How GM screwed us! Will never buy again from big 3 - Page 2 - Mercedes-Benz Forum

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post #11 of 101 (permalink) Old 12-10-2008, 09:40 AM
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Have I mentioned that I don't trust mechanics? (dealers, independents)
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post #12 of 101 (permalink) Old 12-10-2008, 09:42 AM
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Originally Posted by BadBenz94 View Post
You should be able to buy a reman unit for less than a "new" unit. You could call up any dealership and they should be able to give you prices on both.

At Honda, they told us that "new" ones were not available at the time because they were being used for new production cars. Not a big deal as the radio looked as good as new and had the same warranty.
Oh wow Honda offered you a choice... let me be more precise: they disclosed what they will be doing. Now frankly, do you expect GM to do the same?
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post #13 of 101 (permalink) Old 12-10-2008, 09:46 AM
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Wow, Soddy-Daisy is a real place

Saturn owners hope GM doesn't abandon them

SODDY-DAISY, Tennessee (CNN) -- Kat Koonce loves her Saturns. She owns three, and has pictures of them on Saturnfans.com, where she is one of almost 2,500 Saturn devotees who've posted photo albums of their vehicles. Judy Pearson shows off a photo album of her Saturn Sky roadster the way a grandmother might show off one of her grandchildren -- pictures of vacations and happy times together.

The women are exactly the kind of customers General Motors was looking for when it introduced the Saturn brand two decades ago as "a different kind of car company." The brand's slogan is now one word -- "rethink" -- but its fate may soon be summed up in another -- "done."

General Motors has raised the prospect of eliminating the nameplate as it tries to restructure to regain profitability.

"I just can't stand the thought of them doing away with Saturn," said Dianne Pollard of Hixson, Tennessee. She created the Sky Club of Chattanooga, dedicated to the sporty two-seater.

General Motors hasn't officially announced the end of Saturn, but in a restructuring plan submitted to Congress, the automaker said it would concentrate resources on four core brands -- Chevrolet, Cadillac, Buick and GMC. That leaves Saturn, along with GM's Pontiac, Saab and Hummer brands, with a dim future.

Pollard drove her black 2008 RedLine (that's Saturn's name for a turbo) Sky in Sunday's Christmas parade in Soddy-Daisy, Tennessee, northeast of Chattanooga. Fellow Hixson residents and Sky devotees Connie Terrell (red 2007 RedLine) and Pearson (dark blue 2007 standard edition) were there, too.

All three have owned other, more sedate Saturns than the Sky, which Edmunds.com praises for "sharp styling, low price and everyday comfort" and Car and Driver.com calls a "mini-Corvette" at around half the price.

They were joined by George and Brenda Holloway, who drove their 2007 Sky almost 100 miles from their farm in Centre, Alabama, to join in the parade.

"We thoroughly enjoy the Saturn. Our next vehicle, when we buy one, will be a Saturn," Brenda Holloway said.

"This is the only car I've ever owned that you can be driving down the interstate and people pull up beside you and take a picture of it," her husband, a retired 20-year Army veteran, said with amusement-tinged pride.

But it's not just the cars -- including the original S series sedans and coupes -- that turn people into "Saturnistas"; it's also the pleasant buying experience and over-the-top customer service.

"It's a family. It's the Saturn family. And you become part of that family," Pearson said.

All three Sky owners from Hixson had stories to tell about a sales consultant who went the extra mile or a service call that exceeded their expectations. Pearson said she has owned many makes of cars, including foreign nameplates, and Saturn's treatment of customers beats them all.

"The best experience I've ever had was with Saturn, bar none," she said.

Koonce, of Dayton, Ohio, used to feel that way, too. But Koonce now says GM might as well kill off the brand, because that would be preferable to the slow death she sees as inevitable. Saturn sold slightly more than 8,000 cars in November and has delivered about 175,000 this year. That's a far cry from the half a million GM had hoped to sell each year when it introduced Saturn.

Koonce said she fell in love with Saturn before she was old enough to drive. She became such a familiar figure at her local Saturn dealer and so knowledgeable about its lineup that she was hired as a sales consultant.

She and her husband, Nick, met at a Saturn owners' event, their wedding was a Saturn owners' event, and they have owned six Saturns between them. They have brought numerous relatives and friends "into the Saturn cult," said Nick, whose dream is to own a Saturn dealership.

Saturn sales
November 2008 deliveries: 8,130
November 2007 deliveries: 15,105
Change: down 46.2%
2008 Jan.-Nov. deliveries: 175,434
2007 Jan.-Nov. deliveries: 221,895
Change: down 20.9%


Source: Saturn Corp.

Saturn was conceived in the early 1980s as a separate-standing division of GM, with then-unheard-of features:

• an innovative new plant in Spring Hill, Tennessee;

• a separate agreement with the United Auto Workers that embraced more teamwork between union and management;

• the use of plastics instead of metal for many body parts;

• and a highly personalized consumer experience, including no-haggle buying and "Homecomings," a sort of family reunion for Saturn owners at the Spring Hill campus.

The first Saturn came off the Spring Hill assembly line on July 30, 1990.

Unfortunately, Kat Koonce said, GM has abandoned what made Saturn different. The cars are now made of metal, and the models all have twins in other GM divisions. Even the original Spring Hill factory has been converted to build Chevrolets instead of Saturns; the Saturn VUE is built in Mexico.

