1967 W111 "Update rebuild" - Mercedes-Benz Forum

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post #1 of 27 (permalink) Old 04-12-2014, 01:25 PM Thread Starter
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Exclamation 1967 W111 "Update rebuild"

Hi, this is my first post so I am hoping that I am getting this right!

I live in South Africa and own a 1967 W111 230S bought new by my grandpa. I am now 44 years old and have known this car all my life and have a very deep connection with and sentiment in the car. The body and interior is in top condition, the car only did 65K miles but the engine, electrics and suspension all needs repair. These cars are not cheap to repair here in South Africa and this particular model not very popular either and I certainly would not consider rebuilding this vehicle if it did not have the history behind it.

I have taken a decision (which I am sure a lot of purists are going to hate) to rebuild the car but to update it as is popular in the USA i.e. fitting new engine, transmission and suspension to vintage cars. "Hot rod" style

I definitely want a Mercedes engine, we get various model engines with low mileage imported from Japan at very good prices and there are numerous companies locally producing aftermarket EFI systems, which is good for the project.

My question is one I am sure people have asked before ... which engine?! I am thinking V8 but have this really weird inclination to fit the M120 V12. Does anyone know if the engine bay is large enough?

I am not worried about electronics and other systems, aftermarket EFI can deal with that and transmission would be 4L80E six speed automatic. Suspension and brakes would be Corvette C4 front and rear. I am quite capable of building new subframes front ans rear and doing the rest of the transplant...

Any thoughts other than "Crazy!"?
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post #2 of 27 (permalink) Old 04-12-2014, 02:29 PM
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If you're going to use Corvette tranny and rear end, why not use a Corvette motor as well?
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post #3 of 27 (permalink) Old 04-12-2014, 02:48 PM
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Sounds like a great idea! I have similar plans for a W111 coupe - cut out the entire floor pan and inner guards, have something like an Art Morrison chassis with modern suspension, and make new floors and support to mate the two together. I have an engine and trans from a 2000 E55 AMG (M113), though I don't know how to make the trans work and was thinking of trying to mate the engine up to a Tremec. I think the M113 was a mistake though, as visually I love the look of the M119 with those hemi style heads. Would put ITB's on it.

A mate was pushing me towards the M120 also but there are certainly not many around over here and they cost quite a bit - having said that, I just checked gumtree and found one for $6000. If you can make new subframes then you can make new inner guards so the engine will fit?

I look forward to seeing your progress. My projects are all on the backburner for now as work is flat out again. I still haven't even got all the bugs out of my 450 powered finnie.
Cheers,
Drew
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post #4 of 27 (permalink) Old 04-13-2014, 02:42 AM Thread Starter
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Hi guys, thanks for the feedback. I am hoping to get a lot of feedback like yours that will make me think in order to keep my thoughts on track and help with the project. In short order: The corvette engines are really expensive in South Africa. I can get the low mileage M120 V12 for the equivalent of US$ 2,100 from an importer. I also kind of fancy the idea that there is a Benz motor under the hood and the V12 has its obvious charms. This not being a daily driver I do not really care about fuel consumption :-)
I intend taking the two plenum chambers off and making up a corvette style single plenum with a single throttle body to the front of the car. Yes, a lot of fabrication but that's half the reason I am doing the build!
I have not thought about drew56cus' idea of cutting out the chassis/floor and putting the car on a new chassis altogether. Interesting idea. I was going to make up a hybrid corvette suspension based on the Chassisworks Lamborghini kit car plans I bought on e-bay some time ago. These are the best chassis plans I have ever come across with incredible detail. Yes, I know that the Lambo is a mid engined layout but my plan was to use the uprights and suspension arms from that and adapt that to sub frames that can bolt into my W111. This should give me more space to fit the engine up front as the original sub frame will just not allow this. The Chassisworks plans uses Corvette suspension and brake components which should take the punishment form the V12.
Anyways, these are only ideas at this stage and I am open to better suggestions. One way or another I am building this baby! My Achilles heel at the moment is WORK ... same as yours Drew. By the way, I Luuuuuuv your 220SE sedan :-)
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post #5 of 27 (permalink) Old 04-13-2014, 06:23 AM
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You guys are amazing. I just bought a 1971 250 and while trying to get it home I found that the shifter linkage is disconnected and hanging and the carburetor linkage is missing. That seems like a challenge to me and you guys intend to create whole new subframes. WOW.
Maybe after reading your progress I will feel like replacing the rusty floors in my 1978 450SLC 5.0 is manageable.
I look forward to watching your journey.
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post #6 of 27 (permalink) Old 04-13-2014, 09:01 AM
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Originally Posted by dgosh28 View Post
You guys are amazing. I just bought a 1971 250 and while trying to get it home I found that the shifter linkage is disconnected and hanging and the carburetor linkage is missing. That seems like a challenge to me and you guys intend to create whole new subframes. .
My observation is that there are more unfinished transplant projects than finished ones... What the OP wants to do is complicated and expensive. I had a 67 W108 without engine because seller wanted to put in a V8 and gave up half way through the project. I bought a 1968 W108 for the engine/transmission and eventually finished the project of putting it back to normal.

