Mercedes-Benz Forum banner

Werner Winch Rating - Self Recovery?

6K views 15 replies 9 participants last post by  tlane 
#1 ·
So in the past 12 months I've seen a few cheap hydraulic winches in the auctions and wondered if a rear winch would be a good addition to the rear of my U1300L as it already has the hydraulic lines and controls run back there for the Werner A50.1 mid mount. This always leads me to wondering the following though. The mid mounted 50.1s normally seen on the fire trucks are only 5000 daN first layer pull. That's only 12,000 lbs for a 17,500 lbs truck, and that doesn't even account for the reduction in pull as the layers come off the drum. They're also generally mounted on trucks with the optioned 4 wheel park brakes. This often makes me worry that my A50.1 is for recovering other smaller vehicles, not self recovery. The flip side to this is that most of the Werner's that Truktor posted in the winch thread had similar daN ratings. Now normally with electric winches it's recommended to get a winch rated at 1.5 x the vehicle GVM. Is there something I'm missing with the way the Werner's are rated as opposed to the general electric winch recommendations? Also has anyone used the A50.1 enough to comment on it as a self-recovery winch?

Cheers,

John
 
#4 · (Edited)
FWIW I used the 20,000 lb (9.1 metric ton) rated dP hydraulic winch (model 20AJ) on the front of my U500 (about 12 metric tons) to pull a ~<15-20 ton Actros tractor-trailer out of mud in Mongolia, slight uphill. No pulley or help from wheels. The U500 has a 6.8 ton rated hydraulic Superwinch on the rear. That "small" because I figure it is easier to get stuck and unstuck with the the truck front pointing up a hill. I suppose I could have put a 30,000 lb (13.6 ton) Warn or Superwinch or dP on the front and a 20K on the rear, but looking at the size and weight of the 30Ks it would have probably been overkill.

Charlie
 
#5 ·
I think the 1.5X vehicle weight "rating" is assuming you're going to need to pull dead weight and the drag generated by that weight. Which is a good way to rate ! A U1300 grounded on the frame in clinging muck is a hell of a pull and would need a big winch.

HOWEVER......one can make do with much smaller capacity in recreational use when lives aren't on the line. Probably 95%+ of the episodes I've been involved with concerning winching required only a relatively small yank to get things moving again. Comfortable winch size depends on where and how you drive, whether you're going to be alone or in a group and how much you NEED to be 101% certain of self recovery from any situation.

Not everybody is "that guy" in the YouTube Siberian haul road video...
 
#6 ·
The Werner F64 (one of the smaller, lighter Werner's you can buy, available in PTO or Hydraulic, with or without slip clutch, few different configurations) is "only" rated at 4000kg middle layer, yet is spec'd for self recovery of everything from the 421 to the U2450L/38. (see bottom of the brochure)

Land vehicle Vehicle Motor vehicle Car Commercial vehicle
Motor vehicle Vehicle Commercial vehicle Car Transport


I've used the A50 winch on an RW1 to pull a highway tractor out of the ditch, a fully loaded Hino with bee's (I stayed in the truck, bee's were...aggravated) stuck in the ditch, tree's out of the ground, Dodge's out of the mud, and all manner of things. It will recover a fully loaded RW1 sunk up to the roof I suspect, provided the engine is still running and the hydro belt isn't slipping ;) It's slow, but powerful.





The biggest thing with that mid-mounted Werner is keeping it all clean. dirt and grit get into the middle roller guide and it can jam up, the winch is so powerful, and you can't see it, it will just destroy everything underneath before you know what's going on.

While the winch is designed for recovering other objects in a fire truck roll, it will work for self recovery, again, if kept maintained, tested, and clean. Personally after owning one (and I loved it), I prefer the front and rear mounted winch solution (two is one, one is none). The front winch is easier to see what's going on if there's issues (cable piling up, etc) and the rear winch I can see out of the rear window if needed but I operate it mostly from the rear of the vehicle doing recoveries.

Also it's not designed to pull backwards. So I would do as you say, mount a rear hydraulic winch for self recovery from the rear. I've used the Superwinch H15P a few times now, and short on power it is not! You'd probably want a bit smaller winch just due to the H15P's physical size and limited mounting locations in the rear.
 
#7 ·
...I have the F64 on the DoKa and I can attest it will self-recover the truck with minimal effort. Add a snatch block and you're pulling with the big boys - you have to be careful with it. I also know from experience that it will stand the DoKa on it's nose when recovering 'other things' :)

A unloaded 416 DoKa weighs in (at least mine does) at a hair under 10,000 lbs (4500 kg) so the F64 meets the 1.5X 'rule" on that truck without a load (on the 1st wrap).
 
#9 ·
Thanks for all the post's guys. The F64/38 being mounted on so many round cabs was part of the reason I wondered about the whole rating thing. I'll keep an eye out for a "small" rear hydraulic winch then. I was actually watching some Superwinch H15Ps in the auctions thinking they would be physically an ok size for the rear. I'll need to check the dimensions. Also it sounds like I'll need to give the Werner I have some love before using it too.
 
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top