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post #101 of 222 (permalink) Old 12-30-2008, 07:18 AM
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Originally Posted by Cancer_Researcher View Post
Fast55, and why do you think this is? It is because the blood of the Arabs is equally on our hands. We support the most racist and violent country on the planet that has no clue as to the value of human life or human dignity. This I find appalling as this group of people should be the ones to understand it the most because so many of them were murdered and they have historically been kick out of every country they have ever inhabited And if the past is the best prediction of the future, then I see that occurring again. I doubt that in our life time Israel will remain. You can't commit crimes like these and not expect to get some payback either by your fellow man or God, if you believe one exists. WE, the USA arm this country with weapons of mass destruction which they use against children who have only stones to throw back and you wonder why your country of origin makes you and me a target? Come on, I thought I was have a good healthy debate with a fellow educated person.
Are you sure you're not talking about Arab/Muslim countries of the world? I mean really, you think it's OK for some Islamic fanatic to even entertain the thought of murdering me or my family over what my country has done to theirs? Is that acceptable payback? Instead of asking why I think this is, why don't you ask why the same isn't true for Arabic looking people walking around here? I mean, I'm still pretty pissed off about 9-11, but I'm not looking to cancel the first Muslim I run into.

*This paragraph is for you Dave.

This fucked up mentality is what is keeping the Muslim world in the dark ages. You bring up the "score" being so heavily in favor of Israel that it becomes "proof" (unlike Hamas with the stated goal of genocide) that Israel is trying to wipe out the Palestinians. If in this last "cease fire" period that Hamas ignored, only 10 Iraelis had been killed, would it have been acceptable for the IDF to have carefully killed only 10 Palestinians? Even now, Israel is supplying most of the power to Gaza and is still rolling in supply trucks? Is that just for the news? It's impossible to debate someone who does not respond logically.

Tell us, what is point or goal of these rocket attacks on Israel? Do you think indiscriminate killing of civilians (in any number) is going to get Israel to walk away from any disputed land? Will it tend to help or hurt the flow of people and services? Would it help or hurt to have Hamas ACTUALLY agree to and adhere to, a cease fire?

I've always said, if what you're doing isn't working for you, try something else.
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post #102 of 222 (permalink) Old 12-30-2008, 07:31 AM
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Is it true that Bernie Madoff was placed in to position by the Palestinians to cause financial havoc in the Jewish community?
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post #103 of 222 (permalink) Old 12-30-2008, 07:57 AM
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Jesus. And here I was arguing with you in good faith! You believe we have "equally arm(ed) both sides with the same types and amounts of weapons"?

You appear to be totally detached from reality.
Let me clarify. We haven't armed the Palestinians, but Egypt is the largest recepient of US military aid, Saudi Arabia and Jordon purchase billions in US hardware, and Iraq now has an army outfitted by the US taxpayer. Spreading death is the only industry the US leads in, and our primary export market is the Middle East. If the Palestinians got their act together, they could probably get some of the good stuff too, but my guess is they are getting plenty of small arms thru the other Arab parties. It should be a nice war.

Recall that earlier generations faced down fascism and communism not just with missiles and tanks, but with sturdy alliances and enduring convictions. They understood that our power alone cannot protect us, nor does it entitle us to do as we please. Instead, they knew that our power grows through its prudent use; our security emanates from the justness of our cause, the force of our example, the tempering qualities of humility and restraint.

-President Barack Obama, 1st Inaugural address
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post #104 of 222 (permalink) Old 12-30-2008, 08:00 AM
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You need to familiarize yourself with the Saudi Proposal of 2002, among other things. Here's a start:
BBC NEWS | World | Middle East | Text: Arab peace plan of 2002
I am more than familiar with the Saudi peace proposal. Why have the Palestinians rejected it?

Recall that earlier generations faced down fascism and communism not just with missiles and tanks, but with sturdy alliances and enduring convictions. They understood that our power alone cannot protect us, nor does it entitle us to do as we please. Instead, they knew that our power grows through its prudent use; our security emanates from the justness of our cause, the force of our example, the tempering qualities of humility and restraint.

-President Barack Obama, 1st Inaugural address
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post #105 of 222 (permalink) Old 12-30-2008, 08:08 AM
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Originally Posted by Fast55 View Post
Are you sure you're not talking about Arab/Muslim countries of the world? I mean really, you think it's OK for some Islamic fanatic to even entertain the thought of murdering me or my family over what my country has done to theirs? Is that acceptable payback? Instead of asking why I think this is, why don't you ask why the same isn't true for Arabic looking people walking around here? I mean, I'm still pretty pissed off about 9-11, but I'm not looking to cancel the first Muslim I run into.

*This paragraph is for you Dave.

