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post #41 of 62 (permalink) Old 04-22-2009, 08:45 PM
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Originally Posted by GermanStar View Post
^ This scenario brought to you by Authoritarian Loathing of Liberty, Inc.®.
I would also like to point out that Liberty involves responsibility. Something that the media in general (and you can't make generalizations) does not like to exercise.

Who's John Galt.

"Timeo Danaos et dona ferentes" - Virgil, The Aeneid, Book 2

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post #42 of 62 (permalink) Old 04-22-2009, 08:45 PM
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Just pokin' a little fun. Like many hard-line right wingers, you seem to have a healthy admiration for authority. The incident actually seemed a bit personal to me...

"If spending money you don't have is the height of stupidity, borrowing money to give it away is the height of insanity." -- anon
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post #43 of 62 (permalink) Old 04-22-2009, 08:51 PM
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Originally Posted by GermanStar View Post
Just pokin' a little fun. Like many hard-line right wingers, you seem to have a healthy admiration for authority. The incident actually seemed a bit personal to me...
I do not disagree that what was in the video appeared to be a big over reaction on the Cop's part.

What I can not stand is the simple fact that so many people want to believe that cops are power hungry bullies.

Sure there are some but the vast majority of them are not.

I also like to keep in mind the VERY adversarial relationship that the Media has with the Police. Most of it a result of their own doing.

And as for an "Admiration" of authority, it is not that at all. It is a respect for those who would put themselves in situations that could cost them their lives in order to serve the public.

Since when is that a political or hard-line-right-wing thing?

Who's John Galt.

"Timeo Danaos et dona ferentes" - Virgil, The Aeneid, Book 2

If the Arabs put down their weapons today, there would be no more violence. If the Jews put down their weapons today, there would be no more Israel. --Benjamin Netayahu
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post #44 of 62 (permalink) Old 04-22-2009, 09:04 PM
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Originally Posted by TNTRower View Post
Since when is that a political or hard-line-right-wing thing?
I see love or loathing or authoritarianism as a key factor in the way folks reacted to the Bush admin for example, don't you? The right wants to be told what to do, what to think, etc., hence the popularity of AM hate radio. The left wants to be left to their own devices, and has a greater tendency to reject authority. Generalizations, of course...

"If spending money you don't have is the height of stupidity, borrowing money to give it away is the height of insanity." -- anon
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post #45 of 62 (permalink) Old 04-22-2009, 09:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TNTRower View Post
I do not disagree that what was in the video appeared to be a big over reaction on the Cop's part.

What I can not stand is the simple fact that so many people want to believe that cops are power hungry bullies.

Sure there are some but the vast majority of them are not.

I also like to keep in mind the VERY adversarial relationship that the Media has with the Police. Most of it a result of their own doing.

And as for an "Admiration" of authority, it is not that at all. It is a respect for those who would put themselves in situations that could cost them their lives in order to serve the public.

Since when is that a political or hard-line-right-wing thing?
Yes, I want my money back!
Did you read my encounter with the cops when that car crashed into my neighbor's house?
How about when I call them when a robbery is in progress and they show up an hour or more later? They did this at least three times. Who do I complain to when they don't acknowledge their shortcomings?
Oh, what about my Nazi bullets? (not important but they were of value and I found them)
By the way, I don't necessarily "hate" cops; my grand pa was a NY cop. All I am saying is that they are poorly trained, incompetent, full of shit and think too highly of themselves. Is my assessment, based on my experience as described, off the mark?
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post #46 of 62 (permalink) Old 04-22-2009, 09:32 PM
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Originally Posted by GermanStar View Post
I see love or loathing or authoritarianism as a key factor in the way folks reacted to the Bush admin for example, don't you? The right wants to be told what to do, what to think, etc., hence the popularity of AM hate radio. The left wants to be left to their own devices, and has a greater tendency to reject authority. Generalizations, of course...
This is where I disagree with you.

If you listen to the talk radio at all nobody is telling you what to believe. All of them in fact are trying to get what they think is the real story out to people.

In all seriousness, what or when have any of the top 3 talk radio folks (Limbaugh, Hannity, Beck) ever said something along the lines of "This is what you need to believe."

I have heard all of them say, "this is what I believe and here is the evidence that I have to support it."

That is a lot more that what I have heard from the likes of Franken, Colmes, or Maddow.

I think what happens is that the vast majority of people get their information from the big media outlets. They are homogenous in their coverage of political goings on.

Essentially you get the following:

Republicans or Conservatives do something that can be shown to be embarrassing it gets run over and over again.

Democrats of Liberals do something that can be shown to be embarrassing it gets a quick mention without endless running of "B" Roll footage showing the shamefule past of racism, sexism, bigotry etc.

Demorcrat OR Republican gets caught being corrupted by whatever and it is on like Donkey Kong!

The issue is the media and its absolute commandment that in order to get ahead you must show that you have destroyed the career of some person or people in power.

It is the tall poppy syndrome. If you try to lead or do good, you are a target. The media no longer sees itself as a witness to the world. It sees itself as an advocate for the people.

The problem is what do they advocate for?

Who's John Galt.

