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post #21 of 67 (permalink) Old 03-21-2009, 06:03 PM
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Actually no president of the United States has either had the balls or the power to do anything without the blessing of AIPAC. AIPAC dictates our foreign policy at the expense of our domestic policy and national security. What does /israel and AIPAC give us back in return? Stealing secrets and spying. The problem is that Americans pretty much have shit for brains. Plain and simple. Americans are slaves of the "chosen people."
Hey Doc, we don't "all" have Shit for Brains...........Many of us are trying to change things.......Please , in all your educated mal contempt, do not make the mistake believing , that we are all the SAME, you're better than that...........Peace Brother.............
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post #22 of 67 (permalink) Old 03-22-2009, 06:26 AM
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Hey Doc, we don't "all" have Shit for Brains...........Many of us are trying to change things.......Please , in all your educated mal contempt, do not make the mistake believing , that we are all the SAME, you're better than that...........Peace Brother.............
Bro!!!!!!!! I didn't mean it that way. Sorry. I meant the "majority" and should have said it. Nice to see you are in the enlightened MINORITY. I was generalizing. When I said "Americans", that group included me as well. Unfortunately a society or a group is defined on the bases of the majority. Please don't take offense as none was intended.
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post #23 of 67 (permalink) Old 03-22-2009, 01:20 PM
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I obviously have a different opinion but I am interested in your interpretation of where we would be in this century if it wasn't for the USA?

Let's see...let's start with Europe.

Who was equipped to deal with Hitler? History would tell us that nobody was until the US got involved with that big stick of ours called mass production.

Ok so let's also look at the Marshall plan, throw in NATO. None of what is modern day Europe would be even in existence if it was for the US.

Technology.

Europe has this knack for coming up with some really cool things like the car but then not much else. It took an American to come up with Assembly line and bring cars to the masses.

What about medical advances? Polio, Pace Makers, Artificial Hearts, etc. It seems to me that all of the greatest medical advancements come from the "Broken" and "Worst" health care system in the world.

Also, let's not forget the PC. Or the transistor, microprocessor, or the great leap forward by Al Gore, who we all know now did indeed invent the internet.

So also let's talk about world political security.

Who kicked the Soviets back to Moscow without ever starting WWIII? Who led the world to its greatest prosperity, greatest increase in standard of living, indeed probably its most peaceful time in World History? That great stabilizer called the USA.

Have we made mistakes? Yes we have, but we correct course. Some would say President Obama is a correction others disagree. But we changed parties (maybe not so much in the policies but there is a "D" in the White House instead of an "R" so I guess that is change.)

We are inherently a country that wants to do good. Our interests are for the greater benefit of our citizens. Our freedoms are for the benefit of our interests.

In broad general terms if we are free to innovate, invent, and produce we will prosper.

Is it so hard to say that if the world is free to do the same that they will prosper as well? Therefore that means what is in the U.S. interest or what is good for the U.S. is good for the world.
Anybody can paint with a broad brush. It is the fine brush that defines the difference between a great painting and something for the refrigerator.

Yes, this country has produced some very great advances. But we have also stepped on a great many toes [which you so simply gloss over]. Yet it is those sore toes that account for many of the current problems that have faced us for the past quarter century. It is those sore toes that require so much of our time and energy and national treasure.

And to suggest that we are the only innovators is very disingenuous. Many of the folks in England, Japan, Germany and Korea would disagree that all innovation takes place under our flag.

We are but one member of a very large team. It really is time we started acting like it. We have now seen what happens when we ask for help after folks have dealt with the attitude you just posted. They ignore us. Cause and effect is a lesson we should have learned a long time ago. We did not.

I fear we are learning it now.

McBear,
Kentucky

Being smart is knowing the difference, in a sticky situation between a well delivered anecdote and a well delivered antidote - bear.
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post #24 of 67 (permalink) Old 03-22-2009, 02:07 PM
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Originally Posted by TNTRower View Post
I obviously have a different opinion but I am interested in your interpretation of where we would be in this century if it wasn't for the USA?

