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post #21 of 34 (permalink) Old 06-09-2009, 05:36 PM
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OK Dave, I've got the beer. Uh, what was this post about anyway?

Bear knows.
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post #22 of 34 (permalink) Old 06-09-2009, 05:42 PM
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There was no justification for flushing the economy down the toilet in the first place, there was no justification for the Bush bailout, and there is no justification for the Obama bailout. Those who failed should suffer the consequence of that failure. Those who had stuffed their mattresses with money, should reap the rewards of that decision.
Any one of us could have done just as bad as both the 0 and GW admins. Words cannot begin to describe my disappointment with both sides of the aisle in Congress when it comes to oversight and action. I expect better.

All of us collectively as Americans should maintain a stance against this type of failure to lead.
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post #23 of 34 (permalink) Old 06-09-2009, 05:42 PM
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Originally Posted by GermanStar View Post
There was no justification for flushing the economy down the toilet in the first place, there was no justification for the Bush bailout, and there is no justification for the Obama bailout. Those who failed should suffer the consequence of that failure. Those who had stuffed their mattresses with money, should reap the rewards of that decision.

Does McBear know this?
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post #24 of 34 (permalink) Old 06-09-2009, 05:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Stuantle View Post
Any one of us could have done just as bad as both the 0 and GW admins. Words cannot begin to describe my disappointment with both sides of the aisle in Congress when it comes to oversight and action. I expect better.

All of us collectively as Americans should maintain a stance against this type of failure to lead.
Where were those well-chosen words when the Bush admin acted in collusion with Congress to bankrupt our nation for 6 long veto-less years.

I am no fan of Obama's domestic policy, but do hold him in somewhat higher esteem than his predecessor, based on the situation each was handed as they assumed office.

But you're right -- the fault is ours as Americans. We have low expectations in regard to our elected officials, and they rarely seem to disappoint. Until we demand better, we will not get better.

"If spending money you don't have is the height of stupidity, borrowing money to give it away is the height of insanity." -- anon
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post #25 of 34 (permalink) Old 06-09-2009, 06:03 PM
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I'd start some popcorn if I thought the red corner would stick around for a real discussion....
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OK Dave, I've got the beer. Uh, what was this post about anyway?
Thank you. That was much of my point.

McBear,
Kentucky

Being smart is knowing the difference, in a sticky situation between a well delivered anecdote and a well delivered antidote - bear.
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post #26 of 34 (permalink) Old 06-09-2009, 06:04 PM
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As usual, you missed the point. What else is new.


Oh, and I am not an accountant. Never claimed to be.
Here's a comment made by Owebama today regarding "Paygo:" "In order to spend a dollar, we will have to save a dollar".

You should be able to evaluate that statement for the bullshit it is. Give it a try. Caution: protect your face if you fall.

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post #27 of 34 (permalink) Old 06-09-2009, 06:14 PM
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Originally Posted by Stuantle View Post
Any one of us could have done just as bad as both the 0 and GW admins. Words cannot begin to describe my disappointment with both sides of the aisle in Congress when it comes to oversight and action. I expect better.

All of us collectively as Americans should maintain a stance against this type of failure to lead.
So, let's make this thread about something substantive. You bring up a very good point.

Question to everyone on the board. Look at your cell phone and your email contact address books.

First: Do you have both of your Senators and your Congressman's phone number in your cell phone [both their local number and their Washington number] and do you have their email addresses in your contact address book?

Second: Do you have the NAME, phone number and email address of an Administrative Assistant or Congressional Aide that you can contact when you want to be sure to get through, someone that you talk to REGULARLY?

THIRD: How many phone calls have you made to each of your representatives in the past six months, both to bitch and to approve of their actions? How many email have you sent with the same things [form letters, petitions don't count]?

FOURTH: How many Letters to the Editor, to your local newspaper, national magazines or national newspapers have you written in the past year? Comments on Faux or CNN stories don't count as they are not read]. How many have been PUBLISHED?

On questions 1-3, if the answer is under 25, you are just whining...or secretly satisfied. To question 4, 25 for the first part, 3-5 for the second part if the letters are well structured, actually make a point and your thoughts sound cohesive.

McBear,
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post #28 of 34 (permalink) Old 06-09-2009, 06:16 PM
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Here's a comment made by Owebama today regarding "Paygo:" "In order to spend a dollar, we will have to save a dollar".

You should be able to evaluate that statement for the bullshit it is. Give it a try. Caution: protect your face if you fall.
Let's wander over and take a look at it in context and I will get back with you. I don't play parsing games.

Let's start with the CORRECT QUOTE: “Perhaps that's why, here in Washington, it has been so elusive. The ‘pay as you go rule’ is very simple. Congress can only spend a dollar if it saves a dollar elsewhere.”

McBear,
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post #29 of 34 (permalink) Old 06-09-2009, 06:27 PM
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Now, let's look at the whole speech.



Thank you all for joining us here at the White House. Before I begin, I want to comment briefly on the announcement by the Treasury Department with regard to the Financial Stability Plan.

As you know, through this plan and its predecessor, taxpayer dollars were used to stabilize the financial system at a time of extraordinary stress. These funds were also meant to be investments--and were meant to be temporary. That is why this morning's announcement is important. Several financial institutions are set to pay back $68 billion to taxpayers. And while we know that we will not escape the worst financial crisis in decades without losses to the taxpayers, it is worth noting that in the first round of repayments from these companies, the government has actually turned a profit.

