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post #11 of 21 (permalink) Old 02-20-2009, 04:18 PM
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China is going to have huge infrastructure and social problems, especially when their populace gets educated. Huge.
Yup. Kinda hard to control billions of hungry people.

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post #12 of 21 (permalink) Old 02-20-2009, 04:25 PM
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All it will take is another good old World War to straighten out these economies, and get things a hummin!!When people get desparate and hungy, what usally follows is...........WAR.
post #13 of 21 (permalink) Old 02-20-2009, 05:04 PM
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With the signal exception of all those U.S. Treasury bonds. But do they know something we don't know? Now look, China is bailing out Russia today.

One day not too far off in the future, the pundits and talking heads of our great land will wonder aloud: How and when did China get so smart, without our noticing? It'll probably happen around the time of the Denninger Inflection...

"Russia, which last year was flush with oil and gas revenue, bolstered its deteriorating financial position this week by promising to supply China with 300,000 barrels a day of Siberian oil over the next 20 years in return for $25 billion in loans to Russian state-owned oil and pipeline firms with large debt payments coming due this year.

washingtonpost.com

"Petroleo Brasileiro chief executive Sergio Jose Gabrielli said the Brazilian state oil company is planning $174.4 billion in spending for exploration and production, mostly to exploit oil finds offshore Brazil. He said the effort would boost Brazil's oil production from 1.85 million barrels a day to 5.7 million barrels a day by 2020. "We are going to be producing more than half the current production of Saudi Arabia," he said.

"Raising that money has been challenging, but Gabrielli said the firm would receive money from the state development fund and borrow the rest.

"Yesterday, Petrobras received a $10 billion loan from China in return for supply guarantees."

Together, these countries (China, Russia, Brazil) have thrown away a grand total of $0.00 on the so-called "War on Terrorism" (actually the War on Israel's Enemies). As opposed to the few trillion and counting we're burning. You get benefits like that if you don't spend all your time and money making enemies on the far side of the globe
.
Beautifully said! IMO America has seen its greatest days and as an American it saddens me to see that our downfall has started. The next century will belong to Russia, China, and the Islamic countries. Our nation along with Europe will be set aside. Israel won't be around as it can't survive on its own without America's financial support and most countries having a trade embargo against it. America won't be able to give it countless billions/trillions so it can commit crimes against humanity. Maybe this will be good for America as it will realize that its downfall and loss of respect in the eyes of the world was its blind one-sided policy towards Israel and by doing Israel's dirty work America herself was abandoned by the rest of the world. We should tell our children to get ready to live in a 3rd world country. Very sad.
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post #14 of 21 (permalink) Old 02-20-2009, 05:16 PM
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With the signal exception of all those U.S. Treasury bonds. But do they know something we don't know? Now look, China is bailing out Russia today.

One day not too far off in the future, the pundits and talking heads of our great land will wonder aloud: How and when did China get so smart, without our noticing? It'll probably happen around the time of the Denninger Inflection...

"Russia, which last year was flush with oil and gas revenue, bolstered its deteriorating financial position this week by promising to supply China with 300,000 barrels a day of Siberian oil over the next 20 years in return for $25 billion in loans to Russian state-owned oil and pipeline firms with large debt payments coming due this year.

washingtonpost.com

"Petroleo Brasileiro chief executive Sergio Jose Gabrielli said the Brazilian state oil company is planning $174.4 billion in spending for exploration and production, mostly to exploit oil finds offshore Brazil. He said the effort would boost Brazil's oil production from 1.85 million barrels a day to 5.7 million barrels a day by 2020. "We are going to be producing more than half the current production of Saudi Arabia," he said.

"Raising that money has been challenging, but Gabrielli said the firm would receive money from the state development fund and borrow the rest.

