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post #21 of 61 (permalink) Old 05-21-2009, 05:35 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Shane View Post
I'm not ignoring your plight Drew, it is just that it could be so many things, that I don't want to lead you off on several wild goose chases. Hopefully it is the fuel pump, but somehow I doubt it.
I too doubt it. Don't worry I have been led in a wild goose chase already by posting in the W201. Everything they suggested has not helped yet I stated right from the get go that please give a solution only if you know what you're talking about.

Anyway, on my way home a half hour ago after leaving Johns Hopkins graduation ceremony and getting stuck in a stop and go traffic with the 560SEL that I could not bleed its brakes for the life of me I now have come to a decision: I am going to break and take both cars to the dealer. Shane, can you please recommend a lube. I am probably going to need a tub of that stuff
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post #22 of 61 (permalink) Old 05-21-2009, 06:03 PM
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Have you gone this far into the process?

Motive Products

A good power bleeder might be cheaper than a good can of lube.

It WILL be cheaper than a trip to the dealer.

Depending on your time available, level of mechanical experience, and fullness of the wallet, of course. Standard disclaimers apply.

Good Luck,
Scott
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post #23 of 61 (permalink) Old 05-21-2009, 06:17 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by RadioTek View Post
Have you gone this far into the process?

Motive Products

A good power bleeder might be cheaper than a good can of lube.

It WILL be cheaper than a trip to the dealer.

Depending on your time available, level of mechanical experience, and fullness of the wallet, of course. Standard disclaimers apply.

Good Luck,
Scott
Yes and yes to the nth time! I am done with the biotch... Do you want a power bleeder? Pay shipping and it's yours
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post #24 of 61 (permalink) Old 05-21-2009, 06:31 PM
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Originally Posted by drewprof View Post
I too doubt it. Don't worry I have been led in a wild goose chase already by posting in the W201. Everything they suggested has not helped yet I stated right from the get go that please give a solution only if you know what you're talking about.

Anyway, on my way home a half hour ago after leaving Johns Hopkins graduation ceremony and getting stuck in a stop and go traffic with the 560SEL that I could not bleed its brakes for the life of me I now have come to a decision: I am going to break and take both cars to the dealer. Shane, can you please recommend a lube. I am probably going to need a tub of that stuff
Drew,

I have pretty good experience bleeding brakes and clutches on cars and motorcycles, as I have done it so many times, and always successfully. I have rebuilt many a brake caliper, and one time I even sucked the brake master cylinder dry by accident, which makes subsequent brake bleeding more difficult.

I use an extremely simple one man method. A 3-4 ft length of clear vinyl tubing of right size to tightly fit over the bleeding screw, the other end submerged in a 1/2 quart plastic bottle 1/2 full of brake fluid. I open the bleeder about 1/2 turn, pump the brake pedal about ten times, close the bleeder, then replenish the master cylinder with brake fluid. I can see air bubbles inside the tubing as the fluid is expelled from the caliper. The submerged end prevents air from being sucked into the system. I repeat this process until the brake fluid coming out of the caliper is free of air bubbles.

I had people tell me that you cannot bleed brakes this way, and that the fluid will be sucked back into the system when the brake pedal is released. BS. Works great! You never want to use a hand held vacuum pump for bleeding brakes that have air trapped inside lines or calipers. A vacuum pump is good for replacing the brake fluid only in an air free system, but even then I never use it.

If you get air inside the master cylinder, the best way to fix the problem is to disconnect the brake lines from the cylinder, use a master cylinder bleeding kit which comes with plastic screw in fittings (can buy one from a Carquest store). You screw these fittings into the line ports, attach short sections of clear tubing to them and route the tubing into the master reservoir and submerge it in the fluid. You pump the brake pedal repeatedly until fluid coming out into reservoir is free of bubbles. This is equivalent to bench bleeding of the master cylnder without removing it from the car. You always do this when installing a new master cylinder. Otherwise brake bleeding will be frustrating. It can still be done (and I have done it that way) but it takes a long time and patience.

