Ron Paul's Message to Obama - Page 2 - Mercedes-Benz Forum

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post #11 of 30 (permalink) Old 11-10-2008, 05:44 PM
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post #12 of 30 (permalink) Old 11-10-2008, 08:11 PM
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Originally Posted by GermanStar View Post
Your hard left-wing bias is showing again. Obama is a corporate whore, else he would have never attained the position of POTUS in the first place. He is not about (important) change at all, he is all about business as usual. Listen to the radio interview from the link in the second post. Just wait and see, there's an "I told you so" in your future.

Your rants about Paul are no different than the rants of the right toward Obama. It seems we all hear what we want to hear and ignore the rest. No one was more concise in regard to the problems facing our nation and the avenues we must take to circumvent them than Dr. Paul. He says "do less", and you hear "do nothing".
Ron Paul differs from Obama in that Ron Paul is willing to fail, over and over, all the while accomplishing nothing but being made out to look like a radical fringe element leader, and Obama is not. Now, that is pretty harsh, I realize. But examine his discussion of Obama in the interview.

Ron Paul is essentially not willing to be a politician, at the level needed to win. He is willing to make a series of issues he will never get enacted should he be appointed by God as POTUS tomorrow the reasons he never gets more than 10% of the voters behind him. So, how right or wrong he may be is never actually the issue - he takes himself out of contention by making "getting rid of the Federal Bank" as important as getting out of Iraq. A more competent politician, not to be confused with more intelligent or honest or earnest human, would carve out a position on issues that can let him win, while leaving the more controversial issues in a light of requiring further study to decide them.

It is like the difference between Obama and Clinton - Obama wanted to win with a chance after the battle of getting his defeated candidate's supporters to enlist in the cause. It was always this view of "after you win what are you left with to make things happen" that prevented Obama from being on the attack, and distinguished him. Clinton wanted a battle to win, and fuck the consequences, it was only about winning the fight! Well, Obama doesn't see Ron Paul's "all or nothing" approach as the be-all and end-all. Obama sees getting into office as more important than jamming all his positions down everyone's throat along the way.

In the end, Ron Paul would be more effective to be more like Obama. That ain't happening though. So, he might be more effective to find a role in Obama's administration or try to get Obama to study, and when the time is right, adopt some of Ron Paul's ideas. It should be apparent by now that if the idea is good Obama won't mind adopting it unless that means sacrificing everyone else's ideas.

Jim
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post #13 of 30 (permalink) Old 11-10-2008, 08:19 PM
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I don't want a politician. The necessary baggage to achieve in this environment I find debilitating.
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post #14 of 30 (permalink) Old 11-10-2008, 08:32 PM
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I don't want a politician. The necessary baggage to achieve in this environment I find debilitating.
I am not advocating politicians - but in the world we live in politics is full of them, just like my precious car has to drive on roads with potholes - I could leave it in the garage and avoid them, but then I don't get to drive it... And, while Obama is a good political politician, I think we will find his true capability is as the CEO. He is not proclaiming to be "The Fucking Oracle." He is trying to set an agenda that is both a course correction and achievable. The "achievable" element requires that "we the people" buy in under his methods instead of "you the people, bend over, here comes old one eye!" If you want some of Ron Paul's agenda, make it achievable and you might get Obama to adopt it. If you leave it unachievable and running down the path will trash the rest of the "achievable" agenda, you don't have a chance. I am not opposed to that thinking and see it as true, "Change We Need" relative to the assault by "old one eye" without any debate or even discussion. Jim
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post #15 of 30 (permalink) Old 11-10-2008, 08:36 PM
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I am not advocating politicians - but in the world we live in politics is full of them, just like my precious car has to drive on roads with potholes - I could leave it in the garage and avoid them, but then I don't get to drive it... And, while Obama is a good political politician, I think we will find his true capability is as the CEO. He is not proclaiming to be "The Fucking Oracle." He is trying to set an agenda that is both a course correction and achievable. The "achievable" element requires that "we the people" buy in under his methods instead of "you the people, bend over, here comes old one eye!" If you want some of Ron Paul's agenda, make it achievable and you might get Obama to adopt it. If you leave it unachievable and running down the path will trash the rest of the "achievable" agenda, you don't have a chance. I am not opposed to that thinking and see it as true, "Change We Need" relative to the assault by "old one eye" without any debate or even discussion. Jim
Agreed. Also agreed that we are fucked until public education stops being taught by minimum wage.
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post #16 of 30 (permalink) Old 11-11-2008, 10:43 PM
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I think much of the change that Obama has to offer is "away from Bush". That is simple and easy enough to address most of. Some of the deeper part of the change will be difficult with the economy blowing like it does right now but the hardcore change of direction is very simple and easy.

