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post #11 of 63 (permalink) Old 09-14-2008, 08:17 PM
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post #12 of 63 (permalink) Old 09-14-2008, 08:52 PM
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That's interesting and all, but...

1) Joe Biden isn't running for President; your concerns about HIM taking your money amount to hysteria.
What I'm saying here is that this Democratic ticket wants to raise taxes in order to fund more programs. Now, if Obama were to say he wanted to raise taxes and CUT programs in order to balance the budget and pay off the national debt, this Republican would actually vote for him in a heartbeat, despite the other ideas I disagree with him about. I'm still waiting for the day a politician from either major party is willing to speak out in favor of such an unpopular idea.

Overall, I don't think anyone here should look towards Washington D.C, for their happiness. Government is NOT our provider. WE are our own providers. We who are able to work, should be working for a living, instead of living off of the government. We should be saving money for our retirement, not expecting Social Security to take care of us. We who have money should freely give to others in the way we choose, rather than government taking it and deciding it for us. We the people have the right to bear arms and protect our families and property, rather than depending on the police to do it for us.

Your point is well taken regarding Congress. But having a relatively Pro-Gun Mccain in office lessens the chance of more onerous gun control measures being put into place vs. the anti-gun Obama. I really believe that gun control issues, and unfortunately race, are the main reason Obama is not dominating in the polls. I've read that in today's political climate a "generic" Democratic candidate should have a 14 point lead over a "generic" Republican candidate. Having Obama on the ticket, who is from one of the most anti-gun areas in the country is a problem for dems. There are only 2 states in the USA that don't allow Conceal and carry permits, Illinois and Wisconsin. If the Dems had a candidate from the South, or even the west, I think this election would have been over long ago.

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post #13 of 63 (permalink) Old 09-14-2008, 08:55 PM
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What I'm saying here is that this Democratic ticket wants to raise taxes in order to fund more programs. Now, if Obama were to say he wanted to raise taxes and CUT programs in order to balance the budget and pay off the national debt, this Republican would actually vote for him in a heartbeat, despite the other ideas I disagree with him about. I'm still waiting for the day a politician from either major party is willing to speak out in favor of such an unpopular idea.

Overall, I don't think anyone here should look towards Washington D.C, for their happiness. Government is NOT our provider. WE are our own providers. We who are able to work, should be working for a living, instead of living off of the governement. We should be saving money for our retirement, not expecting Social Security to take care of us. We who have money should freely give to others in the way we choose, rather than government taking it and deciding it for us. We the people have the right to bear arms and protect our families and property, rather than depending on the police to do it for us.

Your point is well taken regarding Congress. But having a relatively Pro-Gun Mccain in office lessens the chance of more onerous gun control measures into place vs. the anti-gun Obama. I really believe that gun control issues, and unfortunately race, are the main reason Obama is not dominating in the polls. I've read that in today's political climate a "generic" Democratic candidate should have a 14 point lead over a "generic" Republican candidate. Having Obama on the ticket, who is from one of the most anti-gun areas in the country is a problem for dems. There are only 2 states in the USA that don't allow Conceal and carry permits, Illinois and Wisconsin. If the Dems had a candidate from the South, or even the west, I think this election would have been over long ago.
Keep chewing on this fact - neither McCain nor Obama can take or protect your guns by themselves.

Everything a Presidential candidate tells you he can do, outside of controlling the military, is an embellishment. It has an asterisk by it. The asterisk says "with help of a willing congress". That's just the way it works.

Spend the next few days or so reading up on both candidates with those glasses on, then get back to us.

Incidentally, I'm a Republican. A real one, not one of these Neocon poseurs that have ridden on Ralph Reed's cock straight to the wheelhouse of our party; one who's actually a conservative at heart.

And anyway, do you really think that our 2nd amendment rights (in which I firmly believe) is the most important thing we need our leaders in Washington to address? In Springfield fucking Missouri???!?
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post #14 of 63 (permalink) Old 09-14-2008, 09:13 PM
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And anyway, do you really think that our 2nd amendment rights (in which I firmly believe) is the most important thing we need our leaders in Washington to address? In Springfield fucking Missouri???!?

Actually, that is the only thing I care about. I don't want to see the assault weapons ban come back into place. If Obama is elected, and it comes to his desk, it is a virtual certainty he will sign for the ban. All you hear about is the economy. Well, it's a FREE MARKET economy, and the government needs to leave their hands off of it. Let these idiots who bought houses they couldn't afford fall on their faces. Let the banks who allowed these bad loans go through pay the price for it. The taxpayer shouldn't. Government is not going to get gas prices to change either. So really in the end, all I care about is my 2nd amendment rights.

And note, this is not a Washington issue, but in Springfield f*cking Missouri we have only had the right to carry for about 5 years now. And we barely got it into place with a veto override of our Democratic governor in 2003.