Let's see...let's start with Europe.

Who was equipped to deal with Hitler? History would tell us that nobody was until the US got involved with that big stick of ours called mass production.

Ok so let's also look at the Marshall plan, throw in NATO. None of what is modern day Europe would be even in existence if it was for the US.

Technology.

Europe has this knack for coming up with some really cool things like the car but then not much else. It took an American to come up with Assembly line and bring cars to the masses.

What about medical advances? Polio, Pace Makers, Artificial Hearts, etc. It seems to me that all of the greatest medical advancements come from the "Broken" and "Worst" health care system in the world.

Also, let's not forget the PC. Or the transistor, microprocessor, or the great leap forward by Al Gore, who we all know now did indeed invent the internet.

So also let's talk about world political security.

Who kicked the Soviets back to Moscow without ever starting WWIII? Who led the world to its greatest prosperity, greatest increase in standard of living, indeed probably its most peaceful time in World History? That great stabilizer called the USA.

Have we made mistakes? Yes we have, but we correct course. Some would say President Obama is a correction others disagree. But we changed parties (maybe not so much in the policies but there is a "D" in the White House instead of an "R" so I guess that is change.)

We are inherently a country that wants to do good. Our interests are for the greater benefit of our citizens. Our freedoms are for the benefit of our interests.

In broad general terms if we are free to innovate, invent, and produce we will prosper.

Is it so hard to say that if the world is free to do the same that they will prosper as well? Therefore that means what is in the U.S. interest or what is good for the U.S. is good for the world.
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Originally Posted by mcbear View Post
Anybody can paint with a broad brush. It is the fine brush that defines the difference between a great painting and something for the refrigerator.

Yes, this country has produced some very great advances. But we have also stepped on a great many toes [which you so simply gloss over]. Yet it is those sore toes that account for many of the current problems that have faced us for the past quarter century. It is those sore toes that require so much of our time and energy and national treasure.

And to suggest that we are the only innovators is very disingenuous. Many of the folks in England, Japan, Germany and Korea would disagree that all innovation takes place under our flag.

We are but one member of a very large team. It really is time we started acting like it. We have now seen what happens when we ask for help after folks have dealt with the attitude you just posted. They ignore us. Cause and effect is a lesson we should have learned a long time ago. We did not.

I fear we are learning it now.
I agree with mcbear.

To TNT,
Everything we have "invented" is basically an advancement of the discoveries and innovations of the Muslims. Without these, we/USA/the world would be still in the stone-age. In the field or science, algebra, "flying machines", camera, chess, SOAP, parachute, shampoo, crank shaft, metal armor, rockets, torpedoes, gunpowder, surgical instruments, windmill, vaccination, fountain pen, numerical numbering, coffee, carpets paychecks, earth is spherical shape, earth's circumference, how the eye works, modern transportation, water irrigation and transport, medicine, etc etc were Muslim discoveries. The west had only advanced it.
YouTube - Discover the Muslim origins of many Western discoveries!
20 Greatest Innovations by Muslims
YouTube - 20 Great Discoveries by MUSLIMS
Daily News - Istanbul to have Museum of Inventions by Muslim Scholar
Scientific Inventions

So baby boo, who is busy counting Nobel Prizes won by Jews, and TNT who thinks Americans are "inventors", tell me what really have we invented? We have only advance some discoveries, innovations and inventions of the Muslims or have found alternate uses from them. Whatever we enjoy today has been given to us my Muslims. Learn history you two and appreciation and learn to speak the truth.
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post #25 of 67 (permalink) Old 03-22-2009, 02:12 PM
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Originally Posted by TNTRower View Post
Because that has ALWAYS worked so well for other countries. When will you and others learn that we are not imposing our beliefs on other people but we are allowing freedom to grow?

