M119 SL Performance Modifications

[NEOKEN]

[Chicky]

Originally Posted by NEOKEN

Me too.



Nope. Not yet but we are working on it.

Based on this and your other post I think I have an idea of what you have in mind.
Are you thinking about converting your M119 engine to 6.0L of displacement?

I am not saying it cannot be done but man I don't think its going to be cheap.
Please correct me I am wrong.
However It sure would be amazing to see this one pull through!

Good Luck!

Happy New Year Neoken,

I've just about completed a major project with my SL, a complete strip down of the car + repaint to silver + detailing of suspension, brakes + installation of a stainless steel exhaust system (headers included). The re-assembly would be done in about 2 weeks, and will post pictures after.

You're correct, with regards to the engine project. However, I'm just thinking of how best to go thru it, am trying to source an old M117 and a M119 engine assemblies, so I wouldn't have to experiment with my perfectly good engine. I have most of the internal new parts for the M119, except for the pistons, con-rods, and I plan to work on a M117 crank. Found a supplier for "fast road cams" in Europe. As for the con-rods and pistons, am contemplating after market suppliers, just haven't gotten around talking details with them.

As far as costs are concerned, I know that it would be expensive, more so with alternatives like forced induction...just that I like the normally aspirated route and the look of the stock engine compartment, personally. Still, so many things to consider, before delving into it, or shelving it all together.

[msbarsi]

Originally Posted by NEOKEN

you are teasing me big time. As I am viewing these photos it really makes me want to remove the heads from my own motor. lol.

Lol Ken be a good guy and wait for some good weather before opening the top... of your engine.

Are you thinking about building a NEOKEN 6.0L M119 prototype?
I see it coming lol.

Cheers.

[Chicky]

Originally Posted by NEOKEN

Visually looking at the photos provided the intake valves seats are extremely close to maximum diameter as you can clearly see the intake valves are already very close to the center-line of the combustion chamber. I would not recommend going any larger on the intake valves (on the 6.0L heads in the photos). There is very, very thin margin left for play on increasing the intake valve seat cut diameter vs. the exhaust valves seats which has much more room for play of course.

Thank you for posting the nice photos by the way Chicky. However you are teasing me big time. As I am viewing these photos it really makes me want to remove the heads from my own motor. lol.

Hi Ken,

Hahaha, before you do...supposedly, the intake valves used on the E60 heads have AMG part #'s, which might mean slightly bigger than the standard intake valves that we have. I read this data from the M119 forum of 500Eboard, by "gsxr". And also a very important data is that the upper intake manifold is also an AMG part #. Now coupling this with your ported heads and TB...we might just end up with a more powerful 6.0 M119, if we use also the headers + big bore exhaust system.

I'm still waiting for the reply of Adrian/Elring on the head gaskets for the 6.0 M119 and that of CP Pistons for the 100mm pistons. Would you happen to have data on the 6.0 connecting rods, like rod lenght and piston pin diameter?

[NEOKEN]

Originally Posted by Chicky

Hi Ken,

Hahaha, before you do...supposedly, the intake valves used on the E60 heads have AMG part #'s, which might mean slightly bigger than the standard intake valves that we have. I read this data from the M119 forum of 500Eboard, by "gsxr". And also a very important data is that the upper intake manifold is also an AMG part #. Now coupling this with your ported heads and TB...we might just end up with a more powerful 6.0 M119, if we use also the headers + big bore exhaust system.

Excellent information Chicky. I believe I have a good idea of you intentions. I am much intrigued by the possibilities with regards to your M119 6.0L project.

Originally Posted by Chicky

I'm still waiting for the reply of Adrian/Elring on the head gaskets for the 6.0 M119 and that of CP Pistons for the 100mm pistons. Would you happen to have data on the 6.0 connecting rods, like rod lenght and piston pin diameter?

CP Pistons is a reputable manufacturer. May I also suggest that you contact JE Pistons, and Weisco Pistons as these are also reputable leaders in custom forged racing piston manufacturing industry.
JEPistons.com | Welcome to JE Pistons!
Manufacturer of High Performance Forged Pistons & Performance Parts for Motorcycles, ATVs, Snowmobiles, Marine, and Automobiles - Wiseco Piston Inc.

