reason: update
You guys may be experiancing temperature induced Starter Bendix malfunction. Since it is a part of the Starter Merc would tell you the whole starter needed replacing. I don't know where the starters are on your model but if you can physically tap on them with something it will usually make them work again that one more time. This might give you a clue if the part is bad if you could suddenly, and consistently, force it to work.
Opening the car by key first rather than using the fob made no difference.
Quote:
Originally Posted by cjshade
You guys may be experiancing temperature induced Starter Bendix malfunction. Since it is a part of the Starter Merc would tell you the whole starter needed replacing. I don't know where the starters are on your model but if you can physically tap on them with something it will usually make them work again that one more time. This might give you a clue if the part is bad if you could suddenly, and consistently, force it to work.
Good Luck!
C as in 220
Thanks for the input C and I know what you mean when you say about tapping the starter to get the bendix to engage. I have owned several classic cars and that kind of diagnostics was common on older non-electronic managed cars.
In the case of the A140, I am convinced that it is not the starter itself. We get a half second of power to the starter and an audible "churr" sound from the starter and a few degrees of rotation on the crankshaft. I am sure that there is some other component that is reporting back to the ecu a 'fail' state and the immobiliser is cutting the power to the starter.
I think this, simply because, if we wait five minutes and allow time for the ecu to reset the 'fail' the car WILL start normally. If not the second time, then the third it will. So, temperature and conditions have not changed. It is almost like some component is reporting a 'fail' too early. If I knew how to edit the timings patterns in the ecu's software to say "wait 1 second" instead of "Wait a quarter of a second" then the problem would be sorted.
Ok, this car is a 2002 and now getting a little long in the tooth, but it only has 27,000 miles on the clock. I am rapidly going off European cars.
Our current plan of attack is to get the car booked in to our local garage for new starter, but it is going to be an expensive experiment as I am not convinced that it will cure it.
mikenko
did you ever resolve the doors locking problem?
if you didn't it's the remote key settings you need to look at press and hold the lock or unlock on the fob for 2 secs or more and it resets the locking you will hear bleeps coming from the car , better still go to my site and read the information on the key fob and settings
That's why we say don't let the kids play with the keys they reset everthing including the locking sequence.
Hi Lofty, The doors are not really the problem, the car is still messing about when starting as previously described and is getting worse as the weather is getting colder.
It is getting sold after christmas as I refuse to pay MB over £700 to 'try' and see if a new starter motor will cure it. £700 is almost half of what the current trade-in value is.
Noels
there have been a number of cases where the problem has been the crankcase sensor and if MB had put the diagnostics on your car it should have picked up the problem, albeit the battery is also a common cause.
That sort of bill is out of order, why don't they check the known causes first, these are professional mechanics and they can't find the fault on their bread & butter I smell a rat here Money money, we haven't done much business this week.
Mind you they did garage you car for a week and no doubt they offered you a car while they tinkered with yours?
I don’t now what age your car is/ but if it’s made after 2001 petrol 2004 diesel it’s worth considering buying a hand held OBD2 diagnostics tool and you can get 10% off the cost see my site for details. They are cheaper now than the cost of one test by MB
Then you can at least confirm the information that MB are giving you.
mikenco
There are two things you could try, test your fob batteries using the test procedure, all on my site then re-synchronise the keys with the immobiliser. Do one and then the other if it helps.
If that doesn't help although you will have to reset your windows and ESP/ABS, disconnect the battery for a good 30mins or so then reconnect, and as a safe guard to getting an Engine management light up after connecting the battery, turn your light switch to on before connection, stops the surge of power hitting the ECU, yes it's contrary to what in your manual but it works.
Light the EMlight and its costs you a diagnostic test £50.00+ to delete, unless you have your own OBD2 tool.
Work on the same principle as you do with your PC at home, it plays up so you re boot it, it worth a try it has worked on other owner’s cars and it's costs nothing.
A battery with 13 volts max charge is the answer to a lot of problems on this power hungry modern car.
Gone are the days when batteries only powered the wipers and semi fore indicators, everything on the car is now taking power from the battery until your alternator takes over.
Starter Bendix 
Linear Mode