So disillusioned was Koonce that she quit her job at the Saturn dealership and went back to college.

"It was a success that became a failure," she said.

Walter S. McManus, the head of the Automotive Analysis Division of the University of Michigan Transportation Research Institute, says he could see it coming.

"Brand loyalty is overrated," McManus stated flatly. "It is costly to do all the fuzzies, and Saturn's example is clear that it doesn't pay off for what is essentially an economy-car company. Women especially appreciated the Saturn way, but Honda sells more cars to women, despite having a less female-friendly approach."
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Don't tell that to Charlie Eickmeyer, who runs the Saturnfans Web site and has posted a "Save Saturn" petition for the site's 35,000 members to sign. And don't tell the Sky Club of Chattanooga.

"I think Saturn really is a different kind of car company, and that is what has brought me back to them," Pearson said.
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post #14 of 101 (permalink) Old 12-10-2008, 09:49 AM
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Oh wow Honda offered you a choice... let me be more precise: they disclosed what they will be doing. Now frankly, do you expect GM to do the same?

I know we disclosed it at Chrysler, Im sure most GM dealerships would too. Maybe it was just the one he went to. From what I know having worked in the dealerships, radios were the only thing all manufactures installed reman in a new car under warranty. Everything else was a new item.

My Car WOO HOO...... Now SOLD
New car.... 2001 Jaguar XJR!!!!

When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.
Thomas Jefferson
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post #15 of 101 (permalink) Old 12-10-2008, 09:50 AM
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The only GM car worth saving is the impractical Corvette. Oh, GM should step away from customer service, financing and managing anything beyond manufacturing. A new model for distribution, sales, maintenance and supplies the "bail out" should address.
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post #16 of 101 (permalink) Old 12-10-2008, 09:52 AM
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Have I mentioned that I don't trust mechanics? (dealers, independents)
Because so many cheat their cutomers, mostly indys, but I have heard of a few new car dealerships doing the same. It is important to get a good recommendation and to talk to the owners and mechanics before you have your car worked on. Once you find someone you trust, the relationship will be good for life or until they retire. I know a few great shops and recommend them regularly.

My Car WOO HOO...... Now SOLD
New car.... 2001 Jaguar XJR!!!!

When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.
Thomas Jefferson
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post #17 of 101 (permalink) Old 12-10-2008, 10:02 AM
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Originally Posted by BadBenz94 View Post
I know we disclosed it at Chrysler, Im sure most GM dealerships would too. Maybe it was just the one he went to. From what I know having worked in the dealerships, radios were the only thing all manufactures installed reman in a new car under warranty. Everything else was a new item.
ehem, Chrysler wanted to install a reman transmission in the Voyager while it was under warranty. Oh, that van went through THREE transmissions in less than 130K miles and two blown engines. You tell me how I keep my 560SEL for 300K miles purring like a kitten if I am the kind that would neglect a vehicle? American cars are worth shit if you ask me, I have no problem saying it because that van was not the only POS American crap I had bought.
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post #18 of 101 (permalink) Old 12-10-2008, 10:08 AM
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Originally Posted by BadBenz94 View Post
Because so many cheat their cutomers, mostly indys, but I have heard of a few new car dealerships doing the same. It is important to get a good recommendation and to talk to the owners and mechanics before you have your car worked on. Once you find someone you trust, the relationship will be good for life or until they retire. I know a few great shops and recommend them regularly.
The only reason my 560 SEL has 300K is because I work on it myself. I would never allow an idiot to touch it even if at first it seems like I wouldn't be able to handle it. I always find a way to fix shit.
The only reason I am having problems with my 190E for example is simply because I just got it and I am dealing with the neglect from PO and his mechanic/dealer. Again. once I get the car stabilized there is no way in hell I would take it to a mechanic. This is the MAIN reason I buy 80s Mercedes, so I can work on them.
Here is a good example: My Rx7 has 160K miles since 1987 and was never taken to a mechanic, ever. Even for paint!
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post #19 of 101 (permalink) Old 12-10-2008, 10:14 AM
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ehem, Chrysler wanted to install a reman transmission in the Voyager while it was under warranty. Oh, that van went through THREE transmissions in less than 130K miles and two blown engines. You tell me how I keep my 560SEL for 300K miles purring like a kitten if I am the kind that would neglect a vehicle? American cars are worth shit if you ask me, I have no problem saying it because that van was not the only POS American crap I had bought.

Yeah your Mercedes was built when Mercedes stood for quality. Bet you cant get that mileage from ANY newer Mercedes. My W124 had 250k when I sold it and its still going strong, but it had its aliments as well, new wiring harness, head gasket, transmission and front end components, but the body, chassis, engine and interior held up great!!!

My Car WOO HOO...... Now SOLD
New car.... 2001 Jaguar XJR!!!!

When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.
Thomas Jefferson
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post #20 of 101 (permalink) Old 12-10-2008, 10:18 AM
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Yeah your Mercedes was built when Mercedes stood for quality. Bet you cant get that mileage from ANY newer Mercedes. My W124 had 250k when I sold it and its still going strong, but it had its aliments as well, new wiring harness, head gasket, transmission and front end components, but the body, chassis, engine and interior held up great!!!
Those issues are expected and I have learned to do them myself. Yes, I would be hesitant to buy a newer Mercedes but it will still be better than a GM, Ford or Chrysler by a long shot.
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