I've searched these forums for a couple of weeks to help me determine a vibration in my car. I have a 2003 ML500 with about 23,000 miles. I took it to MB at Morristown, NJ to get it fixed. They replaced the ball joints, tie rods, and aligned the car. They also performed a Hunter Road Force GPS9000 balancing of all 4 wheels. They concluded that the tires are "out-of-round" and that I had to replace all 4 tires (Continential Sport Contact 4X4).
At little history behind the tires: These tires were put on the car new when I bought the car with 15,000 miles. In effect the tires have less than 8,000 miles on them.
I did some research on the Continental Tire Warranty and they offered to replace the tires but that they needed to confirm the MB dealers diagnosis with a Continental Tire dealer. I took it to ETD tires in Clifton, NJ. They claimed that the tire are NOT "out of round" but needed balancing. I said "ok" and they rebalanced the tire.
I have to say that the major vibrations that caused the steering wheel to shake and driver's side sun visor to flutter up and down have ceased and the driveability is improved, BUT, it still sense a slight vibration in the steering wheel, gas petal, and at the seat of my pants. In my hands and feet, it feels like I am holding on to an electric shaver.
1. Has anyone else here had a similar experience?
2. If so, is this a "normal" level of vibration for the ML?
3. What did you do the fix/diagnose the problem?
4. Could this be the mysterious differential problem that MB alluded to for model years 1999-2002. In that bulletin MB admits that differentials might be slightly out of balance?
While I wouldn't rule out other problems, it does sound like tires to me. There are tires out there, that no matter how much you balance them, they'll still shake or bounce a little.
You say they are Continental tires, but I haven't heard that much about them nor ever owned them. My dad had a set of Goodyears on his truck that did the same thing as you describe. He pulled them off and replaced them with Michelins. Problem was solved.
Very few tire manufacturers admit that their tires are bad but sometimes they do. I had a bad set of Dunlops one time, three of the four separated with less than 5000 miles on them. I had to threaten them with a lawyer before they would get right with me about them.
I personally don't think you'd ever go wrong with a set of Michelins. I have bought them for years and have never had a bad one. But it does happen.
I have a new set of Michelin Cross Terrains on mine. They are one sweet ride!
I had a similar vibration problem with my 2002 ML500 - I had the Dunlop SP Sport 5000 tires on when I bought the vehicle. They were crappy tires - lot of vibration in the Steering wheel, uneven tire wear, etc. Got them balanced 2 times before finally replacing them with Michelin Cross Terrain SUV tires - all vibration issues simply vanished. I guess the tire makes a lot of difference in the ride quality !! Go ahead and replace your tires with Michelin Cross Terrains and you will be happy.
While I wouldn't rule out other problems, it does sound like tires to me. There are tires out there, that no matter how much you balance them, they'll still shake or bounce a little.
You say they are Continental tires, but I haven't heard that much about them nor ever owned them. My dad had a set of Goodyears on his truck that did the same thing as you describe. He pulled them off and replaced them with Michelins. Problem was solved.
Very few tire manufacturers admit that their tires are bad but sometimes they do. I had a bad set of Dunlops one time, three of the four separated with less than 5000 miles on them. I had to threaten them with a lawyer before they would get right with me about them.
I personally don't think you'd ever go wrong with a set of Michelins. I have bought them for years and have never had a bad one. But it does happen.
I have a new set of Michelin Cross Terrains on mine. They are one sweet ride!
Yes, I've been toying around with the idea of replacing all 4 tires with the Cross Terrains. I hear everyone that has changed to the Cross Terrains never go back. Before I go there, I want to exhaust all warranty work on this rig before it goes out of warranty next November. There is also a lot of meat on the tire.
I always wondered why the used car dealer was reminding me that the tires were new on the car. Maybe he picked up a "new" set of out-of-round tires and put it on my ML500?
Thanks for the tip. I may very well replace the tires with the Cross Terrains.
I have a similar problem with the same tires. I get a vibration from 70 mph to 77 mph, it really pisses me off. I'm going to get my tires rotated and balanced very soon.
Quote:
ack - 8/15/2005 12:20 PM
Folks,
I've searched these forums for a couple of weeks to help me determine a vibration in my car. I have a 2003 ML500 with about 23,000 miles. I took it to MB at Morristown, NJ to get it fixed. They replaced the ball joints, tie rods, and aligned the car. They also performed a Hunter Road Force GPS9000 balancing of all 4 wheels. They concluded that the tires are "out-of-round" and that I had to replace all 4 tires (Continential Sport Contact 4X4).
At little history behind the tires: These tires were put on the car new when I bought the car with 15,000 miles. In effect the tires have less than 8,000 miles on them.
I did some research on the Continental Tire Warranty and they offered to replace the tires but that they needed to confirm the MB dealers diagnosis with a Continental Tire dealer. I took it to ETD tires in Clifton, NJ. They claimed that the tire are NOT "out of round" but needed balancing. I said "ok" and they rebalanced the tire.