"Yesterday, Petrobras received a $10 billion loan from China in return for supply guarantees."
Together, these countries (China, Russia, Brazil) have thrown away a grand total of $0.00 on the so-called "War on Terrorism" (actually the War on Israel's Enemies). As opposed to the few trillion and counting we're burning. You get benefits like that if you don't spend all your time and money making enemies on the far side of the globe.
The Good Book predicted this long ago my learned friends.
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post #15 of 21 (permalink) Old 02-20-2009, 05:42 PM
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The Good Book predicted this long ago my learned friends.
...
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1 After these things I saw another angel coming down from heaven, having great authority, and the earth was illumined with his glory. 2 And he cried out with a mighty voice, saying, “Fallen, fallen is Babylon the great! She has become a dwelling place of demons and a prison of every unclean spirit, and a prison of every unclean and hateful bird. 3 “For all the nations have drunk of the wine of the passion of her immorality, and the kings of the earth have committed acts of immorality with her, and the merchants of the earth have become rich by the wealth of her sensuality.”
4 I heard another voice from heaven, saying, “Come out of her, my people, so that you will not participate in her sins and receive of her plagues; 5 for her sins have piled up as high as heaven, and God has remembered her iniquities. 6 “Pay her back even as she has paid, and give back to her double according to her deeds; in the cup which she has mixed, mix twice as much for her. 7 “To the degree that she glorified herself and lived sensuously, to the same degree give her torment and mourning; for she says in her heart, ‘I SIT as A QUEEN AND I AM NOT A WIDOW, and will never see mourning.’ 8 “For this reason in one day her plagues will come, pestilence and mourning and famine, and she will be burned up with fire; for the Lord God who judges her is strong.

Lament for Babylon

9 “And the kings of the earth, who committed acts of immorality and lived sensuously with her, will weep and lament over her when they see the smoke of her burning, 10 standing at a distance because of the fear of her torment, saying, ‘Woe, woe, the great city, Babylon, the strong city! For in one hour your judgment has come.’
11 “And the merchants of the earth weep and mourn over her, because no one buys their cargoes any more— 12 cargoes of gold and silver and precious stones and pearls and fine linen and purple and silk and scarlet, and every kind of citron wood and every article of ivory and every article made from very costly wood and bronze and iron and marble, 13 and cinnamon and spice and incense and perfume and frankincense and wine and olive oil and fine flour and wheat and cattle and sheep, and cargoes of horses and chariots and slaves and human lives. 14 “The fruit you long for has gone from you, and all things that were luxurious and splendid have passed away from you and men will no longer find them. 15 “The merchants of these things, who became rich from her, will stand at a distance because of the fear of her torment, weeping and mourning, 16 saying, ‘Woe, woe, the great city, she who was clothed in fine linen and purple and scarlet, and adorned with gold and precious stones and pearls; 17 for in one hour such great wealth has been laid waste!’ And every shipmaster and every passenger and sailor, and as many as make their living by the sea, stood at a distance, 18 and were crying out as they saw the smoke of her burning, saying, ‘What city is like the great city?’ 19 “And they threw dust on their heads and were crying out, weeping and mourning, saying, ‘Woe, woe, the great city, in which all who had ships at sea became rich by her wealth, for in one hour she has been laid waste!’ 20 “Rejoice over her, O heaven, and you saints and apostles and prophets, because God has pronounced judgment for you against her.”
21 Then a strong angel took up a stone like a great millstone and threw it into the sea, saying, “So will Babylon, the great city, be thrown down with violence, and will not be found any longer. 22 “And the sound of harpists and musicians and flute-players and trumpeters will not be heard in you any longer; and no craftsman of any craft will be found in you any longer; and the sound of a mill will not be heard in you any longer; 23 and the light of a lamp will not shine in you any longer; and the voice of the bridegroom and bride will not be heard in you any longer; for your merchants were the great men of the earth, because all the nations were deceived by your sorcery. 24 “And in her was found the blood of prophets and of saints and of all who have been slain on the earth.”
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post #16 of 21 (permalink) Old 02-20-2009, 06:41 PM
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Agreed, didn't I say that before?.
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post #17 of 21 (permalink) Old 02-20-2009, 06:56 PM
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Yup. Kinda hard to control billions of hungry people.