There is no puppet government. A puppet government is like Vichy France.

If there were puppet Governments in Iraq and Afghanistan we would not have security treaties etc. Also, if they were puppet Governments that would make Obama the puppeteer now. So is Obama the puppet master now? Is Obama pulling the strings that control the Iraqi Parliament and the Afghan parliament?

Quit drinking the cool aid and do some of your own thinking.
You cannot possibly be that naive.

McBear,
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post #26 of 67 (permalink) Old 03-22-2009, 02:22 PM
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Originally Posted by GermanStar View Post
That's some funny sh*t right there. Not only are you drinking your own koolaid, you've apparently drowned in it.

Do you value autonomy?
Do you resent anyone and anything that challenges that autonomy?

No need to respond, they are rhetorical questions, but I'll give you a hint nonetheless: autonomy = self-determination = freedom.
Yes and we have provided that for the Iraqi's and the Afghanis.

Who's John Galt.

"Timeo Danaos et dona ferentes" - Virgil, The Aeneid, Book 2

If the Arabs put down their weapons today, there would be no more violence. If the Jews put down their weapons today, there would be no more Israel. --Benjamin Netayahu
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post #27 of 67 (permalink) Old 03-22-2009, 02:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Cancer_Researcher View Post
I agree with mcbear.

To TNT,
Everything we have "invented" is basically an advancement of the discoveries and innovations of the Muslims. Without these, we/USA/the world would be still in the stone-age. In the field or science, algebra, "flying machines", camera, chess, SOAP, parachute, shampoo, crank shaft, metal armor, rockets, torpedoes, gunpowder, surgical instruments, windmill, vaccination, fountain pen, numerical numbering, coffee, carpets paychecks, earth is spherical shape, earth's circumference, how the eye works, modern transportation, water irrigation and transport, medicine, etc etc were Muslim discoveries. The west had only advanced it.
YouTube - Discover the Muslim origins of many Western discoveries!
20 Greatest Innovations by Muslims
YouTube - 20 Great Discoveries by MUSLIMS
Daily News - Istanbul to have Museum of Inventions by Muslim Scholar
Scientific Inventions

So baby boo, who is busy counting Nobel Prizes won by Jews, and TNT who thinks Americans are "inventors", tell me what really have we invented? We have only advance some discoveries, innovations and inventions of the Muslims or have found alternate uses from them. Whatever we enjoy today has been given to us my Muslims. Learn history you two and appreciation and learn to speak the truth.
So let's see, hmmm. What country enabled all of this to happen. I know it is hard with your revisionist lenses on to see reality. Very true that Arabic numbers are the basis that our arithmetic is based on and such. There are countless things such as gun powder etc. that we have not invented but we have taken as the building blocks to build on. Quite simply, without the freedoms we enjoy in this country people would not be able to accomplish what we have.

Unless I am missing something, you are not doing your Undergrad, Medical School in an Arabic Country are you? I mean, the Arab world is where we get the best parts of the world of medicine. Will you be doing your residency in Iraq? Or Saudi Arabia?

You are hopeless with your loathing of the country that allows you to be whatever it is you want to be.

Who's John Galt.

"Timeo Danaos et dona ferentes" - Virgil, The Aeneid, Book 2

If the Arabs put down their weapons today, there would be no more violence. If the Jews put down their weapons today, there would be no more Israel. --Benjamin Netayahu
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post #28 of 67 (permalink) Old 03-22-2009, 02:36 PM
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Originally Posted by mcbear View Post
Anybody can paint with a broad brush. It is the fine brush that defines the difference between a great painting and something for the refrigerator.

Yes, this country has produced some very great advances. But we have also stepped on a great many toes [which you so simply gloss over]. Yet it is those sore toes that account for many of the current problems that have faced us for the past quarter century. It is those sore toes that require so much of our time and energy and national treasure.