I have to say that the major vibrations that caused the steering wheel to shake and driver's side sun visor to flutter up and down have ceased and the driveability is improved, BUT, it still sense a slight vibration in the steering wheel, gas petal, and at the seat of my pants. In my hands and feet, it feels like I am holding on to an electric shaver.
1. Has anyone else here had a similar experience?
2. If so, is this a "normal" level of vibration for the ML?
3. What did you do the fix/diagnose the problem?
4. Could this be the mysterious differential problem that MB alluded to for model years 1999-2002. In that bulletin MB admits that differentials might be slightly out of balance?
This is an interesting thread.
After having gone thru two sets of the OE Dunlop Grand Treks on a 99 430 I decided to try the Nokian WR SUV tire. Mounted and balanced them myself at the shop where I work on my club racing cars. So I knew it was double checked and bolted the wheels on the truck. I was freaking out. The truck felt like it was a paint shaker at anything over 35 mph. I called the distributor in this area and told them that I want the money back 30 day offer because these tires are junk. He sent a rep to the shop with 4 more tires. Well now we had 8 tires to choose from. I took a tie wrap and zipped it onto a laser pointer. I taped the the laser to a 2x4. then used a stack of paper to adjust it to the right height for the laser to pass right across the surface of the tread while the wheel and tire were on the balancing machine. We spun each tire and wheel from the first set of four. Two of the four tires were not round. There were high and low spots. The Nokian rep was astounded. We busted off the two bad ones and had to go thru all 4 of the replacement tires he brought to get 2 more round ones. I kept the good tires and Nokian ate the 4 bad ones. I was so pissed that I rousted the head of Nokian USA in Georgia and told him how pathetic the problem was.
I told him next time I would back in Michelin or Dunlop product because it was not close to acceptable that their QC was so bad that a rigged up laser pointer could find major flaws in the roundness of the tire.
That being said the tires have done very well in the snow and wet, but seem to be wearing more quickly than the Dunlops.
This post is very interesting to me, first I have had some experience, I've been out of the rubber business for some time, but, as a ex-passenger tire thru ex-earthmover specialist there are some interesting points to note. First, some tires are just not compatible with some vehicle suspensions ( hard to believe,is it not ). The location of the vibration and speed while driving have a lot to do with the solution. EQ: steering wheel is a front problem, seat is a rear concern( in most cases at any speed ). A off the vehicle balancer is both quick and profitable, but they do not take into account the wheel bearings, brake rotor, hub, CV joints and everything else that rotates as a unit, so even a perfect off the vehicle balance may still have a slight vibration. Do the tires have a aggressive tread versus passive. The amount of applied weight( excessive one side compared to the other) can tell you alot. Then there is driver sensitivity. Because of all of the above you can get rid of a vibration at one speed only to have it return at another. There is so much more to look into so far as flat spotting and out of round tires go, that I could be here forever but in short, my guess is QC is out the window these days and its just hit or miss and may the best price win.
Interesting, so all I need now is to figure out how to move the vibration from 70 mph to 120 mph. [:)]
Quote:
jojorom - 8/16/2005 3:33 AM
This post is very interesting to me, first I have had some experience, I've been out of the rubber business for some time, but, as a ex-passenger tire thru ex-earthmover specialist there are some interesting points to note. First, some tires are just not compatible with some vehicle suspensions ( hard to believe,is it not ). The location of the vibration and speed while driving have a lot to do with the solution. EQ: steering wheel is a front problem, seat is a rear concern( in most cases at any speed ). A off the vehicle balancer is both quick and profitable, but they do not take into account the wheel bearings, brake rotor, hub, CV joints and everything else that rotates as a unit, so even a perfect off the vehicle balance may still have a slight vibration. Do the tires have a aggressive tread versus passive. The amount of applied weight( excessive one side compared to the other) can tell you alot. Then there is driver sensitivity. Because of all of the above you can get rid of a vibration at one speed only to have it return at another. There is so much more to look into so far as flat spotting and out of round tires go, that I could be here forever but in short, my guess is QC is out the window these days and its just hit or miss and may the best price win.
I had a similar vibration problem with my 2002 ML500 - I had the Dunlop SP Sport 5000 tires on when I bought the vehicle. They were crappy tires - lot of vibration in the Steering wheel, uneven tire wear, etc. Got them balanced 2 times before finally replacing them with Michelin Cross Terrain SUV tires - all vibration issues simply vanished. I guess the tire makes a lot of difference in the ride quality !! Go ahead and replace your tires with Michelin Cross Terrains and you will be happy.
My ML500 has had this type of vibration problem since the day I picked it up new at the dealership. My truck's tires are OEM Dunlops. They've been rebalanced once which provided only slight relief. My lesson learned -- I'll NEVER purchase a Dunlop tire...EVER. They're crap.
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