This is not a sign that our troubles are over; far from it. The financial crisis this administration inherited is still creating painful challenges for businesses and families alike. But it is a positive sign. We are seeing an initial return on a few of these investments. We're restoring funds to the Treasury where they will be available to safeguard against continuing risks to financial stability. And as this money is returned, we'll see our national debt lessened by $68 billion--billions of dollars that this generation will not have to borrow and future generations will not have to repay.

I've said repeatedly that I have no interest in managing these banks--or running auto companies or other private institutions, for that matter. So today's announcement is welcome news. But I also want to say: the return of these funds does not provide forgiveness for past excesses or permission for future misdeeds. It is critical that as our country emerges from this period of crisis, that we learn its lessons; that those who seek reward do not take reckless risk; that short-term gains are not pursued without regard for long-term consequences.

At the same time, as we seek greater responsibility from those in the private sector, it is my view--and the view of those here today--that greater responsibility is required on the part of those who serve the public as well.

As a nation, we have several imperatives at this difficult moment in our history. We are confronting the worst recession this country has faced in generations. This has required extraordinary investments in the short-term. Another imperative is addressing long-deferred priorities--health care, energy, education--which threaten the American economy and the well-being of American families. We have begun to tackle these problems as well.

But we are also called upon to rein in deficits by addressing these and other challenges in a manner that is fiscally responsible.

This in part requires the kind of line-by line-review of the budget that is ongoing to remove things that we don't need, and make the programs we do need work more efficiently. There are billions to be saved this way. But much of our effort will entail going after the big ticket items that drive the deficits.

By ending unnecessary no-bid contracts and reforming the way government contracts are awarded, we can save the American people up to $40 billion each year. In addition, Secretary Gates has proposed a badly-needed overhaul of a defense contracting system riddled with hundreds of billions of dollars in cost overruns, and the cancelation of superfluous defense systems unnecessary to combat the threats of the 21st century.

We're also going to eliminate unwarranted subsidies currently lavished on health insurance companies through Medicare, which will save roughly $177 billion over the next decade. And this is part of broader health reform, about which I will have more to say in the coming days, which will both cut costs and improve care.

All told, in the next four years, the deficit will be cut in half. Over the next decade, non-defense discretionary spending will reach its lowest level, as a share of our national income, since we began keeping records in 1962.

But we must go further, and one important step we can and must take is restoring the so-called "pay as you go" rule. This is a rule I championed in the Senate and called for time and again on the campaign trail. Today, with the support of these legislators, my administration is submitting to Congress a proposal to codify this rule in law--and I hope that the House and Senate will act quickly to pass it.

The "pay as you go" principle is very simple. Congress can only spend a dollar if it saves a dollar elsewhere. This principle guides responsible families managing a budget. And it is no coincidence that this rule was in place when we moved from record deficits to record surpluses in the 1990s--and that when this rule was abandoned, we returned to record deficits that doubled the national debt. Entitlement increases and tax cuts need to be paid for. They are not free, and borrowing to finance them is not a sustainable long-term policy.

Paying for what you spend is basic common sense. Perhaps that's why, here in Washington, it has been so elusive.

Of course, there have been those in Washington leading the charge to restore "pay as you go." Many of them are here. I want to recognize Congressman George Miller, who introduced the first PAYGO bill in the House. I also want to thank the House Blue Dogs and their leaders, especially Baron Hill, who has been a driving force in favor of PAYGO. Finally, I want to acknowledge Senator Claire McCaskill, who has shown real leadership on this issue in the Senate.

In fact, two years ago, a new Democratic Congress put in place congressional rules to restore this principle, but could not pass legislation without the support of the administration. Now you have this support.

The fact is, there are few who aren't distressed by deficits. It's a concern that crosses party lines, geographic boundaries, and ideological divides. But often, in the give and take of the political process, the vested interests of the few overtake the broader interests of the many. The debate of the day drowns out those who speak of what we may face tomorrow. That is why "pay as you go" is essential. It requires Congress to navigate the ebb and flow of politics while remaining fixed on that fiscal horizon.

The reckless fiscal policies of the past have left us in a very deep hole. Digging our way out will take time, and patience, and tough choices. And I know that in the face of this historic challenge, there are many across this country skeptical of our collective ability to meet it. They're not wrong to feel that way. They're not wrong to draw this lesson after years in which we have put off difficult decisions; in which we have allowed our politics to grow smaller as our challenges grew ever more daunting.

But this is an extraordinary moment, one in which we are called upon not just to restore fiscal responsibility, but to once again live up to the broader responsibilities we have to one another. And I know that we can summon that sense of shared obligation; that we have the capacity to change, and to grow, and to solve even the toughest of problems.

That is at the heart of why we are here. And I appreciate the work of the folks in this room who have shown a willingness to make the hard choices and do the hard work essential to overcoming the challenges of the present, while leaving our nation better off in the future.

Thank you.

McBear,
Kentucky

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post #30 of 34 (permalink) Old 06-09-2009, 06:42 PM
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Let's wander over and take a look at it in context and I will get back with you. I don't play parsing games.

Let's start with the CORRECT QUOTE: “Perhaps that's why, here in Washington, it has been so elusive. The ‘pay as you go rule’ is very simple. Congress can only spend a dollar if it saves a dollar elsewhere.”
Nice try at filling the room with smoke. I don't know how you can evaluate that stupid quote without some knowledge of accounting and taxation, but Owebama just announced a major policy change he's pushing onto Congress.

So far you are just wandering around.

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