M119 6.0L engine details and specifications are available in the German AMG SL60 manual posted in the blue sticky. Hell the gaskets alone has been a confusing matter amongst fellow members on this thread which at this point in time we have only scratched the surface on solid references relating to M119 6.0L engine parts. any additional input on the subject is greatly apprecieated from fellow members as always.

Thank you so much Chicky for sharing your impressive findings as they are much appreciated!
Please keep us posted with your progresses!

[Chicky]

Hi Ken,

I do agree that the M119 has a lot of potential, if engine compartment space was not a problem on the R129. There are plenty of avenues available in the search for power; normally aspirated, forced induction and the cheapest being nitrous injected.
But IMHO, the former would be best for me, as it would retain the stock look when you open the engine and as far as durablity/longevity is concerned. I will not sell this car, but plan to pass it on to any of my kids that are interested, and actually plan on buying in the future a R107, R113 and a R230...not necessarily in that order. In fact I'm prepared for this projects as I still have a lot of Tylenol Extra Strenght Tablets in stock...hahaha!

A major factor to consider in this 6.0 project would be the monetary cost, but for the moment, I am trying to come up with near accurate figures for this project, and this can only be done thru requests for quotations from the different suppliers. With regards to info on the project, I've only bogged down on the con-rod lenght and fuel delivery for WOT. The head gasket was not really a problem as I told Adrian/Elring, they just have to use as a pattern the gaskets for the standard M119 but with a bore of 102mm (repair size as per german manual). For the pistons, just have to follow the manual again, but with 100mm diameter. Use of the M117 crank, but with machined counterweights and rebalanced. Camshafts by DBilas, but I'm at the moment verifying if the valve train geometry will be altered due to their regrinding of stock camshafts, as compared to the use of new billets. Custom valves can be ordered cheaply, with gas flowed ported and extrude-a hone heads and intake manifolds. Thermo-coatings are common and cheap. I also understand that this project will take TIME and lots of patience.

I'm about to finish a major project that I undertook with my car, which was 2 years in the planning and implementation + a lot of stupid money...but let me assure you that it gave me a lot of joy seeing the results...would you like me to tease you again, with pictures?

[msbarsi]

Originally Posted by NEOKEN

msbarsi.

Hmm.. NEOKEN 6.0L M119 prototype? On "my" old 95?
I will keep you posted when I win the lottery.
Trust me you will be the first to know.

Best Regards.

LOl I know I know Ken that I will be the first one to know but I have a feeling that this idea is already running in your veins.
I understand that a ton of money in needed to accomplish this big task and to achieve more power I wouldn't touch nitro stuff because I don't like the idea and I don't have a Toyota Supra but a Mercedes but a couple of small Turbos (small turbo=little turbo lag) have always tickled my mind I confess.
Am I ready for the mad house?

More, at the end of the week if everything goes like it should I'll have a dinner with a couple of guys from the dealership and ask them if they have ever worked on an AMG M119 and see what they know and can suggest. As usual I still prefer first hand experience than what the book say whatever the book is.
If I find any useful infos I'll keep post them straight away.

Cheers.

[NEOKEN]

Originally Posted by msbarsi

More, at the end of the week if everything goes like it should I'll have a dinner with a couple of guys from the dealership and ask them if they have ever worked on an AMG M119 and see what they know and can suggest. As usual I still prefer first hand experience than what the book say whatever the book is. If I find any useful infos I'll keep post them straight away.

Cheers.

Thanks in advance Mick!
Good luck with the dinner arangements with your Mercedes specialists!

[msbarsi]

Originally Posted by NEOKEN

Thanks in advance Mick!
Good luck with the dinner arangements with your Mercedes specialists!

Thanks Ken I know it will end up good because they are good guys and are the actual guys that take care of my CL 500 at the dealership and are young guys: one is the chief of the workshop and the other is the head diagnostic chap.
The dinner will be on me since I owe them a HUGE favour and guess where we will be going to eat eheh.
The only hint is that I have my chopsticks ready lol.

Anyway back to the topic, as I told you I will ask them about the AMG M119 and see what I can find out.
If we are lucky enough we could also have more first hand infos about the parts. I can't rpomise tho.

Cheers.

[Chicky]

Originally Posted by djblu

if i am seeing correctly no one bid on the baby. U can always contact the member and work a deal.

Thanks djblu,

Will try that. BTW, I'm having headers made for my car, in stainless steel. I'm goin to post pictures later, as the left side is nearly done, and they're still working on the right side