This fucked up mentality is what is keeping the Muslim world in the dark ages. You bring up the "score" being so heavily in favor of Israel that it becomes "proof" (unlike Hamas with the stated goal of genocide) that Israel is trying to wipe out the Palestinians. If in this last "cease fire" period that Hamas ignored, only 10 Iraelis had been killed, would it have been acceptable for the IDF to have carefully killed only 10 Palestinians? Even now, Israel is supplying most of the power to Gaza and is still rolling in supply trucks? Is that just for the news? It's impossible to debate someone who does not respond logically.

Tell us, what is point or goal of these rocket attacks on Israel? Do you think indiscriminate killing of civilians (in any number) is going to get Israel to walk away from any disputed land? Will it tend to help or hurt the flow of people and services? Would it help or hurt to have Hamas ACTUALLY agree to and adhere to, a cease fire?

I've always said, if what you're doing isn't working for you, try something else.
Exactly. But not only that, the indescriminate rocket attacks are coming from a place that is under total rule of Hamas, and their actions show that the idea of a 'two-state' solution to the problem is impossible as long as they are part of the equation. There are now two de facto states, and one of them has fired 3,000 rockets into it's neighbor's civilian populations, showing they are incapable of even making an attempt to live in peace. Who wants to enlarge a state like that? The only solution for Israel to the rocket attacks is to take the territory the rockets are being fired from and kill the bastards who think indescriminate murder is somehow a way to bring peace. Until the Palestinian people realize that voting in murderers to run their country will only result in their own selves being eligible for murder, nothing will change, and while the cost of war is terrible, it may do them some good in the long run to pay a terrible price for their rocket attacks and suicide bombings, and by voting in the perpertrators to high government office, the Palestinian people have willing made themselves legitimate targets, they are accomplices and assenters to murder.

I lost any sympathy I had for these cocksuckers when they danced in the streets celebrating the 9-11 attacks on the United States. Peace-loving resistance fighters my ass, these are hopeless fanatics who think the only solution to their problems is to blow up buses full of kids and fire rockets randomly into cities as they advocate the total destruction of a neighboring state. I hope the Israelis give them everything they've been asking for.

Recall that earlier generations faced down fascism and communism not just with missiles and tanks, but with sturdy alliances and enduring convictions. They understood that our power alone cannot protect us, nor does it entitle us to do as we please. Instead, they knew that our power grows through its prudent use; our security emanates from the justness of our cause, the force of our example, the tempering qualities of humility and restraint.

-President Barack Obama, 1st Inaugural address

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post #106 of 222 (permalink) Old 12-30-2008, 08:13 AM
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So obviously you're an advocate for the status quo, which as we've all seen has worked so well in the past to quell violence and promote stability. Israel is just sowing the seeds of its own destruction by continually perpetrating these atrocities.
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post #107 of 222 (permalink) Old 12-30-2008, 08:21 AM
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They had a chance to stop it in 2000, but they refused to sign the Camp David Accords, which would have put 95% of the occupied lands back into their hands. Tough shit if that's not working out for them, they made their choice.

Recall that earlier generations faced down fascism and communism not just with missiles and tanks, but with sturdy alliances and enduring convictions. They understood that our power alone cannot protect us, nor does it entitle us to do as we please. Instead, they knew that our power grows through its prudent use; our security emanates from the justness of our cause, the force of our example, the tempering qualities of humility and restraint.

-President Barack Obama, 1st Inaugural address
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post #108 of 222 (permalink) Old 12-30-2008, 08:22 AM
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Just a couple of additional facts: Since the rule of King George and his court, the Isreali government have increased the new settlements by 45%. Our aid package to them, mostly military has grown by 50%. If you think our Real Estate problem is bad, try being a Palestinian since WWII.
+1.........
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post #109 of 222 (permalink) Old 12-30-2008, 08:22 AM
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So obviously you're an advocate for the status quo, which as we've all seen has worked so well in the past to quell violence and promote stability. Israel is just sowing the seeds of its own destruction by continually perpetrating these atrocities.
How do you purpose the Israelis change the status quo? Perhaps you would like them to paint bullseyes on the backs of their children, would that help? Or they could wave red flags, and shout "Over here! Over here!" to the rocketeers? Which would help more? And the illogicality of your statements about sowing their own seeds of destruction - tell me what is the official position of Hamas and Hezbollah on the destruction of Israel?

Recall that earlier generations faced down fascism and communism not just with missiles and tanks, but with sturdy alliances and enduring convictions. They understood that our power alone cannot protect us, nor does it entitle us to do as we please. Instead, they knew that our power grows through its prudent use; our security emanates from the justness of our cause, the force of our example, the tempering qualities of humility and restraint.

-President Barack Obama, 1st Inaugural address

Last edited by FeelTheLove; 12-30-2008 at 08:25 AM.
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post #110 of 222 (permalink) Old 12-30-2008, 08:25 AM
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They had a chance to stop it in 2000, but they refused to sign the Camp David Accords, which would have put 95% of the occupied lands back into their hands. Tough shit if that's not working out for them, they made their choice.

Did you send in your application for being part of Clinton's team for bringing peace to the Middle East.........
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