"Timeo Danaos et dona ferentes" - Virgil, The Aeneid, Book 2

If the Arabs put down their weapons today, there would be no more violence. If the Jews put down their weapons today, there would be no more Israel. --Benjamin Netayahu
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post #47 of 62 (permalink) Old 04-22-2009, 09:38 PM
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Originally Posted by drewprof View Post
Yes, I want my money back!
Did you read my encounter with the cops when that car crashed into my neighbor's house?
How about when I call them when a robbery is in progress and they show up an hour or more later? They did this at least three times. Who do I complain to when they don't acknowledge their shortcomings?
Oh, what about my Nazi bullets? (not important but they were of value and I found them)
By the way, I don't necessarily "hate" cops; my grand pa was a NY cop. All I am saying is that they are poorly trained, incompetent, full of shit and think too highly of themselves. Is my assessment, based on my experience as described, off the mark?
Baltimore right?

You show me a crappy, ill-disciplined, poorly trained police force, and I will show you a political system rife with corruption and incompetence.

Baltimore of course has been known as that shining beacon on the hill, of political honesty and accountability.

What I am saying is that when you have poorly run government you have poorly run police forces. Look at New Orleans.

Who's John Galt.

"Timeo Danaos et dona ferentes" - Virgil, The Aeneid, Book 2

If the Arabs put down their weapons today, there would be no more violence. If the Jews put down their weapons today, there would be no more Israel. --Benjamin Netayahu
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post #48 of 62 (permalink) Old 04-22-2009, 09:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TNTRower View Post
This is where I disagree with you.

If you listen to the talk radio at all nobody is telling you what to believe. All of them in fact are trying to get what they think is the real story out to people.

In all seriousness, what or when have any of the top 3 talk radio folks (Limbaugh, Hannity, Beck) ever said something along the lines of "This is what you need to believe."

I have heard all of them say, "this is what I believe and here is the evidence that I have to support it."

That is a lot more that what I have heard from the likes of Franken, Colmes, or Maddow.

I think what happens is that the vast majority of people get their information from the big media outlets. They are homogenous in their coverage of political goings on.

Essentially you get the following:

Republicans or Conservatives do something that can be shown to be embarrassing it gets run over and over again.

Democrats of Liberals do something that can be shown to be embarrassing it gets a quick mention without endless running of "B" Roll footage showing the shamefule past of racism, sexism, bigotry etc.

Demorcrat OR Republican gets caught being corrupted by whatever and it is on like Donkey Kong!

The issue is the media and its absolute commandment that in order to get ahead you must show that you have destroyed the career of some person or people in power.

It is the tall poppy syndrome. If you try to lead or do good, you are a target. The media no longer sees itself as a witness to the world. It sees itself as an advocate for the people.

The problem is what do they advocate for?
Anyone who habitually listens to hate radio (or editorialists on network news) does so to be told what to think. There is no other possible reason. They are being lectured to by people forwarding genuine or fabricated opinion, not facts and figures. As you say, there are a few lefties in the field, almost exclusive to MSNBC/CNN, but they do not garner anywhere near the audience of the righties. Those folks who tune into Olbermann or Maddow on a regular basis also do so because they want to be told what to think, there is no doubt. Independent thinkers seek news sources rather than opinion peddlers for their information. And if they do seek opinion, the opinions to value are those that promote, rather than degrade.

"If spending money you don't have is the height of stupidity, borrowing money to give it away is the height of insanity." -- anon
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post #49 of 62 (permalink) Old 04-22-2009, 09:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GermanStar View Post
Anyone who habitually listens to hate radio (or editorialists on network news) does so to be told what to think. There is no other possible reason. They are being lectured to by people forwarding genuine or fabricated opinion, not facts and figures. As you say, there are a few lefties in the field, almost exclusive to MSNBC/CNN, but they do not garner anywhere near the audience of the righties. Those folks who tune into Olbermann or Maddow on a regular basis also do so because they want to be told what to think, there is no doubt. Independent thinkers seek news sources rather than opinion peddlers for their information. And if they do seek opinion, the opinions to value are those that promote, rather than degrade.
I couldn't disagree with you more. Go listen to some of the bigger shows. Laura Ingraham, Hannity, Beck, Limbaugh. They always have examples, sources, and evidence to back up their assertions.

Now you are just making stuff up.

Who's John Galt.

"Timeo Danaos et dona ferentes" - Virgil, The Aeneid, Book 2

If the Arabs put down their weapons today, there would be no more violence. If the Jews put down their weapons today, there would be no more Israel. --Benjamin Netayahu
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post #50 of 62 (permalink) Old 04-22-2009, 09:47 PM
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Originally Posted by GermanStar View Post
I see love or loathing or authoritarianism as a key factor in the way folks reacted to the Bush admin for example, don't you? The right wants to be told what to do, what to think, etc., hence the popularity of AM hate radio. The left wants to be left to their own devices, and has a greater tendency to reject authority. Generalizations, of course...
Hate radio? Who here is posting quotes of things they say? It's the left and who do you suppose the likes of San Diego, Kaczynski, McVeigh, Ayers follow?

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