And to suggest that we are the only innovators is very disingenuous. Many of the folks in England, Japan, Germany and Korea would disagree that all innovation takes place under our flag.

We are but one member of a very large team. It really is time we started acting like it. We have now seen what happens when we ask for help after folks have dealt with the attitude you just posted. They ignore us. Cause and effect is a lesson we should have learned a long time ago. We did not.

I fear we are learning it now.
I never said that we are the ONLY ones who are innovative or inventing. Perhaps if you would stop with the mischaracterization and tactical misrepresentations you could see the truth.

We owe a great debt to other cultures for there initial discoveries that have allowed those in the US to make these fantastic innovations. Countries like Japan have taken what we have done and built upon many things with fantastic results.

However, please enlighten us on another country that has had a more profound effect for the good of the world other than the US in the past 100 years?

And don't try and wiggle out of it by saying something like "Well without the help of X or without the invention Y we wouldn't have been able to do it."

We know that we are where we are because we stand on the shoulders of those who have come before us. The truth is that no other country has done more to help this world than the US.

Why is that such a bad thing to understand?

Who's John Galt.

"Timeo Danaos et dona ferentes" - Virgil, The Aeneid, Book 2

If the Arabs put down their weapons today, there would be no more violence. If the Jews put down their weapons today, there would be no more Israel. --Benjamin Netayahu
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post #29 of 67 (permalink) Old 03-22-2009, 02:41 PM
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Originally Posted by TNTRower View Post
So let's see, hmmm. What country enabled all of this to happen. I know it is hard with your revisionist lenses on to see reality. Very true that Arabic numbers are the basis that our arithmetic is based on and such. There are countless things such as gun powder etc. that we have not invented but we have taken as the building blocks to build on. Quite simply, without the freedoms we enjoy in this country people would not be able to accomplish what we have.

Unless I am missing something, you are not doing your Undergrad, Medical School in an Arabic Country are you? I mean, the Arab world is where we get the best parts of the world of medicine. Will you be doing your residency in Iraq? Or Saudi Arabia?

You are hopeless with your loathing of the country that allows you to be whatever it is you want to be
.
Why would I do my residency in a foreign country? Why wouldn't I do it in my own country and serve my own people? Yes I will go to these countries to do humanitarian work and give to those people because it is the right thing to do and we owe them for destroying them.

Loathing? LMFAO. This is not loathing, this is about the truth and giving credit where and when its due. Credit to the real inventors and truth that we are destroyers and takers. Actually I feel sorry for you and the likes who have myopic brains and are living lies. You tell yourself a lie often and you will end up believing it eventually and only end up harming yourselves.
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post #30 of 67 (permalink) Old 03-22-2009, 02:47 PM
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Originally Posted by Cancer_Researcher View Post
Why would I do my residency in a foreign country? Why wouldn't I do it in my own country and serve my own people? Yes I will go to these countries to do humanitarian work and give to those people because it is the right thing to do and we owe them for destroying them.

Loathing? LMFAO. This is not loathing, this is about the truth and giving credit where and when its due. Credit to the real inventors and truth that we are destroyers and takers. Actually I feel sorry for you and the likes who have myopic brains and are living lies. You tell yourself a lie often and you will end up believing it eventually and only end up harming yourselves.
Well we are destroyers and takers so why stay here? Move to those countries that are givers and creators. You obviously have countries in mind that are much better than ours?

My whole point in this is that we are far from perfect, but in my travels I have not seen a better place than the US when it comes to being left alone to go about your business and have a happy life.

You obviously seem to have a different opinion. I would just offer up the observation that you are a serious hypocrite if you say that we are destroyers and takers and you stay here when you think other countries are givers and creators.

Who's John Galt.

"Timeo Danaos et dona ferentes" - Virgil, The Aeneid, Book 2

If the Arabs put down their weapons today, there would be no more violence. If the Jews put down their weapons today, there would be no more Israel. --Benjamin Netayahu
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