Tig Versus Mig - Page 4 - Mercedes-Benz Forum

LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #31 of 52 (permalink) Old 04-22-2009, 07:15 PM
BenzWorld Elite
Date registered: Feb 2006
Vehicle: 1999 ML320
Location: Ratville
Posts: 24,029
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Quoted: 311 Post(s)
Tig is for tigger.
Attached Images
mlfun is offline  
Sponsored Links
post #32 of 52 (permalink) Old 04-22-2009, 07:15 PM
It Is What It Is, Dude
isthisdave's Avatar
Date registered: Mar 2006
Vehicle: 1978 107.024 RIP
Location: InTransition
Posts: 21,891
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Quoted: 95 Post(s)
Lifetime Premium Member
Originally Posted by TNTRower View Post
Hmm. Straight out of my books too.
isthisdave is offline  
post #33 of 52 (permalink) Old 04-22-2009, 07:16 PM
BenzWorld Elite
Date registered: Feb 2006
Vehicle: 1999 ML320
Location: Ratville
Posts: 24,029
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Quoted: 311 Post(s)
Was that a racial utterance ?
mlfun is offline  
post #34 of 52 (permalink) Old 04-22-2009, 07:20 PM
BenzWorld Elite
TNTRower's Avatar
Date registered: Sep 2007
Vehicle: '98 E320 Wagon (non 4matic)
Location: Atlanta, GA & Malabo, Equatorial Guinea
Posts: 6,663
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Send a message via AIM to TNTRower
Originally Posted by mlfun View Post
Was that a racial utterance ?
And should we ask what MIG is for?

Who's John Galt.

"Timeo Danaos et dona ferentes" - Virgil, The Aeneid, Book 2

If the Arabs put down their weapons today, there would be no more violence. If the Jews put down their weapons today, there would be no more Israel. --Benjamin Netayahu
TNTRower is offline  
post #35 of 52 (permalink) Old 04-22-2009, 07:21 PM
BenzWorld Elite
Date registered: Feb 2006
Vehicle: 1999 ML320
Location: Ratville
Posts: 24,029
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Quoted: 311 Post(s)
Originally Posted by drewprof View Post
Do you know what AIPAC is?
Originally Posted by drewprof
Tig Versus Mig
Your thoughts
Do you know what asking for it means ?

Exactly, that's what I thought.
mlfun is offline  
post #36 of 52 (permalink) Old 04-22-2009, 08:03 PM
BenzWorld Elite
Stuantle's Avatar
Date registered: Jan 2008
Posts: 5,871
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I think I saw you on the donors list for AIPAC.

Back to welding 101. Just go to Harbor Freight and get a buzz box and some sticks. Lay some splatter and go for it. Hey, no guts no glory. If you get enough on, it should work, maybe.

In reality, invest in a quality MIG machine with enough versatility to weld a frame as well as joining two beer cans together. There are a huge amount of guys out there with good equipment that need cash instead of the welder so you should be able to get a bargain. Do the research and find something cool. You can never, NEVER, have enough tools.

Forget the TIG welder unless you want to do everything on a bench. Laying on your back in the driveway welding on your buddies shock tower can't be done with one hand and a TIG welder. Better yet, don't tell anyone you have the welder or you will suddenly become everyone's best friend.

Last note:
I owned a machine shop for many years. There was a residential neighborhood behind us. When I fired up the TIG, General Hospital would get real fuzzy on the local cable lines and the phones got a bunch of static on them.
Stuantle is offline  
post #37 of 52 (permalink) Old 04-22-2009, 09:05 PM
BenzWorld Extremist
Date registered: Feb 2008
Vehicle: 1987 420SEL
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posts: 1,133
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Wait a minute, you have 240v service to your garage?

I'm envious.

Oh the things I could do with 240v, a phase converter and a 440v transformer...
Benz Prodigy is offline  
post #38 of 52 (permalink) Old 04-22-2009, 09:16 PM
BenzWorld Elite
Date registered: Sep 2004
Vehicle: 2014 E250 Bluetec 4-Matic, 1983 240D 4-Speed
Location: USA
Posts: 9,257
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Quoted: 256 Post(s)
TIG welding is low heat, manual feed where the eletrode is not consumed in the arc if you have any skill. MIG is a process that is higher heat, and aimed at medium deposition rates. The MIG electrode is the filler wire.

If you get poor penetration, or excessive roll over of the bead, or other visual defects you need to practice more. MIG machines usually have a set of operating parameters you set to establish the rate of wire feed (tied to Amps). TNT I think already noted you get a puddle of liquid metal that you have to manipulate (stretch side to side and back and forth) to avoid overflowing the puddle or starving it. A good weld has a ridged, but smooth surface and the edges do not join the base material at an angle that exceeds 90 degrees. You add enough filler material that the puddle does not pull away base material at its edge - this leaves a sharp edged divot along both sides of the weld that goes beneath the finished height of the base material and is known as undercut - it is a stress riser you don't need in a component with high stresses. You try to control the shape and travel of the puddle to get the result you want.

