Iraq demands Liberators-Not-Occupiers stop occupying them - Mercedes-Benz Forum

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post #1 of 12 (permalink) Old 08-25-2008, 01:26 PM Thread Starter
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Iraq demands Liberators-Not-Occupiers stop occupying them


Iraqi PM demands 'specific' U.S. pullout timelineStory Highlights
NEW: U.S. soldier dies after being shot during patrol in Baghdad

Iraqi leader says U.S. withdrawal plan cannot be "open-ended"

Negotiators agree there would be no foreign soldiers in Iraq after 2011, al-Maliki says

White House spokesman says agreement has not been finalized






BAGHDAD, Iraq (CNN) -- Iraqi Prime Minister Nuri al-Maliki said Monday there will be no agreement on a U.S. withdrawal from Iraq unless it includes a "specific" timeline and is not "open-ended."


Iraqi Prime Minister Nuri al-Maliki says the U.S. plan for withdrawing must not be "open-ended."

Speaking with tribal leaders, sheikhs and other prominent figures, al-Maliki said U.S. and Iraqi negotiators have agreed that there would be no foreign soldiers in Iraq after 2011 but that some "outstanding issues" remain, according to a statement released by his office.

One issue the two sides have been working on involves the U.S. effort to keep U.S. troops in Iraq immune from Iraqi laws.

The two sides have discussed a proposal that would lift immunity for private contractors, making them subject to Iraqi laws.

Al-Maliki's statement Monday said he "will not allow the spilling of the blood of the sons of Iraq by granting open immunity."

White House spokesman Tony Fratto, in a written statement, said discussions are continuing "as we have not yet finalized an agreement."

"Our two countries are discussing goals for when Iraqi forces can meet the security needs of their own country, enabling U.S. forces to return home," Fratto said.

He added: "We're optimistic that Iraq and the U.S. can reach a mutual agreement on flexible goals for U.S. troops to continue to return on success -- based on conditions on the ground -- and allow Iraqi forces to provide security for a sovereign Iraq."

Meanwhile, a Multi-National Division-Baghdad soldier died Monday after being shot during a patrol in northern Baghdad.

This brings the number of U.S. service member deaths in the Iraq war to 4,147.

Violence in Iraq on Sunday took at least 30 lives, officials said.

A suicide bomber struck during a party for a recently freed prisoner west of Baghdad on Sunday, killing 23 people and wounding 30 others, an Interior Ministry official said.

The bombing took place in Hawaz, about 18 miles west of Baghdad, with women and children among the dead and wounded, the official said.

The family of the prisoner -- just released from U.S. custody -- invited friends, relatives and security officials, including members of the local Awakening Council, over to celebrate, he said.

The U.S.-backed Awakening movement, made up largely of former Sunni Arab insurgents recruited to fight Islamic jihadists loyal to al Qaeda in Iraq and other militias, has been a frequent target of suicide attackers in recent months. U.S. commanders credit the movement for much of the sharp reduction in violence over the past year, though jihadists have denounced its leaders as traitors and vowed revenge.

Earlier, two roadside bombs exploded in a quick succession in central Baghdad, killing four people and wounding 14 others. One of the dead and two of the wounded were police officers, the Interior Ministry official said.

The attack happened in Baghdad's al-Nahdha commercial district. People helping those wounded by the first bomb, which exploded about 10:15 a.m. near the al-Thilal Transportation Company and a police patrol, became victims themselves when the second bomb detonated at the same location, the official said.

Most of the casualties were caused by the second blast, the official said.

And three police officers were killed when gunmen opened fire on an outdoor market in the city of Baquba on Sunday morning, a city official said. Six people, two of them police officers, also were wounded in the attack, the official said.

One of the three attackers was arrested, the official said.

Baquba, the capital of Diyala province, is located about 40 miles north of Baghdad. Last month, Iraqi security forces backed by U.S. troops launched a large-scale military operation in the province to clear it from al Qaeda in Iraq and other insurgents.

Recall that earlier generations faced down fascism and communism not just with missiles and tanks, but with sturdy alliances and enduring convictions. They understood that our power alone cannot protect us, nor does it entitle us to do as we please. Instead, they knew that our power grows through its prudent use; our security emanates from the justness of our cause, the force of our example, the tempering qualities of humility and restraint.

-President Barack Obama, 1st Inaugural address
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post #2 of 12 (permalink) Old 08-25-2008, 01:29 PM
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al-Maliki said U.S. and Iraqi negotiators have agreed that there would be no foreign soldiers in Iraq after 2011
sounds like the plan to me.



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post #3 of 12 (permalink) Old 08-25-2008, 03:51 PM
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Oh no! What happened to the 100 year cooperative occupation? Bot? Jay?
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post #4 of 12 (permalink) Old 08-25-2008, 07:58 PM
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Two lines in the article that are at least as important and will test diplomatic relations for years to come.

Quote:
The two sides have discussed a proposal that would lift immunity for private contractors, making them subject to Iraqi laws.

Al-Maliki's statement Monday said he "will not allow the spilling of the blood of the sons of Iraq by granting open immunity."
If we don't lift immunity there will never be safety for future contractors, oil company employees or Americans conducting business in Iraq in the future. Short term gain to protect Blackwater tactics will have decades of long term consequence.

