Immigration debate hits home for liver transplant patients - Page 2 - Mercedes-Benz Forum

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post #11 of 22 (permalink) Old 05-21-2009, 07:31 AM
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I think you mis-read my question, I said quantify. What constitutes 'enough to go round'?

But nonetheless a further question in light of your bringing qualification into the discussion. Where do you determine your immediate family ends? Do in-laws count? Children of in-laws...?

In the EU, every case would be considered individually, but in broad terms once someone is living in the community, legally or not, a duty of care is established on the part of the State. It is part of civilised society.
Sorry about that...

I should wear my "cheaters" more often.

Be it a "civilized society" or not Dope .... The "EU" would be a "broke society" in no time if they had Mexico "glued" on to them.

But then again... maybe not seeing that you report that every case is considered on an individual basis.
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post #12 of 22 (permalink) Old 05-21-2009, 08:29 AM
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With Obamacare, will all this matter when everyone gets free health care ?
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Immigration debate hits home for liver transplant patients
The state funded the procedures for two young illegal migrants. But when they hit 21, coverage passed to L.A. County, which doesn't have the resources to implant the new organs they both needed again.
By Anna Gorman, Los Angeles Times Staff Writer
April 13, 2008
Ana Puente was an infant with a liver disorder when her aunt brought her illegally to the U.S. to seek medical care. She underwent two liver transplants at UCLA Medical Center as a child in 1989 and a third in 1998, each paid for by the state.

But when Puente turned 21 last June, she aged out of her state-funded health insurance and was unable to continue treatment at UCLA.

This year, her liver began failing again and she was hospitalized at County-USC Medical Center. In her Medi-Cal application, a USC doctor wrote, "Her current clinical course is irreversible, progressive and will lead to death without another liver transplant." The application was denied.

The county gave her medication but does not have the resources to perform transplants.

Late last month Puente learned of another, little-known option for patients with certain healthcare needs. If she notified U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services that she was in the country illegally, state health officials might grant her full Medi-Cal coverage. Puente did so, her benefits were restored and she is now awaiting a fourth transplant at UCLA.

Puente's case highlights two controversial issues: Should illegal immigrants receive liver transplants in the U.S. and should taxpayers pick up the cost?

The average cost of a liver transplant and first-year follow-up is nearly $490,000, and anti-rejection medications can run more than $30,000 annually, according to the United Network for Organ Sharing, which oversees transplantation nationwide.

...

Illegal immigrant children with certain severe, chronic illnesses are eligible for funding under a state program called California Children's Services. But the coverage ends when they turn 21. After that, they can receive free or low-cost treatment through county services for the medically indigent and, in some cases, emergency Medi-Cal. But in Los Angeles County, doctors said neither program covers liver transplants.

State health officials said California law is designed so there is no gap in coverage, so children move seamlessly from state-funded treatment to county care. But that doesn't always happen. When they become adults, patients like Puente often have to switch doctors and hospitals and may lose access to necessary care.
...

If illegal immigrants inform the state in writing that U.S. immigration services "is aware of their presence and does not plan to deport them," they could be eligible for full-scope Medi-Cal, said Norman Williams, spokesman for the state health department. Medical condition is one factor that would make immigrants eligible for coverage.

The immigrants send a form to Citizenship and Immigration Services, but the agency said it does not respond to patients or make any promises about their immigration status.

Is this the program that Hillary kept harping on during the campaign that she was the one that got this program started in Cali?
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post #13 of 22 (permalink) Old 05-21-2009, 08:33 AM
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Sorry about that...

I should wear my "cheaters" more often.

Be it a "civilized society" or not Dope .... The "EU" would be a "broke society" in no time if they had Mexico "glued" on to them.

But then again... maybe not seeing that you report that every case is considered on an individual basis.
'Cheaters' - LOL, don't get a netbook then!

Well, the EU does in fact get ambushed from Africa in the south and Asia Minor/Asia from the east. I believe the popular public opinion to be that we secure our borders, but treat 'guests' humanely.

"Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful" - Seneca
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post #14 of 22 (permalink) Old 05-21-2009, 09:35 AM
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Dope...

I guess that what Europe does is what they do them.

If it were up to me "charity" would not be afforded those outside this country until those who were citizens could be more than well provided for.

There may be some out there who think that my thoughts on this are wrong, but those are my thoughts and I will be sticking with them.
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post #15 of 22 (permalink) Old 05-21-2009, 10:24 AM
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Dope...

I guess that what Europe does is what they do them.

If it were up to me "charity" would not be afforded those outside this country until those who were citizens could be more than well provided for.

There may be some out there who think that my thoughts on this are wrong, but those are my thoughts and I will be sticking with them.
It's a deeply philosophical issue where absolute right or wrong views are at the extreme fringes of the debate. It's a subject very worthy of discussion outside the confines of politicians and of course, we all realise the futility of trying to please all of the people, all of the time.

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post #16 of 22 (permalink) Old 05-21-2009, 03:28 PM
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Wow!

The humanitarian side says, "Give um the liver"... the realist side says, "We can't do that".

............ I guess that the democrat side would zombie like ... bump into things and spew, "Yes We Can" without thinking how we could possibly do that, but it sounds catchy.

So! If these people went to any other country in the world that has socialized medicine as an illegal alien and needed a liver transplant what would they get?
As no-one else has replied to this question, I will answer just for the UK - I know nothing about the rest of Europe.

In the UK, there have been many instances reported in the press of illegal immigrants (generally overstayed their visitor visa) getting expensive treatments in NHS hospitals. One story was of a Brazilian getting long-term AIDS treatment in London - he had the ailment before he arrived, and spent months in hospital here. Mostly the NHS hides these situations as they know that there will be public outcry when the truth is revealed. For some odd reason the NHS administrators are very generous with taxpayers money. They alone decide who can and who cannot be treated. So I would not be at all surprised if a liver was found for an illegal immigrant in the UK.
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post #17 of 22 (permalink) Old 05-21-2009, 04:20 PM
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Well we all know how Qubes would handle this. Gas or bullet is the only debate.
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post #18 of 22 (permalink) Old 05-21-2009, 05:20 PM
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As no-one else has replied to this question, I will answer just for the UK - I know nothing about the rest of Europe.

In the UK, there have been many instances reported in the press of illegal immigrants (generally overstayed their visitor visa) getting expensive treatments in NHS hospitals. One story was of a Brazilian getting long-term AIDS treatment in London - he had the ailment before he arrived, and spent months in hospital here. Mostly the NHS hides these situations as they know that there will be public outcry when the truth is revealed. For some odd reason the NHS administrators are very generous with taxpayers money. They alone decide who can and who cannot be treated. So I would not be at all surprised if a liver was found for an illegal immigrant in the UK.
Thanks for the reply Keyhole.....

By the way... how does some administrator spending your money make you feel?
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post #19 of 22 (permalink) Old 05-21-2009, 06:30 PM
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Thanks for the reply Keyhole.....
You had your answer in post #10, you just weren't so liberal with your thanks.


"In the EU, every case would be considered individually, but in broad terms once someone is living in the community, legally or not, a duty of care is established on the part of the State. It is part of civilised society"

"Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful" - Seneca
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post #20 of 22 (permalink) Old 05-21-2009, 06:33 PM
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You had your answer in post #10, you just weren't so liberal with your thanks.


"In the EU, every case would be considered individually, but in broad terms once someone is living in the community, legally or not, a duty of care is established on the part of the State. It is part of civilised society"
I'm sorry Dope...

Thank you too!
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