Much of the same applies to TIG, but in this case the energy into the puddle is controlled by your foot and the material being fed into the puddle is also controlled by you, this time your "free" hand, the one not holding the welding torch. TIG is a much better process for sheet metal or rust or other low heat/low energy type welds. Even anything less that an eighth of an inch thick if you are a klutz. Otherwise with MIG you will find the puddle melts through the base material and you make a hole. Don't use TIG if you are going to be adding 10 lbs of filler a day - you will never get 10 lbs of TIG filler down in a day.

Holes in thin metal are more difficult to fix with MIG, in my opinion. Many exhaust pipe system welders will use MIG and turn the heat and feed rate way down. This leaves a layer of not welded shit that must be remelted with another pass or it fails under stress. Remelting is another difficult thing to do with MIG. Check the guys on Orange County Chopper. I have never seen them do a finish weld on anything - it is all MIG tacks. Which are not much more than staples. Someone else comes in, or they ship it out, to have the job done by someone with real skills. Their welds are visible and there is nothing worse than requiring your welds be ground smooth because they won't pass a visual inspection. Lots of extra work and you usually end up picking up the undercut and other junk that gets dug out of a visually shitty weld.

Your brittle or cracked welds are a typical result of lack of heat - travel rate is too fast (that is you again) even if you are depositing a bead of significant thickness. You have to melt the base metal and the filler metal in the puddle or else it is like you dribbled liquid metal on cold metal. It doesn't weld, it mechanically bonds by conforming to the surface roughness - hit it with a slag pick or chisel and it won't stick. This is actually something you learn to see in the puddle.

You also need to select compatible filler material and base materials. Trying to weld aluminum to copper using regular steel filler won't do the job. You end up ruining the base material in the area of the weld and the stuff in the puddle segregates leaving you with little more than slag again. Even regular steels turn out not to be regular from the perspective of selecting filler material. Autos use a lot of high strength stuff these days, and my experience is with submarine hulls and nuclear power plant piping - none of it regular steels. So pay attention to what the materials are and get the right filler materials.

They sell crayons you can use to help you learn what the concept of heat input is - you draw a line a few inches from the joint with one or more of these crayons and you will want one to melt away and the other to stay meaning you got it hot enough and not too hot for a good joint.

Autos have mostly chickenshit material thicknesses. I would opt for a TIG machine unless I was good with the MIG welder on the thicknesses in question. Joining a thin material to a thick material is another reason - better control of the puddle since you own the energy input rate, the feed rate for filler material and the puddle shape/travel rate all by yourself.

TIG sucks when there is a lot of shit in the way though - tight places make both hands and your head with a spot to operate the pedal with your foot a bit of challenge compared to how one handed MIG can be.

So what are you doing, how much filler do you plan to deposit a day, and what kind of skills do you have?

JimSmith is offline  
post #39 of 52 (permalink) Old 04-22-2009, 09:24 PM
Cruise Control
Zeitgeist's Avatar
Date registered: Sep 2004
Vehicle: '87 300TD/'90 300D/'94 Quattro/'89 Vanagon TDI/'01 EV Weekender VR6
Location: Cascadia
Posts: 52,168
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Quoted: 1647 Post(s)
Lifetime Premium Member
I have a great little Lincoln Mig setup, but would love to have a Tig for all the aluminum applications that I constantly run up against. I think it's not really an either/or situation. If you can afford it, run with both to accomplish the task at hand, rather than try to fit an unworthy tool to the task.
Zeitgeist is offline  
post #40 of 52 (permalink) Old 04-22-2009, 09:37 PM
BenzWorld Elite
Date registered: Jan 2008
Location: USA
Posts: 13,341
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Quoted: 1216 Post(s)
Originally Posted by isthisdave View Post
And you contributed with what and how?

© All photographs and likenesses of Multipurpose are protected under copyright
law. Any use of photographs in whole or in part is strictly prohibited
unless authorization is granted in writing by copyright holder. All rights
Multipurpose is offline  
Sponsored Links

  Mercedes-Benz Forum > General Mercedes-Benz Forums > Off-Topic

Quick Reply

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Mercedes-Benz Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:


Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode

Similar Threads
Topic Author Forum Replies Last Post
W140 - MIG welding on the body - electronics issues? S class Audio & Telematics Forum 1 05-27-2008 12:57 AM
Electrical welding (MIG), Do I have to disconnect the battery? Alph@Dog W163 M-Class 6 09-10-2007 09:07 AM
Dimension Wagon versus Sedan petrol versus diesel aus24v W124 E,CE,D,TD Class 1 10-21-2006 07:34 PM
16" Alloys versus 17" or 18" NZ Kiwi W210 E50 AMG, E55 AMG 3 02-14-2004 01:02 PM
S versus S 400SEL W140 S-Class 8 12-29-2003 03:29 PM

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Title goes here

video goes here
description goes here. Read Full Story
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome