Weird Battery Problem or Classic M119 Behavior?

[tuttebenne]

Sunday morning I start up the 400e and back it out of the driveway to park it in the street. Nothing odd; all worked fine.

I was off for President's Day, Monday, so midday I go to start her up for a drive. She almost lit off after the usual 3/4 second cranking but didn't start. It settled into a slower than usual cranking speed but with a different sound to it - as if there was no compression?!
Four hours later I get the time to try to start the car again. Same symptom - slower than usual cranking and no start.

I connected my Sears battery charger to the battery and it reads 60%, which from my experience is what you get from a battery that is in the latter half of its useful life but still capable of working fine. As a result I am not really thinking "battery" at this point but I set it to do a two amp slow charge. Fifteen minutes later the battery is reading 100% and the engine starts after maybe three or four seconds of cranking. I check the alternator output and its 14.3volts. "Great!" On one hand, I can now drive the car up to the garage, but on the other hand, now its running so finding the problem might be more difficult. Its near dark now so I pack it in for the day.
The next morning before going to work, I try to start it and the battery is stone cold dead and the engine won't turn over at all?!? The starter just makes the typical stuttering solenoid sound. I had a spare battery on the bench so I dropped it in. The engine started immediately, as usual.

Having the battery out I do a visual and notice that the label with the Month and Year punch outs indicates the battery was purchased in February of 2001 !!!!!!!!!!! I bought the car in 2008 so I guess, yeah, its been a while. I pick up a new battery at the dealership during lunch on Tuesday and so I'm now $140 lighter but after putting in the battery, she cranks faster than ever and all seems well.

Question: Is cranking but not starting typical behaviour for an M119 with a dead battery? I have never experienced anything like this before. How does a dying battery still have enough amperage to crank an M119 but not have enough voltage to start it?

[sbaert]

Couple of questions:

1) How does your charger bring a 800Amp battery from 60% to a full 100% charge in only 15 minutes using a 2Amp slow charge??? This tells me the battery plates are starting to short circuit. I'd put a battery tester on it and do a load test.

2) I have never seen a battery go longer than 6.5-7 years, ever. Yours went almost 12 years??? Did you check the date code that is branded on the battery case as well (not just the punched out holes on the label)??? I'm thinking that maybe the battery was made in 2007 but whoever punched the label got things mixed up and punched out 2001.

[Sherman321]

I just finished servicing a 2002 Jetta that still had its original battery. If you maintain the electrolyte level they should last a while, assuming they were stored properly prior to purchase and arent a crap brand. But yeah, 4 to 6 years is what ours (VW) usually go out at.

Slow cranking and no start is often the symptom of a near dead battery I've found. Some batteries go bad in 2 years it seems and others last 10. You got lucky

[tuttebenne]

Originally Posted by Sherman321

I just finished servicing a 2002 Jetta that still had its original battery. If you maintain the electrolyte level they should last a while, assuming they were stored properly prior to purchase and arent a crap brand. But yeah, 4 to 6 years is what ours (VW) usually go out at.

Slow cranking and no start is often the symptom of a near dead battery I've found. Some batteries go bad in 2 years it seems and others last 10. You got lucky

Last year I pulled a ten year old battery out of my kid's corolla, so 11 years isn't impossible but it does surprise me too. Regarding cranking speed, the cranking actually didn't seem slow, it was nearly as fast as it usually cranks but yes, it was slower.

[Real1shepherd]

Andy....your battery was toast. They do all sorts of weird things as the plates bulge and short out...including recharge and work for awhile.

I'd like to see everyone do what I did, but you can lead a horse to water.....

You can't beat going down to your local John Deere dealership and buying the big, tractor battery:TY25224. It's dry cell charged, which means it hasn't been kept on a charger to sell and therefore given some of its life up; they will add the acid for the first time & charge. Virgin battery...you can't get better than that. Plates are set in epoxy top & bottom because it's for off-road service and it FITS exactly in the MB compartment....no room to spare though.

I'll put this battery against any other..Optimus...you name it. Was it cheap, no...but you're going to get double the life of other current batteries....much like the original MB battery which was a good one as well.

Kevin

[sbaert]

Another good alternative is the Bosch group49 battery, available @ Pep Boys for $100.

It's got 1000 cranking amps and comes with a 3 year replacement, 8 year prorated warranty.

I use them in 2 of my 3 W124s and they've never hiccupped once.

[Real1shepherd]

Originally Posted by sbaert

Another good alternative is the Bosch group49 battery, available @ Pep Boys for $100.

It's got 1000 cranking amps and comes with a 3 year replacement, 8 year prorated warranty.

I use them in 2 of my 3 W124s and they've never hiccupped once.

Trust me on this...the John Deere group 49 battery will kick your Pep Boys Bosh battery into the next county and it's $153.99 less $15 if you bring in a core.

Kevin

[sbaert]

I'll definitely keep the John Deere battery option in mind as the battery in W124 #3 (Interstate battery) is on its last legs.

I do like the fact that the John Deere battery is delivered "dry" & charged.

Is it a true group 49 size and does the stock battery hold down clamp still attach properly???

A picture would be worth a thousand words.

[neanderthal]

Some clarification here.

How long any product lasts depends on how it is used, how it is stored, where it is used.
Tires. Batteries. Shoes. Clothes. Computers. Watches. Anything.

Anyway, a vehicle that is started often and only driven short trips will have a failed battery sooner. Drive two miles, drop off the kids at your moms, go to the post office, stop by the gym, go to Starbucks, then go to work. If you stop the car and start it at each of those stops, but drive less than two miles each time, you are using a lot of power to start the car, but not giving the alternator enough time to recharge the battery on the subsequent drive. Simple.

Same with tires. Accelerating, braking, turning all wear out the tires. Even if you drive well. Hard driving, lots of city driving, driving in the hills and canyons, NOT MAINTAINING THE VEHICLE, all deleteriously affect tire life.

I'm fortunate that my shortest trip is about 3 miles. Most of my trips (work, rugby, etc) are generally longer so that usually means my batteries last a long time. The Optima in my 2.6 only died because of a dead over voltage regulator. It still started the car with more vigor than the regular lead acid battery that replaced it.

[Real1shepherd]

Originally Posted by sbaert

I'll definitely keep the John Deere battery option in mind as the battery in W124 #3 (Interstate battery) is on its last legs.

I do like the fact that the John Deere battery is delivered "dry" & charged.

Is it a true group 49 size and does the stock battery hold down clamp still attach properly???

A picture would be worth a thousand words.

Yes it is and it's as I said a off-road rated tractor battery. As for your Bosh, I've heard some people complain about failure...the very same battery you bought. Granted, the warranty is fine, but you don't get money back for replacing or the aggravation. I used to put AutoZone "lifetime warranty" starters in my work truck. But every three yrs or so I was replacing them...what's the warranty worth....nothing if I have to do that.

It would have been better to ask me for pics before I installed it...limited to what you can see now. Because it's a true tractor battery, you have to attach a tubing to the vent (left corner of pic) and run something like I did....I went into a windshield drain. Hopefully, you can make out the hold-down clamp.