China’s Decline and its Dangers in 09 The Western Experience
Ronald can do it.

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post #18 of 21 (permalink) Old 02-21-2009, 01:22 AM
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Where was this Hillary last year ?

Quote:
Ms Clinton stressed the need for the two countries to work together to solve global problems.

"Both of us are seeking ways to deepen and broaden that relationship," she said.

"So we discussed matters of bilateral concern but we also spent a great deal of time on the array of global problems that China and the United States face together and that we can work together to solve."

Ms Clinton says joint action by the two powers will aid world recovery.

"We have to look inward for solutions, but we must also look to each other to take a leadership role in designing and implementing a coordinated global response to stabilise the world's economy and begin recovery," she said.
Clinton calls for China's cooperation in financial crisis - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation)
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post #19 of 21 (permalink) Old 02-21-2009, 02:07 AM
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How about this one?

The US Secretary of State has said the United States and China can pull the world out of economic crisis by working together. Skip related content
Related photos / videos 'China and US can lead world recovery' Enlarge photo More photos: US Presidential Election

During her first visit as secretary of state to China, Hillary Clinton also made it clear that this took precedence over US concerns about human rights in China.

Mrs Clinton took a softer line on Chinese political and religious freedoms than in a 1995 Beijing speech in which she openly criticised the Chinese government's human rights record.

Speaking at a conference with Chinese Foreign Minister Yang Jiechi, Mrs Clinton said the two would have "frank discussions on issues where we have disagreements, including human rights, Tibet, religious freedom and freedom of expression".

However, she suggested their joint efforts to spur growth in the face of the global financial crisis, to curb global climate change and to address security challenges like North Korea's nuclear weapons program came first.

"World events have given us a full and formidable agenda," she said.

"As we tackle it, the United States is committed to pursuing a positive, cooperative relationship with China, one that we believe is important to future peace, progress and prosperity for both countries and for the world."

Making her final stop on a one-week Asian trip that has also taken her to Tokyo, Jakarta and Seoul, Mrs Clinton has stressed how intertwined the US and Chinese economies are.

The United States is one of the largest buyers of Chinese exports while China, with foreign exchange reserves of about $2 trillion (£1.39tn), is the world's largest holder of US government debt.

"I appreciate greatly the Chinese government's continuing confidence in United States Treasuries. I think that's a well grounded confidence," Mrs Clinton said.

"We have every reason to believe that the United States and China will recover and that together we will help to lead the world recovery."

ERIC.

___________________________________________
"I am enclosing two tickets to the first night of my new play; bring a friend, if you have one."
- George Bernard Shaw to Winston Churchill.

"Cannot possibly attend first night, will attend second ... if there is one."
- Winston Churchill, in response.
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post #20 of 21 (permalink) Old 02-23-2009, 03:41 PM Thread Starter
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How about this one?
I wonder if she should keep her mouth shut? Today's headline is a tad more menacing.
Clinton urges China to keep buying U.S. debt
Reports: On first state visit, Clinton highlights U.S.-China interdependence
By MarketWatch
Last update: 4:29 p.m. EST Feb. 22, 2009

SAN FRANCISCO (MarketWatch) -- Secretary of State Hillary Clinton wrapped up a state visit to China Sunday by urging her hosts to continue to invest in U.S. Treasury instruments and underscoring the two countries' interdependence, according to published reports.

"It would not be in China's interest if we were unable to get our economy moving again," Clinton said in an interview with a Chinese television journalist, according to reports.

"So by continuing to support American Treasury instruments, the Chinese are recognizing our interconnection. We are truly going to rise or fall together," she said.

http://www.marketwatch.com/news/story/clinton-urges-china-keep-buying/story.aspx?guid={932380C9-EAF6-47A2-B96C-387AD775F1AD}&dist=msr_4
IOW, maybe we are going down, but we'll be sure to drag you down with us
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