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post #15 of 63 (permalink) Old 09-14-2008, 09:36 PM
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Actually, that is the only thing I care about. I don't want to see the assault weapons ban come back into place. If Obama is elected, and it comes to his desk, it is a virtual certainty he will sign for the ban. All you hear about is the economy. Well, it's a FREE MARKET economy, and the government needs to leave their hands off of it. Let these idiots who bought houses they couldn't afford fall on their faces. Let the banks who allowed these bad loans go through pay the price for it. The taxpayer shouldn't. Government is not going to get gas prices to change either. So really in the end, all I care about is my 2nd amendment rights.

And note, this is not a Washington issue, but in Springfield f*cking Missouri we have only had the right to carry for about 5 years now. And we barely got it into place with a veto override of our Democratic governor in 2003.
Next time just cut to the chase and spare us about your knowledge of the rich and how they got there and why Biden is tightwad.
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post #16 of 63 (permalink) Old 09-14-2008, 09:44 PM
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Originally Posted by rph74 View Post
Actually, that is the only thing I care about. I don't want to see the assault weapons ban come back into place. If Obama is elected, and it comes to his desk, it is a virtual certainty he will sign for the ban. All you hear about is the economy. Well, it's a FREE MARKET economy, and the government needs to leave their hands off of it. Let these idiots who bought houses they couldn't afford fall on their faces. Let the banks who allowed these bad loans go through pay the price for it. The taxpayer shouldn't. Government is not going to get gas prices to change either. So really in the end, all I care about is my 2nd amendment rights.

And note, this is not a Washington issue, but in Springfield f*cking Missouri we have only had the right to carry for about 5 years now. And we barely got it into place with a veto override of our Democratic governor in 2003.
You can live wherever you want. About 3 hours or so west of you, we have no such issues.

And the issues we have with our economy are far broader than the housing market / sub-prime loan fiasco. To put your 2nd amendment rights at the top of your list of priorities reinforces the argument Obama was making (intentionally or otherwise).

Maybe bl1 would like to chime in here and help you out...
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post #17 of 63 (permalink) Old 09-15-2008, 07:20 AM
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Next time just cut to the chase and spare us about your knowledge of the rich and how they got there and why Biden is tightwad.
Why don't you use logical, coherent arguments, instead of liberal banter? Yes, 2nd amendment rights is #1 for me, but I felt the need to explain the rich because so many on the left characterize rich people as somehow evil, when they really are for the most part average people who lived outside of the mainstream. It irks me when I hear people complain about "rich people" when every single on of us has the chance to build wealth. But since "normal" is having car payments, a mortgage, student loans, and credit card payments, normal is broke.

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post #18 of 63 (permalink) Old 09-15-2008, 07:31 AM Thread Starter
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Why don't you use logical, coherent arguments, instead of liberal banter? I felt the need to explain the rich because so many on the left characterize rich people as somehow evil, when they really are for the most part average people who lived outside of the mainstream.
As you’ve probably noticed, the loons here will also try to control your freedom of speech.

Especially on matters they don’t found as important as you do.

For them it’s Obama or the highway!

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post #19 of 63 (permalink) Old 09-15-2008, 07:31 AM
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You can live wherever you want. About 3 hours or so west of you, we have no such issues.

And the issues we have with our economy are far broader than the housing market / sub-prime loan fiasco. To put your 2nd amendment rights at the top of your list of priorities reinforces the argument Obama was making (intentionally or otherwise).

Maybe bl1 would like to chime in here and help you out...
I guess you're in Tulsa? Nice area btw..... But anyway back to the point. What can the government do to fix the economy? Government "help" often exacerbates the problem. I'm just not optimistic that government can fix the ills of the economy.

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post #20 of 63 (permalink) Old 09-15-2008, 07:49 AM
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^ Well, there's two things "government" can do - which it hasn't been doing lately - to fix the economy (using your words).

1) We can spend a hell of a lot less than we have been. We're spending more than we collect in taxes - in essence, we're using a gigantic "Bank of China" credit card, and the interest payments on the $10 Trillion we owe are whoppers. As YOU would with your finances, we need to start spending less and paying that down.

2) The PRESIDENT can VETO a budget that is not balanced. The excuse being made for the budget imbalance has been TWAT (The War Against Terror). Say what you will about Obama, he's at least adult enough to recognize the difference between an actual threat (Afghanistan) and some hole in the sand daddy left un-fucked (Iraq). If/when we stop spending on credit just to pay off the cronies who got us there (Bush's cronies are big oil; Cheney's cronies are the military-industrial complex...whodathunkit?), the budget will start to look a bit healthier.

Look, the US economy is a hopelessly complex animal. We're lucky if we understand one iota of how it works. That said, there's no denying that much of what makes it run is confidence. Not only by consumers, but by lenders and financial institutions. Confidence is like air for an engine. The engine may be fine, but it's being strangled nearly to death by all of the actions we've had to endure by this absent-minded administration. The root cause of nearly every problem is one we've caused, and that we can correct - as long as a group of intelligent, rational adults are making the decisions.
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