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post #5 of 12 (permalink) Old 08-25-2008, 10:27 PM
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It's way to soon to argue over a document not yet finished. Maliki could be posturing for internal political purposes. BTW the end of 2011 is nearly 30 months away; way longer than BHOs plan.

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post #6 of 12 (permalink) Old 08-25-2008, 11:25 PM
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It's way to soon to argue over a document not yet finished. Maliki could be posturing for internal political purposes. BTW the end of 2011 is nearly 30 months away; way longer than BHOs plan.
As you say, document is not finished and it is a Bush plan, not an Obama plan. There is no way Bushie would provide a timetable that adhered to Obama schedules, no matter how many troops have to die during the difference.

I am as much interested in the immunity issue as the tightness of withdrawal dates. With the Bush Administration it might just be a deal breaker [although I am not sure they want to have a deal to begin with].

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post #7 of 12 (permalink) Old 08-26-2008, 07:43 AM
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It's way to soon to argue over a document not yet finished. Maliki could be posturing for internal political purposes. BTW the end of 2011 is nearly 30 months away; way longer than BHOs plan.
What's your view, would you rather we stay or we leave?
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post #8 of 12 (permalink) Old 08-26-2008, 07:55 AM Thread Starter
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It's way to soon to argue over a document not yet finished. Maliki could be posturing for internal political purposes. BTW the end of 2011 is nearly 30 months away; way longer than BHOs plan.
Hmmm.... it seems what Maliki wants is the Obama Plan, not the Bush Plan - from us Liberators-Not-Occupiers:

Al-Maliki seems impatient with U.S. on troops
Iraqi PM says deal must include ‘specific deadline’ for withdrawal



updated 11:16 a.m. CT, Mon., Aug. 25, 2008
BAGHDAD - Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki said Monday no security agreement with the United States could be reached unless it included a "specific deadline" for the withdrawal of American troops from Iraq.

Last week, U.S. and Iraqi officials said the two sides had agreed tentatively to a schedule which included a broad pullout of combat forces by the end of 2011 with a residual U.S. force remaining behind to continue training and advising the Iraqi security forces.

Those officials spoke on condition of anonymity because the text had not been approved by either government.

But al-Maliki's remarks Monday suggested that the Iraqi government is still not satisfied with that arrangement.

"There can be no treaty or agreement except on the basis of Iraq's full sovereignty," al-Maliki told a gathering of tribal sheiks. He said such an agreement must be based on the principle that "no foreign soldier remains in Iraq after a specific deadline, not an open time frame."

President Bush has long resisted a timetable for pulling out troops from Iraq, even under heavy pressure from a nation distressed by American deaths and discouraged by the length of the war that began in 2003.


But that has somewhat softened recently, with the Bush administration now speaking about "time horizons." But even "time horizons" now appears unacceptable to al-Maliki's government.

"We find this to be too vague," a close al-Maliki aide told The Associated Press on Monday. "We don't want the phrase 'time horizons.' We are not comfortable with that phrase," said the aide, who spoke on condition of anonymity because of the sensitivity of the ongoing negotiations.

Another top al-Maliki aide, also speaking on condition of anonymity for the same reason, said the Iraqi government has "stopped talking about the withdrawal of combat troops. We just talk about withdrawals," including trainers and logistics troops.


In his Monday address, al-Maliki also suggested that the question of granting immunity to U.S. military personnel or contractors continued to be a sticking point in the negotiations.

In one key part of the draft agreement, private U.S. contractors would be subject to Iraqi law but the Americans are holding firm that U.S. troops would remain subject exclusively to U.S. legal jurisdiction.

Al-Maliki said Monday that his country could not grant "open immunity" to Iraqis or foreigners because that would be tantamount to a violating the "sanctity of Iraqi blood." He did not elaborate.

Another al-Maliki aide, speaking on condition of anonymity also because of the sensitivity of the subject, said Iraq remained adamant that the last American soldier must leave Iraq by the end of 2011 — regardless of conditions at the time.

The agreement had been scheduled to be concluded by the end of last month.

No new date has been set, but the two al-Maliki aides said a final draft was now available to the political leaderships in Baghdad and Washington. One of the two said a breakthrough was not expected before next month.

Recall that earlier generations faced down fascism and communism not just with missiles and tanks, but with sturdy alliances and enduring convictions. They understood that our power alone cannot protect us, nor does it entitle us to do as we please. Instead, they knew that our power grows through its prudent use; our security emanates from the justness of our cause, the force of our example, the tempering qualities of humility and restraint.

-President Barack Obama, 1st Inaugural address
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post #9 of 12 (permalink) Old 08-26-2008, 10:11 AM Thread Starter
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Oh no! What happened to the 100 year cooperative occupation? Bot? Jay?

Recall that earlier generations faced down fascism and communism not just with missiles and tanks, but with sturdy alliances and enduring convictions. They understood that our power alone cannot protect us, nor does it entitle us to do as we please. Instead, they knew that our power grows through its prudent use; our security emanates from the justness of our cause, the force of our example, the tempering qualities of humility and restraint.

-President Barack Obama, 1st Inaugural address
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post #10 of 12 (permalink) Old 08-26-2008, 01:47 PM
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Originally Posted by FeelTheLove View Post
That absolutely covers this past eight years in one simple editorial bubble.

If he had just mentioned that he is STILL ALIVE it would have been even better.

Heck of a job, bushie!

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