Last edited by p100; 05-21-2009 at 06:39 PM.
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post #25 of 61 (permalink) Old 05-21-2009, 06:39 PM Thread Starter
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The brakes were fine until I replaced a caliper and jerry rigged a longer (by 2 inches) brake hose to fit a caliper that had an inlet way lower than the original which would have prevented using the existing brake hose. I was told by the parts vendor that's it's ok and that extra length will have no adverse effect.
So far, it seems that everything I have done to the cars now have to be redone by a "professional".
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post #26 of 61 (permalink) Old 05-21-2009, 06:44 PM
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Originally Posted by drewprof View Post
The brakes were fine until I replaced a caliper and jerry rigged a longer (by 2 inches) brake hose to fit a caliper that had an inlet way lower than the original which would have prevented using the existing brake hose. I was told by the parts vendor that's it's ok and that extra length will have no adverse effect.
So far, it seems that everything I have done to the cars now have to be redone by a "professional".
No, the extra length of the brake hose would have no adverse effect if the brakes were bled properly. I have a 500SEL and I think you are talking about the rear calipers. These are different on the long wheelbase 126 cars than on the short wheelbase cars. I replaced both of mine on the 500 SEL recently and first time they sent me the wrong calipers with the wrong position inlet ports. The L models use an extra piece of hard brake line and yes, it is more difficult to replace these calipers than on a short wheelbase 126, which I have done also.
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post #27 of 61 (permalink) Old 05-21-2009, 06:48 PM Thread Starter
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That's exactly it, I got the wrong part but it fits where it attaches to the wheel. As to the bleeding, I used a Motive power bleeder not a vacuum.
I also used a cup with a see through rubber hose as you described.
I have bled those brakes before without any problems. I pretty much do it yearly for almost the last ten years. It's not like I don't understand the procedure or how to use the tools, it's simply aint workin
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post #28 of 61 (permalink) Old 05-21-2009, 07:11 PM
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Originally Posted by drewprof View Post
I have a spare one but it's hallow. The other one came with the fuel pump already attached so I didn't take it out to check while installing the pump.
I will dig my spare one up that is new - I didn't realize it came with the pump and ordered a check valve separately. I will cut the thing in half with a Dremel and see what it has inside and photograph it for you. It is a check valve and if it it "hollow" and has nothing inside then it is missing something that does the check valve function. Your Butter Jesus might know where the thing is and what it is doing now.

As for bleeding brakes, run a lot of fluid through using the brake pedal pumping method described above. If you can find an assistant to pump the brake at your command you can open the bleed screw when they press on the pedal, have them hold it down near the floor (not a good ideal to push to the floor on old cars - leads to master cylinder seals being worn on debris on the last bit of travel, or so the myth goes - actually haven't had that happen yet and I have some old cars) while you close the bleed screw. I use a box end wrench on the bleed screw and have a long, tight fitting hose on the bleed screw nipple. I slather the threads with anti-seize so the likelihood of drawing air in is low, and the threads don't get corroded. Good practice to do this yearly.

Jim
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post #29 of 61 (permalink) Old 05-21-2009, 07:12 PM
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I assume that the pedal sinks to the floor or is really spongy? Do you start bleeding the caliper that is farthest away from the master cylinder first?

I have seen some pretty bizarre issues with "rebuilt" brake calipers. I always partially pop out pistons on those with compressed air to see what shape the caliper pistons are in. I have found rebuilt calipers with such poor surface condition of the pistons that I was compelled to swap out the pistons from my old calipers.

Another bizarre thing was this: somebody overtightened the bleeder screw on the rebuilt caliper to the point that the hole in the bleed screw was pinched shut. When I tried to bleed that particular caliper, it simply did not work, as no fluid could come out, until I opened the caliper screw far enough so that the fluid started gushing past the treads! I took out the caliper bleed screw and sure enough, the hole in it was pinched shut by overtightening. See if you have this problem. Simply replacing the bleeder will fix this problem.

Last edited by p100; 05-21-2009 at 07:25 PM.
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post #30 of 61 (permalink) Old 05-21-2009, 07:15 PM Thread Starter
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People, I have tried all means of bleeding, including the old pump and dump... It's not working! I am too dumb to figure out what's wrong and I have had it anyway. Now that TWO cars aren't working not only I am not getting any pussy I am now relegated to go downstairs and sleep with the dog.

The cars are going to the dealership. Maybe the dealership will be a much cheaper option than TP
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