Away from Neoconservative policies and Inclusive of ALL Americans. That is change that is not so hard to believe will not happen.
Shifting from NeoCon politics to Obama politics is like stepping out of a hurricane into the path of a tornado.

Anyone notice how Ron Paul's campaign was almost completely ignored by the controlled media? The powers in charge wanted to make sure he fizzled away fast. Wonder why?
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post #17 of 30 (permalink) Old 11-11-2008, 11:13 PM
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Originally Posted by CLK Operator View Post
Shifting from NeoCon politics to Obama politics is like stepping out of a hurricane into the path of a tornado.

Anyone notice how Ron Paul's campaign was almost completely ignored by the controlled media? The powers in charge wanted to make sure he fizzled away fast. Wonder why?
No, I don't wonder why. I used to but then I did the research and understand why he was not given as much air time as some of the others.

As for stepping out of a hurricane into the path of a tornado, I can live with that if that's the best analogy you can come up with. A hurricane is a long lasting churning mass of disaster that wreaks havoc over very large masses, impacting thousands and millions.

A tornado, while life changing for those very few that it hits, is a very brief, tight, narrow focused event, usually lasting minutes while that hurricane can last for days or weeks.

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Being smart is knowing the difference, in a sticky situation between a well delivered anecdote and a well delivered antidote - bear.
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post #18 of 30 (permalink) Old 11-12-2008, 09:39 AM
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Originally Posted by CLK Operator View Post
Shifting from NeoCon politics to Obama politics is like stepping out of a hurricane into the path of a tornado.

Anyone notice how Ron Paul's campaign was almost completely ignored by the controlled media? The powers in charge wanted to make sure he fizzled away fast. Wonder why?
You mean the Republicans? None of them paid any attention.

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post #19 of 30 (permalink) Old 11-12-2008, 09:47 AM Thread Starter
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Such hyper-partisanship. The same embarrassing scenario played out on both sides. In fact, I'll argue that the Dem's treatment of Dennis Kucinich was far worse than GOP treatment of Paul, if only because of Dr. Paul's fund raising abilities. Laugh off Kucinich all you want, he was the Dem's answer to Ron Paul, and an intellectual giant in a race of corporate clowns.

The corporate media did all it could to marginalize and ridicule the only two candidates in the race who supported dissolution of power, because they were perceived as threats.

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post #20 of 30 (permalink) Old 11-12-2008, 10:10 AM
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Originally Posted by GermanStar View Post
Such hyper-partisanship. The same embarrassing scenario played out on both sides. In fact, I'll argue that the Dem's treatment of Dennis Kucinich was far worse than GOP treatment of Paul, if only because of Dr. Paul's fund raising abilities. Laugh off Kucinich all you want, he was the Dem's answer to Ron Paul, and an intellectual giant in a race of corporate clowns.

The corporate media did all they could to marginalize and ridicule the only two candidates in the race who supported dissolution of power, because they were perceived as threats.
I agree with that. Each party has it's black sheep, and they try hard to marginalize them, and that includes getting the media to play it's part.

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