My understanding is that easy engine swaps into fintails are later 4 and 6 cylinder engines, and that anything else is kind of a big bucks long time attempt.

Currently: 1967 250 SL, 1963 220Sb, 1965 300SE Lang, 1971 280SE parts car, 1972 Alfa GTV, 1965 Alfa Duetto, 1993 BMW R100R
Past: 1971 250 C, 1985 300 TD, 1967 250 S, 1968 280 S,1981 300 D, 1982 280CE, 3 Facel Vegas, Borgward Isabella Coupe, Alfa 2600 Sprint, Volvo P1900 (yes), numerous less interesting Volvos, ...
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post #7 of 27 (permalink) Old 04-13-2014, 09:03 AM
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Originally Posted by MJ Strydom View Post
Any thoughts other than "Crazy!"?
I have a couple of thoughts but it all really depends on a couple of questions:

1. What is your budget for this?
2. DIY or send it out?
3. Do you have lots of indoor long-term work space if DIY?

Scott

Currently: 1967 250 SL, 1963 220Sb, 1965 300SE Lang, 1971 280SE parts car, 1972 Alfa GTV, 1965 Alfa Duetto, 1993 BMW R100R
Past: 1971 250 C, 1985 300 TD, 1967 250 S, 1968 280 S,1981 300 D, 1982 280CE, 3 Facel Vegas, Borgward Isabella Coupe, Alfa 2600 Sprint, Volvo P1900 (yes), numerous less interesting Volvos, ...
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post #8 of 27 (permalink) Old 04-13-2014, 09:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ Strydom View Post
Hi guys, thanks for the feedback. I am hoping to get a lot of feedback like yours that will make me think in order to keep my thoughts on track and help with the project. In short order: The corvette engines are really expensive in South Africa. I can get the low mileage M120 V12 for the equivalent of US$ 2,100 from an importer. I also kind of fancy the idea that there is a Benz motor under the hood and the V12 has its obvious charms.
There's probably a reason why the 'Vette motors are pricey, while an M120 (lovingly referred to in some circles as The Great Dripsy) can be had for a relative bargain.

Felicita e un bicchiere di vino con un panino.
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post #9 of 27 (permalink) Old 04-13-2014, 11:50 AM
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The only reasonable engine replacement would be an OM617 turbo diesel. lol. Maintenance shouldn't be a problem on that.

Currently: 1967 250 SL, 1963 220Sb, 1965 300SE Lang, 1971 280SE parts car, 1972 Alfa GTV, 1965 Alfa Duetto, 1993 BMW R100R
Past: 1971 250 C, 1985 300 TD, 1967 250 S, 1968 280 S,1981 300 D, 1982 280CE, 3 Facel Vegas, Borgward Isabella Coupe, Alfa 2600 Sprint, Volvo P1900 (yes), numerous less interesting Volvos, ...
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post #10 of 27 (permalink) Old 04-13-2014, 04:47 PM
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I recommend one of these, you will need to rework the inner fender guards a bit for good access.

1936 Fairbanks Morse Model 32D - YouTube

-Marrs

The Coupe Group (W111/112 coupes and cabs)official website
The Coupe Group on Facebook


"Too many people are working at jobs they hate, to buy things they don't particularly want, to impress people they don't even care about." --Dr. Deepak Chopra
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