Ok I need opinions - Benzworld.org - Mercedes-Benz Discussion Forum

cygnusceo · 11-14-2009, 09:13 AM

I have to make a decision on Monday of which direction I am going to go with this car. The front of the car is completely off so anything is possible now.

Note: I would like to get this car running before Christmas.

Option 1: Raise the AMG motor that is in the car and try and replace the timing cover. Not knowing what other gremlins exist in the motor. So this has a chance of being Pandora's Box.

Option 2: Grab a Local 113.961 motor with high miles and pull the AMG motor out. Leave the transmission in place and simply bolt up the replacement motor.

Option 3: Grab a Local 5.5L AMG motor 113.941 w/ tranny 50K and do a complete swap. This motor is out of a 2003 CLK so other than oil pan it should work.

With Option 2 & 3 I would totally rebuild the current AMG motor/tranny and then put it in another project car I have going.

Please speak up I am to close to the trees to see the forest.

Thanks

Jeff

camdeck · 11-14-2009, 12:26 PM

Perhaps you might be able to add some background regarding what brought you to this point and what your goals are? You did state that "running by Xmas" was one goal. What was wrong with the car that led up to this?

drags1998 · 11-14-2009, 12:30 PM

Sorry, without knowing more facts of this car, What happened to the t-cover? Being us up to speed and maybe we can help!!!

cygnusceo · 11-14-2009, 12:52 PM

The car was damaged on the front end when driven under the back of a truck. The radiator back to the water pump were destroyed. The basic motor is fine from what I can tell on a physical inspection, but I suspect there are problems within.

I did not wreck the car it was wrecked at a local drag strip when it was lost by a stupid kid in a race for pinks. He got pissed and rammed it under his truck. I picked up the car for a steal of a price so it was a good investment for me.

There was no structural damage as the trucks bumper went over the top of the car's bumper. It took out the hood, headlight frames and did some minor damage to 1 fender.

After I got the car and took off all the damage I also found a hidden blue baby bottle (NOS). This leads me to think the motor is probably a bit tweaked and could harbor other hidden issues that are invisible. the ECU reveals no major issues, but instinct tells me 'Danger Will Robinson'.

I decided that it would be in my best interest to deal this Pandora's Box now rather than later. But that is a long process and I really don't want to rush a rebuild on the motor as I prefer to do all my own mill work.

So therefore I can either band-aid the motor (Option 1) and pray. Or Replace the motor with another high miles motor while I rebuild (Option 2). Or replace with a newer 5.5L AMG vs this older Renntech 6.0L AMG (Option 3).

So that is the history...

Jeff

drags1998 · 11-14-2009, 01:08 PM

Before you yank the OE engine, I would pull the broken parts off the front of the engine and look things over. These engines are "BULLIT PRUF!!!!!!!!!!! unless someone got REALLY STUPID with NOS you should be fine!!! Why buy another engine? Its just another unknown added to the mix. This is what 40yrs of toying w/cars tells Me!!!! Good Luck!!!

camdeck · 11-14-2009, 01:09 PM

Your question is now very clear and also very valid. It would be nice to keep the engine and car together but you also want to wrap the project up by Xmas. It depends on your confidence level in those other engine options as one would be accepting whatever unknown issues they may or may not harbor. The best choice of rebuilding the existing engine you have ruled out due to time considerations. You indeed face a difficult choice between two less than perfect paths. Good luck in your selection. I think I'll vote toward rolling the dice on the existing engine, assuming you won't have the time to rebuild it before Xmas.

cygnusceo · 11-14-2009, 01:37 PM

I agree with these engines being bullet proof. But here is the issue...

To replace the timing cover basically means taking the engine pretty much down to a short block. (e.g. Remove the following)
1. Valve Covers
2. Water Pump
3. A/C
4. Generator
5. Lower Oil Pan
6. Upper Oil Pan
7. Tensioners
8. Head bolts that bolt into the timing cover (means you might as well pull the heads as the odds of not damaging the head gaskets are not good)

in addition I would have to replace the following pieces that were damaged in the crash

1. Air Pump
2. Fan Clutch / Water Pump
3. Power Steering Pump Reservoir
4. Lots of missing bolts

To get the upper oil pan I have to lift the motor out of the car, so have to disconnect most of what holds it in. Mounts, Exhaust, Harness

Agreed the 5.5L 50K AMG motor does not mean it is a guarantee, but not sure.

I guess if the timing cover was a bit less difficult to get into I would be thinking of just repairing it. It has 3 Major issues.

1. Air Pump Mount Destroyed
2. Power Steering Reservoir Mounting Tab Broken Off
3. Someone TIG'd 2 extra Water Jackets into it right next to the Power Steering Pump (No Idea Why).

I realize I could remote mount an Air Pump and plumb it into the system. Not really sure what I would do about the Reservoir as I see no way to attach a remote Reservoir to the Pump. It is a smooth O-Ring style fitting so I would have to thread it, and use some kind of Braided Line and gravity feed.

As for the Extra Water Jackets I could plumb them into the a loop to basically remove them from the system.

Thoughts?

Jeff

camdeck · 11-14-2009, 02:14 PM

"Someone TIG'd 2 extra Water Jackets into it "

With the addition of the above information as well as the helpful photo you have provided, the debate has now been re-framed into:

a) Go forward with a semi-bastardized engine with unknown crash related damage OR

b) Swap out to another unknown engine that is factory standard and no known major problems.

Option "A" would work if you had more time to complete the project.

Option "B" would be best given your tight timeline.

The above assumes that you have exhausted all avenues regarding extending your timeline beyond Xmas.

Note: I have much less mechanical experience than you judging by the options that you are considering.

cygnusceo · 11-14-2009, 02:26 PM

LOL...

Yeah the picture is enough to scare a nun into being a succubus.

The motor will fire and run, so that is a plus.

I guess the option of mounting the Air Pump remote would work. The part I am less confident with is the Steering Pump situation. I could mill up some type of bracket to kind of put the reservoir back in the original spot. But I can't even find a damaged reservoir to try out this idea.

As for the water jackets it is a total WTF was this dude thinking... Supercharger or Turbo maybe...

So if anyone has any thoughts on the reservoir now would be a good time to speak up.

Thanks...

Jeff

camdeck · 11-14-2009, 02:36 PM

One thing to add, you did not specify what your plans are for the vehicle at Xmas, just the presence of a time deadline.
Are you planning to resell the vehicle around the Xmas time frame?
Give it to a family member?
Keep it for personal use?
Race it?
I think those are relevant questions pertaining to the best course of action.